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A Healer's 1.2 Grievances: The story of why healers are upset

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > PvP
A Healer's 1.2 Grievances: The story of why healers are upset

PostalTwinkie's Avatar


PostalTwinkie
04.18.2012 , 03:02 PM | #711
/points to the Elephant in the room....

All of you doing math are leaving out several very very very very important variables in your math!
  1. Activation time, channel time, of abilities.
  2. How much abilities are "knocked back" during casting, increasing activation time.
  3. Cool downs of abilities.

The problem with the numbers and scenario you have presented is that it only applies to a situation where players are basically trading blows, I hit him he hits me, nothing going on between. This isn't how fights play out, players engage and throw out everything they can as quick as the can.

Why does that matter?

Because as a healer when I am casting, even with the buff from talents, when I take damage my activation/channel on my spell is knocked back a little. Thus increasing my cast time on a given spell, effectively lowering my Healing Per Second. In reciprocate to that if I hit a Marauder who is in my face, his rate of attack isn't lowered. He isn't being effected by "Spell Knockback", thus his DPS is maintained as their primary rotation doesn't have channel abilities to knockback casting of.

Prior to 1.2 just having someone engage a healer greatly lowered their Healing Per Second, and usually completely removed them from a fight, even if they didn't die. Instead people chose to ignore us giving us free run of the field to keep our team alive. They then proceeded to QQ about how effective we were, because we were simply ignored, to the point that BioWare made these changes.

So again...

Your math is a flat value that really doesn't apply to active play because it doesn't account for DPS vs HPS as effected by spell knockback and other factors that reduce the healers ability to actually cast the spell. If I am moving, I am not busting out heals (lowering my HPS), if I am being effected by spell knockback I am not getting the heals off as quick (lowering my HPS).
Quote: Originally Posted by Blavatsky View Post
Problems of the First World.

"My Video Game Dev implements improvements to my gaming experience in a clandestine manner , this is costing me virtual money "

Dreydin's Avatar


Dreydin
04.18.2012 , 03:09 PM | #712
Quote: Originally Posted by PostalTwinkie View Post
/points to the Elephant in the room....

All of you doing math are leaving out several very very very very important variables in your math!
  1. Activation time, channel time, of abilities.
  2. How much abilities are "knocked back" during casting, increasing activation time.
  3. Cool downs of abilities.

The problem with the numbers and scenario you have presented is that it only applies to a situation where players are basically trading blows, I hit him he hits me, nothing going on between. This isn't how fights play out, players engage and throw out everything they can as quick as the can.

Why does that matter?

Because as a healer when I am casting, even with the buff from talents, when I take damage my activation/channel on my spell is knocked back a little. Thus increasing my cast time on a given spell, effectively lowering my Healing Per Second. In reciprocate to that if I hit a Marauder who is in my face, his rate of attack isn't lowered. He isn't being effected by "Spell Knockback", thus his DPS is maintained as their primary rotation doesn't have channel abilities to knockback casting of.

Prior to 1.2 just having someone engage a healer greatly lowered their Healing Per Second, and usually completely removed them from a fight, even if they didn't die. Instead people chose to ignore us giving us free run of the field to keep our team alive. They then proceeded to QQ about how effective we were, because we were simply ignored, to the point that BioWare made these changes.

So again...

Your math is a flat value that really doesn't apply to active play because it doesn't account for DPS vs HPS as effected by spell knockback and other factors that reduce the healers ability to actually cast the spell. If I am moving, I am not busting out heals (lowering my HPS), if I am being effected by spell knockback I am not getting the heals off as quick (lowering my HPS).
In one of my previous posts, this is what I was trying to get at. But because I am not proficient in math, I am not sure I worded it right. Raw stat VS raw stat comparison, seems off to me. Considering there is so MANY other factors, like mentioned above. I described it in my wording like using throughput variables in a burst situation. You might have math thats undeniable, but doesnt apply to reality.
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Gibbzter's Avatar


Gibbzter
04.18.2012 , 03:12 PM | #713
Quote: Originally Posted by Khoraji View Post
Look, i was in those "NERF HEALER" threads defending us from the idiots who said 1 DPS should be able to kill 1 healer 1v1. We should be able to heal through 1 dps without breaking our backs (not 2-3-4). And guess what, we still can.
Yep we can, just tanked one last night to be honest that didn't even try to interrupt and let me free cast like a nice guy. Player had poor gear judging from looks, hp, and saber color. Any sorc/sage can survive against bad, poorly geared players.

Dreydin's Avatar


Dreydin
04.18.2012 , 03:18 PM | #714
Quote: Originally Posted by Gibbzter View Post
Yep we can, just tanked one last night to be honest that didn't even try to interrupt and let me free cast like a nice guy. Player had poor gear judging from looks, hp, and saber color. Any sorc/sage can survive against bad, poorly geared players.
I know pre 1.2, at some points I could have 5 people hitting me, not interrupting, not hitting me for much. And it was godly. Then there was times a single dude would roll up and shut me down like nothing. Even in my overpowered state, as a Sorc healer. Now I see people in my own guild that are wearing recruit gear, and I am full BM, and I'm running away from them. Because they know how to interrupt and shut me down.

While we needed some small burst nerfs, maybe a longer cooldown on shield, and possibly some co-efficient changes. They went way too far.

My arsenal BH with crap recruit gear, now specifically hunts Sorcs, cause I can kill em so fast!
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Gibbzter's Avatar


Gibbzter
04.18.2012 , 03:24 PM | #715
Quote: Originally Posted by Dreydin View Post
I know pre 1.2, at some points I could have 5 people hitting me, not interrupting, not hitting me for much. And it was godly. Then there was times a single dude would roll up and shut me down like nothing. Even in my overpowered state, as a Sorc healer. Now I see people in my own guild that are wearing recruit gear, and I am full BM, and I'm running away from them. Because they know how to interrupt and shut me down.

While we needed some small burst nerfs, maybe a longer cooldown on shield, and possibly some co-efficient changes. They went way too far.

My arsenal BH with crap recruit gear, now specifically hunts Sorcs, cause I can kill em so fast!
I feel your pain Drey and totally agree!

PostalTwinkie's Avatar


PostalTwinkie
04.18.2012 , 03:25 PM | #716
Quote: Originally Posted by Gibbzter View Post
Yep we can, just tanked one last night to be honest that didn't even try to interrupt and let me free cast like a nice guy. Player had poor gear judging from looks, hp, and saber color. Any sorc/sage can survive against bad, poorly geared players.
Any class should be able to survive a bad player, in any game! If I am a master level Chess player I should be able to beat any bad player. But if I play another Chess master it should be relatively even, with the winner being whoever happen to be the sharpest of the two at that engagement. My point is that right now with 1.2 when a Healer is faced with a DPS of equal skill the Healer dies, not they tie each other up, the Healer just dies.

BioWares way of balancing is like trying to balance gravel loads on a scale by the 10 Yard dump truck. Instead of making small changes, seeing how they effect balance, they just pile on a **** ton at once and try to balance.
Quote: Originally Posted by Blavatsky View Post
Problems of the First World.

"My Video Game Dev implements improvements to my gaming experience in a clandestine manner , this is costing me virtual money "

Gibbzter's Avatar


Gibbzter
04.18.2012 , 03:27 PM | #717
Quote: Originally Posted by PostalTwinkie View Post
Any class should be able to survive a bad player, in any game! If I am a master level Chess player I should be able to beat any bad player. But if I play another Chess master it should be relatively even, with the winner being whoever happen to be the sharpest of the two at that engagement. My point is that right now with 1.2 when a Healer is faced with a DPS of equal skill the Healer dies, not they tie each other up, the Healer just dies.

BioWares way of balancing is like trying to balance gravel loads on a scale by the 10 Yard dump truck. Instead of making small changes, seeing how they effect balance, they just pile on a **** ton at once and try to balance.
I totally agree with you. I was replying to the guy that said we can still 1v1 anyone and have no problems surviving.

An equal geared smart dps can lock us down in seconds.

mikegr's Avatar


mikegr
04.18.2012 , 03:29 PM | #718
I always wanted to see how an mmo played with no healers. Why not just give everyone one heal and do away with the healing class completely? Everyone could play a dps and not have to worry about developing any tactics or skill.

Metalmac's Avatar


Metalmac
04.18.2012 , 03:31 PM | #719
Quote: Originally Posted by mikegr View Post
I always wanted to see how an mmo played with no healers. Why not just give everyone one heal and do away with the healing class completely? Everyone could play a dps and not have to worry about developing any tactics or skill.
Yet another DPS only viewpoint.

Zaranok's Avatar


Zaranok
04.18.2012 , 03:32 PM | #720
Quote: Originally Posted by Dreydin View Post
The players I am healing and the healing charts would disagree with you. I have adapted as well as person can. The difference between me and your friend, is he is complacent and doesnt require lube.

I, on the other hand. Wont pay for a slap in the face. I never wanted god mode. But i sure do want to feel like I am having fun. And it doesnt matter which of my toons I play. The end result is the same...ZERGFEST



The changes before 1.2 were basicly freaking god-mode for healers. they could have 2-3 dps sitting on top of them in many cases and still be able to run around keeping themselfs up with no effort at all barelly (especially if you were fully BM geared) those are the kind of changes you want back by the looks of your post (the times you had fun)

There hasnt been any real changes barelly before 1.2 in terms of damage which means that these are sorts of things you enjoyed. The moment this changed to something slightly worse for yourself (the way you saw yourself with your character) you came here raging about it