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BH/trooper getting boned in 1.2

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > Classes
BH/trooper getting boned in 1.2

iDubstep's Avatar


iDubstep
04.02.2012 , 09:55 AM | #21
Arsenal/Gunnery damage reduction buff from TM/Grav is also getting cut in half.

Because we weren't already glass cannons? Oh wait, now with more glass and less cannon.
Alive Heros: Confident Hero - Stout Hero - Jedi Covenant
Dead Heros: Octane Torque - Burn Torque - Enslave Minds - Tortured Minds - East Coast PVP server merge fatalities

TUXs's Avatar


TUXs
04.02.2012 , 09:58 AM | #22
Quote: Originally Posted by Sevvy View Post
I think the 1.2 PvP and class balance patch notes should just say...

"Fixed a bug where Powertechs were on even ground with Shadows/Assassins and Marauders/Sentinels."
LOL! Clever :P
All warfare is based on deception. Attack him where he is unprepared, appear where you are not expected. If his forces are united, separate them. If you are far from the enemy, make him believe you are near. A leader leads by example not by force.

radbass's Avatar


radbass
04.02.2012 , 09:59 AM | #23
Quote: Originally Posted by iDubstep View Post
Arsenal/Gunnery damage reduction buff from TM/Grav is also getting cut in half.

Because we weren't already glass cannons? Oh wait, now with more glass and less cannon.
that, im on the fence about. i feel that any expectation to be both powerful AND durable is unrealistic. tanks require dps to play their role, but dps should be avoiding situations where they take damage. a typical player should not be able to best 2 typical players.

Theology's Avatar


Theology
04.02.2012 , 10:00 AM | #24
Several threads on this already, bioware has chosen to ignore them.

RIP Pyrotech 1.2

cashogy's Avatar


cashogy
04.02.2012 , 10:01 AM | #25
Quote: Originally Posted by PurpleMagick View Post
I think the Pyro PT nerf is being way overblown.

Its a 6 second cooldown to PPA, not Rail Shot.

So you can cast Rail Shot, PPA procs, cast Rail Shot again. PPA can't proc again for another 6 six secons.
You can still cast Rail Shot twice in a row, you just can't do it 3 times in a row. Big Deal.
it is a very big deal.

aside from the fact that this change was not even necessary, PPA was a HUGE source of heat management for pyrotechs. with this change, we will only be able to vent heat effectively every 6 seconds, which means the overall DPS output is nerfed due to resource management.

and you make it seem like we can just proc 3 Rail Shot resets on command. IT IS A ~4% CHANCE! to do decent damage with those 3 Rail Shots, they need to crit. assuming you have 40% crit, the chance of you getting 3 resets AND 3 crits is .35%. LESS THAN 1% CHANCE!

now, to get 3 Rail Shot resets would take 6 GCDs to complete the combo. all of these abilities would need to crit to be as devastating as many players claim them to be. the chance of that happening, again assuming 40% crit, is a .4% chance. AGAIN, LESS THAN 1% CHANCE!

the nerf to pyrotech is because of the above scenario. i have been playing pyrotech for a few months now, and i have never gotten 3 resets in a row. bioware had actually balanced the reset chances quite well. with 1.2, theyre implementing an all encompassing nerf to the pyrotech tree. if they really wanted to try to prevent the perfect RNG outcome, they should have just decreased the PPA proc rates a bit.

this nerf is because of the massive amount of QQ about pyrotech that was coming to the forums. the same thing that happened to operatives is happening to pyrotechs. bioware has made it clear they dont make significant class changes based on actual statistics. they make them based on whether or not the majority of their customers want to have a class nerfed

Theology's Avatar


Theology
04.02.2012 , 10:04 AM | #26
Let's be clear. Pyrotech is also the only tree that has to use heat to proc the tree's heat venting mechanic. That alone is grounds for a fix. Oh, guess what, you have to use 32 heat at a chance to dissipate 8 heat.

Stool cory, bioware.

iDubstep's Avatar


iDubstep
04.02.2012 , 10:09 AM | #27
Quote: Originally Posted by radbass View Post
that, im on the fence about. i feel that any expectation to be both powerful AND durable is unrealistic. tanks require dps to play their role, but dps should be avoiding situations where they take damage. a typical player should not be able to best 2 typical players.
Arsenal/Gunnery is *was* powerful but has no durability at all. Now we have less.

Maybe if they increased the timer on the TM buffed shield from 15 seconds to something like 25 while reducing the damage THAT would encourage a more active rotation.
Alive Heros: Confident Hero - Stout Hero - Jedi Covenant
Dead Heros: Octane Torque - Burn Torque - Enslave Minds - Tortured Minds - East Coast PVP server merge fatalities

ekwalizer's Avatar


ekwalizer
04.02.2012 , 10:22 AM | #28
Quote: Originally Posted by cashogy View Post
it is a very big deal.

aside from the fact that this change was not even necessary, PPA was a HUGE source of heat management for pyrotechs. with this change, we will only be able to vent heat effectively every 6 seconds, which means the overall DPS output is nerfed due to resource management.

and you make it seem like we can just proc 3 Rail Shot resets on command. IT IS A ~4% CHANCE! to do decent damage with those 3 Rail Shots, they need to crit. assuming you have 40% crit, the chance of you getting 3 resets AND 3 crits is .35%. LESS THAN 1% CHANCE!

now, to get 3 Rail Shot resets would take 6 GCDs to complete the combo. all of these abilities would need to crit to be as devastating as many players claim them to be. the chance of that happening, again assuming 40% crit, is a .4% chance. AGAIN, LESS THAN 1% CHANCE!

the nerf to pyrotech is because of the above scenario. i have been playing pyrotech for a few months now, and i have never gotten 3 resets in a row. bioware had actually balanced the reset chances quite well. with 1.2, theyre implementing an all encompassing nerf to the pyrotech tree. if they really wanted to try to prevent the perfect RNG outcome, they should have just decreased the PPA proc rates a bit.

this nerf is because of the massive amount of QQ about pyrotech that was coming to the forums. the same thing that happened to operatives is happening to pyrotechs. bioware has made it clear they dont make significant class changes based on actual statistics. they make them based on whether or not the majority of their customers want to have a class nerfed
I don't know about all that. I played Arsenal up to BM, then switched to Pyro - because I was sick of all the TM hate and being shut down by constant INTs.

That said, I primarily PvP and personally I use Rapid Shots a lot. Heat management is an issue, but I might do a hard vent once or twice per match. I basically treat rapid shots like a free constant DOT. Works for me, might not suit everyone else.

I do agree that the nerf to Pyro's was just mean spirited.

fungihoujo's Avatar


fungihoujo
04.02.2012 , 11:08 AM | #29
Quote: Originally Posted by Sevvy View Post
I think the 1.2 PvP and class balance patch notes should just say...

"Fixed a bug where Powertechs were on even ground with Shadows/Assassins and Marauders/Sentinels."
Rofl, QFT.

Faat's Avatar


Faat
04.02.2012 , 11:43 AM | #30
Quote: Originally Posted by radbass View Post
its a heat management issue. pyrotech has HORRIBLE heat management, and the free rail shots are the only way around that.
You only have ammo problems if you constantly spam ion pulse or use incendiary rounds when your ammo is too low. Seriously, I get 3 procs in a row quite often imo, and not only does these HiB are hitting like a truck when they crit, they also don't cost ammo. IT IS OP. Depending on luck, with the current metagame, either you completely ROFLSTOMP someone or you just use ion pulse / stockstrike / hammer shot 'till they die. That tree needed to be looked at, it's too strong in the current making, because even when it dosen't proc, you'd still win most 1v1s.

Deal with the nerf. Like someone else said, you'll have a GREATER chance to get 2 HiB in a row than before. When it procs, time to slow down with the ion pulse / stockstrike spamspam. The only reason you end up out of ammo is because you spam ion pulse like an idiot and it dosen't proc. That's it. Stop spamming.

For example, when you only have 3/12 ammo and you DECIDE to use ion pulse to MAYBE get a free HiB proc, you DECIDE that if you're not lucky, you'll end up 1/12 ammo. Now after 1.2, it will remove ion pulse spamspamspamspam, and thruthfully, it was completely dumb to begin with.

Just do some maths : With adrenals, relic, +25% crit buff, getting 3 procs in a row (4 HiBs (4k+ crit) + incendiary DoTs + assault plastique (4k crit) + SS (2.5k crit) + 2 IPs (2k crit)) = approx. 25k + damage in approx. 7 GCD. OP.

People here are looking at this like it's completely gonna kill the spec. It's not.