Who Swtor was made for.

It is not my intent to constantly disagree with an anonymous person on the internet. I know nothing about you other that why you have posted. I still think (based on this post and your others) me wanting 40 man raids, that the content isn't easy for me and my guild and that i want status symbols is reaching a bit. One can interpret my post as they will, I can only reinforce MY meaning.

Tera is coming out soon. It looks like a great game (though it has its controversies), and most of the "complaints" aren't for the right reasons (such as either the Elin censorship, which I could understand but not necessarily agree with). Although the controls look awkward since you need your mouse to target, though there should be a way to mouse turn and not have to rely on the arrow keys.

I work full time, like most people in developed countries. I was in the first day of early access. I took a month vacation from work just to play since it encompassed Christmas as well. During the weekdays I play probably 4+ hours a night, and on weekends it's 6-8 hours a day. The kicker...

To this day I have only one end-game level 50, with three lowbie alts. I didn't skip conversations (except for dailies and repeatables that I spacebar-and-#1 through). I've done...

I did some crafting, maxed stats, but still don't have all recipes unlocked.
Some companions at max affection and high-end gear, but not all.
I've unlocked every single hex of map everywhere.
I've done ALL PvE quests, including hard-to-find side ones, but still have 3 Heroic 4s left.
I did a ton of PvP, but am still not Battlemaster.
I still don't have top gear (mixture of Rakata, Columi, and Champion)
I've done plenty of space battles.
I did every flashpoint, some on hard mode.
I've run in both ops, but only normal mode.
I do PvE dailies all the time.
I have all datacrons including +10 to all.
I still have codex to unlock.
I grind a lot for credits after 1.1.5.
Most speeders, white crystals for me, companions, and alts.

There's still more than I can complete. My /played for my main is 25+ days. And there's still more to do.

So just using me as an example, all of those complaining that they don't have anything lest to do are either lying, power-leveled to skip cut-scenes, or spent every waking moment in-game since early access. Every single one of those reasons is purely their fault. It's not the developer's fault. There's a ton of content, more than ANY other theme-park style MMO I've played except may be LOTRO and WoW. So please, "hardcore" people (not targeted at anyone specific) who play all the freaking time and have burned through all content because they rush: go b*tch elsewhere. You don't have my sympathy at all.

Except you would be considered a hardcore player and not a casual player.

Also when people say there is no content, its ambigoius.

They are really saying that they are bored of the game. That is subjective and you cant force someone to say they should not feel bored.

The real question, and the real answer you want from them... is what exactly were they wanting to do that would make the game better. Hopefully, the answer, is something realistic and expected for MMOs that is a fair answer to consider.

Well I wish you the very best and hope that you can find a game that can sustain you. I for one am a Star Wars fan and the game suits me for now. I can't say if it will in a year, that will depend on if they can keep pumping out content. So far that has been fairly slow and they will need to learn they'll need to increase that output if they want people to stay.

The original poster's observations are right on the mark and I congratulate him for this post.

Darth (and Dawn's reply, which Darth commented on it), very nice posts. I'm not in your 'camp' with respect to play style and what I expect out of an MMO (though played many of the old ones, and didn't like how difficult they were then, the new breed of game is more my pace).

Having said that, what is even more unfortunate about the quote (regarding costs and target audiences), is I think when the games get more cost effective to build again such that niche markets are profitable again (100-200k subs for 2-3 years makes the game worth it to build), that somehow we (people like me, who play a lot, but prefer content which isn't quite as difficult) will be the losers.

It's you folks who write the best walk-throughs, the best guides, the best builds, the best fan databases. It's many of you who, when they feel nice, give a little 'back' to the community and will gladly do a PUG run every so often and help people learn how to do some of the harder content (I recall back in the day big guilds hosting 20 man raids in LotRO where they'd take quite a few 'general public' folks along so they'd get to experience it).

You guys and gals are all 'part' of the community, and I hope the answer isn't that we eventually have to fragment that to get what everyone is looking for.

But at any rate, I just wanted to comment on how much I enjoyed seeing a good post that was a nice 20k ft level view of the state of the genre, from a demographic perspective.

Exactly. There is a ton to do in TOR, exponentially so if you roll alts. But I think you hit the nail on the head: they're bored.

In terms of PvP, the number of warzones is far too low, and one more isn't going to make it that much less boring. It will still get boring and feel like a grind over time. I loved Illum because the players made their own content by doing battle in varying numbers with varying tactics and styles. But who knows if that will survive?

In terms of PvE, TOR will either need to add sand-box style content (which probably won't happen in this sort of MMO) or keep adding planets and level caps at a rate of 1 expansion a year and an update 2 times a year. I think they're almost on track for that, but 1.2 is stuff that should have been there at launch, so they're covering their fundamentals with this big update instead of a ton of content.

In light of that I'm still very happy with TOR. In comparison, I gave WoW 4 months of total subscription time back before and after Burning Crusade before I ditched it. I gave 2 years to Ultima Online before it became rinse and repeat, and that was much more sandbox-like with player housing. I gave 2 years to LOTRO, and it's still my fallback MMO. I gave 4 months to STO, which had no end-game other than zerg-fest STFs. I gave less time than I should have to AoC, about 3 months. And I gave 6 months to Dark Age of Camelot. So I can get bored with games, but with TOR that hasn't happened yet and I plan to play my alts almost exclusively to become second mains over 2012. I'm still very happy with TOR. The new UI and Legacy system in 1.2 are my personal favorites so far.

IMHO that's more of an extreme player as opposed to a hardcore player. I believe hardcores play competitively and devote a large amount of time to the intricacies of a hobby they enjoy. By large I mean inordinate when compared to those with a casual approach. Hardcores and casuals can get along fine if the casual prepares and performs well enough. Whereas extremists seem almost programmed to blindly rocket through things because they can, and schedule life around these endeavors. They eventually rebel when there's no one there to congratulate them once they've reached the end, not wanting to understand that being an unguided missile is their choice.

I think there is a substantial place in this game for hardcores, and more attention is being devoted to advanced gameplay. Extremists on the other hand will continue doing the vagabond thing, bouncing around different games, rarely finding one that is catered to them. If they do find one it likely won't be financially viable for very long because the niche is so small. Then they're back on the road again looking for ...

Just one person's perspective.

That is why they should, and do, cater to the bread and butter ( and income ) of any major MMO, the casual player.