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why would i go darkness if i can tank with...

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > Classes > Shadow / Assassin
why would i go darkness if i can tank with...

kijthae's Avatar

03.24.2012 , 07:28 PM | #1
deception in pvp ? I am using this spec

It doesnt have anything special for guarding in pvp.I dont have shield generator. Fully moded/enchanced to crit/surge and a little bit power.

In the first 4-5 minutes of the warzone I faceroll to 9 medals.Im starting with surging charge

1-solo kill
1-killing blow
2.5k hit
5k hit
10 kills
75k damage

Those are already easy medals to get.Only 5k burst requires cds and good gear.75k is easly rachable in the first 2 minutes of the wz for a geared player .After I gathered those I go stealt to boost my force regeneration switch to dark charge.They nerfed stance dancing for sins by making charges cost 100 but looks like they forgot blackout and force regeneration boost in stealthed.

I keep my guard on the focus nuke targets of the enemy team .I switch my guard if they decide to nuke an other player.

If someone dare to attack me I spam force slow , use low slash , overload , speed to kite them.Im using %50 defence cd as last choice or remove my guard and restealth then guard and hide behind a wall.

2k defence in 1 life
10 defence in 1 life
50k defence

The thing I inquire is should I be able to guard someone as deception or madness? Maybe stance dance should never been nerfed and is provided to sins as an alternative to survivalbility cds but they shouldnt be allowed to guard someone as deception.

Edit: I fully support the nerf inc to dps geared tank speced casuals.

arkzehhh's Avatar

03.24.2012 , 08:02 PM | #2
Nerfing the dps tank casual's, atleast half makes sense!

verfallen's Avatar

03.24.2012 , 11:59 PM | #3
You CANNOT tank with Dark Charge only.

What you are doing is basically a low DPS merc or jug, since its basically heavy armor DPS. But they do not sacrify talent efficiency for it.

So yeah it can work, but a real darkness tank will faceroll you, as will any DPS that go in a straight race vs you.

Deception without surging charge when Discharge is one of your big hitter just isn't worth it, especially if you are only going for an armor buff without even a slight hybrid spec.

wtfnonamefree's Avatar

03.25.2012 , 05:22 AM | #4
Why do you include medals in your reasoning? They are for the looks not for the win. Also, what the other guys said - you don't want to run around in dark charge as deception (well, there are exceptions like switching for a moment when defending a node with a healer, etc - but they are exceptions^^).
Darth Fector
Tankasin EU | Jen'jidai
"Slippery as a greased Hutt"

Faeldawn's Avatar

03.25.2012 , 05:38 AM | #5
If your guarding someone who needs guarding (ball carrier, healer etc) as a DPS it means a proper tank with proper mitigation abilities can't guard that person which means your screwing over your team for a few medals that mean nothing and gain you....nothing.

Meeth's Avatar

03.25.2012 , 11:54 AM | #6
i'm confused, isn't the term tank reserved for those who can control aggro? i think the OP is talking about survivability because "tanking" doesn't exist in PVP. i personally go 31/0/10 and will continue to love it until it gets nerfed. i can tank and do well in pvp albeit i need 2 sets of gear to do both really well.

verfallen's Avatar

03.25.2012 , 01:26 PM | #7
Quote: Originally Posted by Meeth View Post
i'm confused, isn't the term tank reserved for those who can control aggro? i think the OP is talking about survivability because "tanking" doesn't exist in PVP. i personally go 31/0/10 and will continue to love it until it gets nerfed. i can tank and do well in pvp albeit i need 2 sets of gear to do both really well.
In PvE, you can "tank" without being specced in the tree on lower difficulty heroic and such. You will need more healing and lack efficiency at it, bit you can do it if there is no tank available, since taunt and Dark Charge are baseline. Ideally you'll stick to offtank tough.

In our current case however, the OP use a specced based on burst, but remove the charge it is based around.

He claims he has a PvP tanking spec with a boost to armor pretty much. Which is false. Otherwise, you might as well say Merc can tank, since they have similar armor rating due to the heavy armor all BH get baseline. However, merc doesn't gimp the arsenal tree for it.

The fact you can kill someone in PvP doesn't mean squat to judge a spec, since many people fail at their class. While in full deception, I've beaten many marauder in an upfront DPS rate because they blew at managing their defensive CD, and given my low survivability, prolly blew at their rotation as well.

TL;DR version :

You get about merc/marauder survivability with half the DPS.

And I bet Darkness spec with DPS gear have similar or greater DPS and massively more survivability than he does.

IKoNNiK's Avatar

03.25.2012 , 08:03 PM | #8
I can't speak to PvP since I have only ever done 1 Warzone. I do know in PvE the DPS output of a tank that is 31 into Darkness will do less overall DPS than someone else with equal gear with 31 into Deception/Madness. Darkness just increases your survivability at the cost of DPS output.

When it comes to PvE I can do FPs BT, BP, Foundry as a 31/3/7 tank spec w/ a good healer. I will tank in my DPS gear and include my Shield and Shield Overcharger Relic (24% absorption to 53% when it goes off). I tank SOA in full DPS gear without the Shield/Relic (18311 hp). I have Columi Weapon/Wrists/Legs/Boots everything else is Rakata (18.6k hp). FL does a very nice amount of damage w/ Recklessness it can crit 4 times for around 1.7k each over 3s. The damage output alone turns me into an almost DPS. I would not feel comfortable doing that this without Dark Ward for the extra 15% shield chance. Although the heal from FL is lower than in my Tank gear it is still 12% of my total HP over 3s if I don't get stunned/knocked back. Including the increased chance for Dark Charge to go off is an extra 425 hp. 10% hp heal when you use Overcharge Saber plus the Dark Charge drops from every 4.5s to 1.5s while it is up.

Astarica's Avatar

03.25.2012 , 11:17 PM | #9
Outside of Disjunction, the difference in tanking ability across specs is minimal when it comes to PvP because you're not going to use a shield anyway so it pretty much boils down to just Dark Charge.

But if you've Voltiac Slash and you still use Dark Charge all the time, you'd be better off just doing 31/0/10 instead. Ironically you might indeed be better off using Dark Charge even if you've Voltiac Slash due to the significant increase in survivality + access to Guard, which is often a game winner in WZs. I checked my tooltips and I lose like 40 points of tooltip damage on Assassinate for using Dark Charge (it's 5% of the melee bonus modifier, not 5% of total damage), which is pretty much nothing in the grand scheme of things.

Hokonoso's Avatar

03.26.2012 , 08:37 AM | #10
you left out 1 medal you get by default (5k defense). so you should be getting 10-13 medals (300k dmg, 1k-3k defender etc...)
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