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Y u no nerf shadow?


Sabredance's Avatar


Sabredance
03.25.2012 , 10:57 AM | #11
Quote: Originally Posted by Luochaz View Post
waitwut? u have probs with shadows.. are u kidding me lol

i'm a mara and shadows die so fast its funny
Sure mate.
I want to see how easily you beat a Tank specced Shadow.

UglyStik's Avatar


UglyStik
03.25.2012 , 11:07 AM | #12
Quote: Originally Posted by MithrilSoul View Post
Why is this so unbalanced again?
Because they haven't found their weakness. They are present and pretty obvious IMO, but I'm not going to start spreading them around because I'm not stupid.
JAGERMEISTER

Toxification's Avatar


Toxification
03.25.2012 , 11:08 AM | #13
The tanking tree for assassins/shadows is arguably overpowered

However if you tell me the dps tree's are OP I'ma smack you. The ONLY thing damage assassins and shadows have going for them that the tank spec doesn't is their short burst damage when they have recklessness proc'd.

If you're saying that deception and concealment need a nerf, I want you to play one ALL the way to level 40 ish.

UglyStik's Avatar


UglyStik
03.25.2012 , 11:10 AM | #14
Quote: Originally Posted by Sabredance View Post
Sure mate.
I want to see how easily you beat a Tank specced Shadow.
An actual quality Mara can do it, a BH can, and a Sniper can(and their mirror classes can). Just have to play smart.
JAGERMEISTER

UglyStik's Avatar


UglyStik
03.25.2012 , 11:14 AM | #15
Quote: Originally Posted by Toxification View Post
The tanking tree for assassins/shadows is arguably overpowered

However if you tell me the dps tree's are OP I'ma smack you. The ONLY thing damage assassins and shadows have going for them that the tank spec doesn't is their short burst damage when they have recklessness proc'd.

If you're saying that deception and concealment need a nerf, I want you to play one ALL the way to level 40 ish.
Yeah, I agree. If they actually made infiltration usuable in PVP I probably would because I wanted to play more of a melee class to be honest. The tank spec is only OP in regards to their self heals..I think the only change they should make to that tree is maybe to make it not so easy to have harnessed shadow heal you while you TT(instead of three charges make it five).
JAGERMEISTER

MithrilSoul's Avatar


MithrilSoul
03.25.2012 , 11:29 AM | #16
Quote: Originally Posted by UglyStik View Post
The tank spec is only OP in regards to their self heals..I think the only change they should make to that tree is maybe to make it not so easy to have harnessed shadow heal you while you TT(instead of three charges make it five).
The problem with that idea is that the self-healing is a big part of what makes shadow/sin tanks viable as endgame operation/HM main tanks. Overall our defense/durability right now is less than an equally-geared Guardian/Jugg or Vanguard/PT tanks, but it is our self-healing from Harnessed Shadows that makes up for that. If you increase the "stack demand" from 3 to 5 in order to trigger the self-healing, then essentially you nerf that self-healing by 40%, which is a pretty big hit. Seems to me if you did that, you would HAVE to increase the defensive side of shadows/sins some (whether through increasing their armor rating multiplier that the tank stance gives or some other means) to make up for it and put them closer to being on-par with the other two tanking classes in terms of survivablity.

If you don't do something like that, then you end up breaking shadow/sin tanks in PvE for the sake of a very specialized PvP concern, and that seems backwards to me...ESPECIALLY given how the BW devs have said explicitly that they are nerfing endgame healing (across all healing classes) and "tightening" endgame bosses to make these encounters more difficult.
Varwe, lvl 50 Mirialan Jedi Shadow tank
Chief Officer, Ring of Destiny
recruiting mature, semi-casual players of all classes on Jedi Covenant server
Honor ~ Loyalty ~ Respect

Tiresias's Avatar


Tiresias
03.25.2012 , 01:04 PM | #17
How boring and vanilla of a game are you guys looking for? Are you out to destroy anything that is even remotely interesting because you cannot slam your "2" key repeatedly to victory against every class?

Kinetic Shadows/Darkness Assassins are tank with:

-The lowest static mitigation through armor of all three tank classes.
-The worst static shield chance of all three tank classes.
-The worst tank cooldowns of all three tank classes.

The build's "mitigation" comes entirely from self-healing, and 90% of that self-healing comes from using Telekinetic Throw/Force Lightning after building three stacks of Harnessed Shadows/Harnessed Darkness.

The entire build's defense lynchpins on that one ability.

I'll grant the benefit of the doubt in this instance and assume that you didn't know this fact; that ignorance led you to create this thread. I would not be surprised, however, if you actually did know this fact and are simply not capable of exploiting it.

Shadows/Assassins are generally regarded as the worst PvE tank at the moment for a HUGE variety of reasons. The tree is trying to take an archetype (lightly-armored, highly mobile caster or stealth assassin) and turn it into something that doesn't fit for 5 of its 6 potential talent trees. Many core abilities that the spec relies on simply fail in the situations where they are needed the most.

And here you are, nerfherding about the spec because you cannot figure out how to save a hard CC or a physics effect for when they use Telekinetic Throw. Pathetic.

biowareftw's Avatar


biowareftw
03.25.2012 , 02:04 PM | #18
Quote: Originally Posted by Sabredance View Post
Sure mate.
I want to see how easily you beat a Tank specced Shadow.
I beat them all the time but I am not supposed to. They basically have no counter when played right.

BTW a GOOD Op/scoundrel will kick the crap out of a marauder/sent 1 v 1. CC rebuke/wait it out? GG. You win. I faceroll sent/marauders on my op/scoundrel. Op/scoundrel is hard countered by sin/shadow (any spec). No opener = dead.

Slinger/sniper is 100 percent counter to marauder/sent. They are countered by stealth.

Marauder/sent HAS counters. Ops/scoundrels have counters. Slinger/sniper has counters. The other dps specs are all derp faceroll, do a ton of dmg in warzone specs. They aren't made to duel with, but you CAN beat many classes on some of them if they play bad.

Tank specced sin/shadow in dps gear simply has no counter AND fills the roll of tank = broken. They will be stacked to high hell in rateds. It is the most obvious thing in the world.
Einstein's relativity work is a magnificent mathematical garb which fascinates, dazzles and makes people blind to the underlying errors. The theory is like a beggar clothed in purple whom ignorant people take for a king... its exponents are brilliant men but they are metaphysicists rather than scientists.- Nikola Tesla - New York Times (11 July 1935)

Shardie's Avatar


Shardie
03.25.2012 , 02:42 PM | #19
You don't nerf a tank spec lightly for the sole purpose of PvP, paticularly when its already preforming below par in PvE. I doubt we'll see much done to the kinetic spec for the time being.
The Caaru Legacy
Vennah - lvl 60 Shadow
Vassar - lvl 60 Gunslinger

Agilard's Avatar


Agilard
03.25.2012 , 05:15 PM | #20
Quote: Originally Posted by Luochaz View Post
waitwut? u have probs with shadows.. are u kidding me lol

i'm a mara and i basically own nething but BH/Trooper, shadows die so fast from their armour its funny, same with operatives, they are a joke too
then all the shadows/assassins u fought sucks, because a good shadow/sin can kill a sent/mar no doubt. if u want proof go to jungma server. the tourny for 1 v 1 pvp jungma has always has a shadow sage/sin always top 1 second that comes in is sent/mar. they have way to much utilities that can counter sentinels easy. so ya i def think you was fighting scrubs.