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Operations and skill measuring

finkelmana's Avatar

03.22.2012 , 02:41 PM | #1
My guild is looking to start operations soon. How are those of you currently running operations measuring the aptitude of your raiders?

Tanking is easy enough, are people pulling threat off of him? Healers are easy to assess too. Are they paying attention and healing?

Its the DPS that worries me. We have taken a few players into hard modes and struggled with bosses we normally kill quickly. Obviously, their DPS isnt up to par, but

a) how do we measure DPS?
b) how can we show them that they need to (I hate this term, but it does apply) L2P their class?

The blanket of invisibility of the numbers in this game, to my belief, is to cut out exclusivity. However, all that "inclusiveness" has a negative affect on more focused players. I am here to have fun too and that fun includes success at hard modes, operations, etc... and I will be more than happy to raid with people, as long as I know they are playing at the same level.

The one thing worse than not raiding, is going into a raid knowing you will fail.

TheCrackLing's Avatar

03.22.2012 , 03:55 PM | #2
The best fight to check people's DPS is the Council. In the future you'll be able to have people parse themselves, but won't be able to parse others.
Eleeni - Mind Trick Empire - Purple Haze

Elyssandra's Avatar

03.22.2012 , 04:16 PM | #3
a) how do we measure DPS?
I think you will feel it if something's off in the raid. Or you will be able to call it because you know that you will never be able to take the boss down with this level of DPS.

Individually - well I believe in 1.2 there will be combat dummies - yay!
However, for now perhaps find a champion mob that respawns quite fast and use it as a substitute dummy. Get your DPS to individually take it down, time the fight and watch to see if they have any problems or could benefit from any suggestions for improvement (e.g. are you running out of force 1 min into the fight?). You'll need to keep the person healed OFC.
b) how can we show them that they need to (I hate this term, but it does apply) L2P their class?
I don't know - if you find a solution - please do mention it

I have spoken to a few people - as a friendly hey would you consider this/ what do you think of ...?
Some people are enthusiastic, have a positive attitude, try their best and are open to suggestions - I don't mind trying and trying again with those people.

Others however... I have felt this frustration across multiple games not just SWTOR.
I have encountered
  • people who turn up 30-40 mins late for the match/ raid that they confirmed attendance for,
  • people who don't turn up after confirming attendance
  • people who say things like "it was a terrible raid - I ONLY got ONE usable columi drop"
  • people who say "hey I'm going to leave now - I don't want to try this boss, he won't drop anything for me"
  • People who watch TV/ are on the phone/ skype other people/ have conversations on two vents during a match - which is all fine if it wasn't so obvious that you're distracted and not following calls.
  • people who come by in gear with low lvl 40s mods (yes I have mentioned the GTN to them politely but no - they have not yet gone in its direction),
  • people whose specs are gimped (e.g. both heals and dps trees) who want to DPS without re-speccing or re-equiping,
  • people who make no effort to prep for the raid in any way (no medpacs, stims, or credits for repairs),
  • people who drink while in match (only fun if everyone else is in the same mindset - say other people are drinking and don't mind wiping - however if other people are serious - this isn't fun),

The thing is I doubt any of these would be tolerated in a pug group but somehow in a guild it's acceptable...

Elyssandra's Avatar

03.22.2012 , 04:17 PM | #4
Quote: Originally Posted by TheCrackLing View Post
The best fight to check people's DPS is the Council. In the future you'll be able to have people parse themselves, but won't be able to parse others.
Excellent thought with the council actually - although keep in mind that is the fourth boss fight in.

Valtrim's Avatar

03.22.2012 , 04:25 PM | #5
Like a poster above said, 1.2 will include combat logs that only show you your own log (because we don't want to hurt anyone's feelings, right? ), but people are working on parsers so that you can gather the logs from your raiders and hopefully receive accurate reports of what's happening in your raid.

Once you've identified those that need help, I'd point them to as it's the closest thing to ElitistJerks that I've seen for this game.

Good luck!

DeathDiciple's Avatar

03.22.2012 , 04:28 PM | #6
Well you talk about guild run, its easy enough. Take the people into a few HMs and judge the performance before the raid - the speed, do you reach enrage timers etc. While you probably will be able to get past HMs with suboptimal players, good ones will carry them through, it will give you the idea who is underperforming pretty quickly without the 5-hours wipe fest. And it will also help them getting geared up properly.

If you're pugging some slots however there is no way short of friend lists - someone can have whole columni/BM set yet be utter fail cause he got carried through, no help with that.

As for l2p/specs, I'd agree with whats said above, sithwarrior is a good start.