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sith vs jedi


Swarlesx's Avatar


Swarlesx
03.22.2012 , 06:48 PM | #21
Quote: Originally Posted by Wolfninjajedi View Post
Um no, the PT are the prime of the jedi so the council in the movies is far stronger then the council in SWTOR.
Mace Windu states that the councils abilities in the force had begun to weaken. A great deal of their judgment had been clouded by Sidious which is why he was able to out smart them.

Wolfninjajedi's Avatar


Wolfninjajedi
03.22.2012 , 06:50 PM | #22
Quote: Originally Posted by Swarlesx View Post
Mace Windu states that the councils abilities in the force had begun to weaken. A great deal of their judgment had been clouded by Sidious which is why he was able to out smart them.
That doesn't mean they are weaker, only that their vision had been clouded by the most powerful sith lord ever. Here is what Mace said

Mace: "I think its time we inform the senate, that our ability to use the force has diminished."

But then Yoda says

Yoda: "Only the dark lord of the sith knows of our weakness."

So their ability to use the force wasn't weakening it was Palpatine who was clouding their minds.
"There is one lesson you've yet to learn. How to become one with the Force!"
―Cin Drallig to Darth Vader

Maucs the Tauntaun King, former SWG player.

ProfessorWalsh's Avatar


ProfessorWalsh
03.22.2012 , 06:55 PM | #23
Quote: Originally Posted by zxckakel View Post
True, but the potential of reaching true power is achievable if you follow the path of the dark side . Because, this is just my personal opinion, emotion though can be everyone's bane is the greatest motivation for anyone.

Great point on the last part.
The path of true power in Star Wars comes from following the Light Side only. When a Jedi, and this is something a Sith cannot ever do, fully gives him (or her) self over to the Force that Jedi becomes completely unstoppable.

A million Sith could try to put them down at that point and would fail.

Luke Skywalker was able to achieve speeds that were so fast not even Jedi Masters could see him moving.

Ganner was able to hold off an entire army while shouting "None shall pass!" as he took on a thousand warriors and artillery.

No Sith can ever even touch that power because no Sith can give themselves over to the Force.
"There is no room for compromise. We walk the path of the light side, or we fall into darkness. There is no gray area, Ben."
~ Jedi Grand Master Luke Skywalker (P. 187 FotJ, Book II: Omen)
Host of the Jedi Council stream also author of From the Journal of Val Starwind

Swarlesx's Avatar


Swarlesx
03.22.2012 , 07:09 PM | #24
Quote: Originally Posted by ProfessorWalsh View Post
The path of true power in Star Wars comes from following the Light Side only. When a Jedi, and this is something a Sith cannot ever do, fully gives him (or her) self over to the Force that Jedi becomes completely unstoppable.

A million Sith could try to put them down at that point and would fail.

Luke Skywalker was able to achieve speeds that were so fast not even Jedi Masters could see him moving.

Ganner was able to hold off an entire army while shouting "None shall pass!" as he took on a thousand warriors and artillery.

No Sith can ever even touch that power because no Sith can give themselves over to the Force.
But Jedi can gain knowledge from the dark side. After Revan regained his memories he was able to use both light and dark abilities even though he followed the light.

ProfessorWalsh's Avatar


ProfessorWalsh
03.22.2012 , 07:38 PM | #25
Quote: Originally Posted by Swarlesx View Post
But Jedi can gain knowledge from the dark side. After Revan regained his memories he was able to use both light and dark abilities even though he followed the light.
No he wasn't able to use both Light and Dark abilities.

It doesn't work like that. The Dark Side is literally infectious. If you use it, it drives you insane eventually. If a Jedi uses the Dark Side regularly they will eventually fall, nobody can "resist it" as it canonically doesn't work that way.

Tales of Jedi who can use the Dark Side but remain untouched by it are a myth, they are a weapon used by Sith usually to turn Jedi to the Dark Side.

That was how Vergere and Lumiya lead Jacen Solo to the Dark Side too.
"There is no room for compromise. We walk the path of the light side, or we fall into darkness. There is no gray area, Ben."
~ Jedi Grand Master Luke Skywalker (P. 187 FotJ, Book II: Omen)
Host of the Jedi Council stream also author of From the Journal of Val Starwind

Captain_Zone's Avatar


Captain_Zone
03.22.2012 , 08:09 PM | #26
Quote: Originally Posted by ProfessorWalsh View Post
No he wasn't able to use both Light and Dark abilities.

It doesn't work like that. The Dark Side is literally infectious. If you use it, it drives you insane eventually. If a Jedi uses the Dark Side regularly they will eventually fall, nobody can "resist it" as it canonically doesn't work that way.

Tales of Jedi who can use the Dark Side but remain untouched by it are a myth, they are a weapon used by Sith usually to turn Jedi to the Dark Side.

That was how Vergere and Lumiya lead Jacen Solo to the Dark Side too.
The Grey Jedi and Kyle Katarn have disproved this. They use both sides equally. Kyle said something to the effect of.... "Dark and Light have nothing to do with the abilities themselves. Only in how they're used." The Grey Jedi embraced abilites from both sides equally. Jolee Bindo said "We don't see the galaxy in black and white. Those are the views of the Jedi Council and the Sith Lords. We see all the shades of grey, and we have the common sense to know where to start and when to stop."

Also, Revan DID use both "dark" and "light" abilities after his memory returned.
. OPOD
Shivalka: Darth Baras is quite large, isn't he?
Joran Karn: You, my dear Sith, have just mastered the art of understatement.

Swarlesx's Avatar


Swarlesx
03.22.2012 , 08:18 PM | #27
Quote: Originally Posted by ProfessorWalsh View Post
No he wasn't able to use both Light and Dark abilities.

It doesn't work like that. The Dark Side is literally infectious. If you use it, it drives you insane eventually. If a Jedi uses the Dark Side regularly they will eventually fall, nobody can "resist it" as it canonically doesn't work that way.

Tales of Jedi who can use the Dark Side but remain untouched by it are a myth, they are a weapon used by Sith usually to turn Jedi to the Dark Side.

That was how Vergere and Lumiya lead Jacen Solo to the Dark Side too.
Because he lived two lives and mastered the dark in one and the light in the other, he was able to create a perfect balance between the two upon regaining his memories. He could absorb dark side power and redirect them and use the light to heal his body. Revan was by no means in the "Grey". he was very much a light side jedi. But once he regained his memories and his previous knowledge of the dark side his powers became much greater, to the point where he could kill a sith lord in one attack.

It is possible to stay sane as a dark jedi and sith. Even though all his followers and his apprentice had become obsessed with the dark sides power, Revan was able to resist the temptations the star forge presented and did not allow himself to fall. he instead chose the dark. Lord Praven was a sith pure blood who believe that the Jedi wanted only to kill him. But he was turned to the light and became a member of the jedi order. And of course Luke Skywaker fell under the influence of one of the greatest Sith lords to ever live and he was able to return to the light and use powers similar to force lightning.

What i am try to say is that the dark side is truly an infection but it can be controlled. Few have been able to but remember the force is a balance never a dominance. There must always be light and dark and it is possible for a jedi to become part of that balance.

ProfessorWalsh's Avatar


ProfessorWalsh
03.22.2012 , 10:42 PM | #28
Quote: Originally Posted by Captain_Zone View Post
The Grey Jedi and Kyle Katarn have disproved this. They use both sides equally. Kyle said something to the effect of.... "Dark and Light have nothing to do with the abilities themselves. Only in how they're used." The Grey Jedi embraced abilites from both sides equally. Jolee Bindo said "We don't see the galaxy in black and white. Those are the views of the Jedi Council and the Sith Lords. We see all the shades of grey, and we have the common sense to know where to start and when to stop."

Also, Revan DID use both "dark" and "light" abilities after his memory returned.
You are trying to quote Kyle's line from the Jedi Academy video game.

The same Kyle Katarn who canonically warns people away from using the Dark Side. You don't know what a Gray Jedi is.

A Gray Jedi is simply a Jedi who disagrees with the Jedi Council, they aren't Jedi who use the light and the dark. That is a fan edited Wookieepedia entry and has been debunked many times. We know what a Gray Jedi is and Jolee "The Neutral Jedi" wasn't neutral at all, he was a 100% light side Jedi if you ever noticed how angry he gets if you EVER do a Dark Side action.
"There is no room for compromise. We walk the path of the light side, or we fall into darkness. There is no gray area, Ben."
~ Jedi Grand Master Luke Skywalker (P. 187 FotJ, Book II: Omen)
Host of the Jedi Council stream also author of From the Journal of Val Starwind

ProfessorWalsh's Avatar


ProfessorWalsh
03.22.2012 , 10:49 PM | #29
Quote: Originally Posted by Swarlesx View Post
What i am try to say is that the dark side is truly an infection but it can be controlled. Few have been able to but remember the force is a balance never a dominance. There must always be light and dark and it is possible for a jedi to become part of that balance.
No it canonically isn't.

Look at the quote in my signature.

That is from Luke Skywalker, the most powerful Jedi ever in canon, the guy who trained Kyle Katarn, the guy who trained under the Emperor for a time. The guy who is the authority on the subject.

"There is no room for compromise. We walk the path of the light side, or we fall into darkness. There is no gray area, Ben."

Balance of the Force doesn't mean that you use the Light and the Dark Sides. The Force isn't a tool. Jedi SERVE the Force, the Dark Side is when you try to make the Force SERVE you, it is when you give in to dangerous emotions.

You cannot control it.

It is literally thinking like that which has, time and again, made people fall to the Dark Side. It is a trap. It is a nasty, dirty, evil trap.

You cannot use the Dark Side regularly and not become corrupted. You cannot control it. That isn't how it works and that is NEVER how it has worked.

BioWare gave you a CHOICE with Revan, and canonically he ONLY chose Light Side choices after he was reborn.

This is because, quite frankly, BioWare doesn't know how to write a light side Jedi to save their skins, but that is beside the point.
"There is no room for compromise. We walk the path of the light side, or we fall into darkness. There is no gray area, Ben."
~ Jedi Grand Master Luke Skywalker (P. 187 FotJ, Book II: Omen)
Host of the Jedi Council stream also author of From the Journal of Val Starwind

Captain_Zone's Avatar


Captain_Zone
03.22.2012 , 10:53 PM | #30
Quote: Originally Posted by ProfessorWalsh View Post
You are trying to quote Kyle's line from the Jedi Academy video game.

The same Kyle Katarn who canonically warns people away from using the Dark Side. You don't know what a Gray Jedi is.

A Gray Jedi is simply a Jedi who disagrees with the Jedi Council, they aren't Jedi who use the light and the dark. That is a fan edited Wookieepedia entry and has been debunked many times. We know what a Gray Jedi is and Jolee "The Neutral Jedi" wasn't neutral at all, he was a 100% light side Jedi if you ever noticed how angry he gets if you EVER do a Dark Side action.
I'm from Missouri. The Show Me State. Show me. Also, Jolee SAYS it in a convo in KotOR I. So please. Make sure of your facts before spouting off. Thank you, and have a nice day.
. OPOD
Shivalka: Darth Baras is quite large, isn't he?
Joran Karn: You, my dear Sith, have just mastered the art of understatement.