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16m Nightmare Jarg/Sorno and Karagga Strat Verification

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > Flashpoints, Operations, and Heroic Missions
16m Nightmare Jarg/Sorno and Karagga Strat Verification

Norlon's Avatar


Norlon
03.21.2012 , 07:39 AM | #1
Ok my guild has cleared 16m NiM KP, but we are having a hard time getting the bosses to consistently go down every week so that we can get faster for the two hour clear. The reason for this is as the raid leader I feel the boss's are inconsistent in how they handle themselves and was hoping to come to the forum's to see what other people KNOW and/or think about the encounters.

Jarg/Sorno

P1 - Tank and Spank
Split DPS with melee on Sorno for interupts and Jarg on ranged. Have the ranged watch the bosses to make sure they stay relitvely within a 1-2 % of each other health wise.

P2- Middle
Jarg and Sorno jump into the middle of the room. I have our two sorc's each throw an AoE down on top of both of them since they both pull people in the extra few sec's of heals gives us some cushion.

P3- Probes
Sorno goes int o the air and the fracking carbonizer probes come down. Have the tanks swap aggro on Jarg if the other is carbonized....and have DPS burn down the probes.

These 3 phases repeat but after we go through basically 6 phases like this it is P1 again. This time though the bosses have a one shot mechanic when they say "Your turn." "My turn." And a raider dies. We used to try and just BURN sorno down asap to stop this, but found they one shot faster the harder we burned him. We then tried keeping them within literally 1% of each other healthwise. They continued to shoot down our healers and top ranged DPS at least with 1 every 4 to 5 seconds going down.
Has ANYONE figured out how this mechanic works we have tried cleanses the target it puts on the raider that say's their next but that doesn't work. Any other idea's this is what kills us every single time.


Karagga

We tank the boss in a room in a square. The tank stacks fire overlapping each other and this has never been our problem. While this is going on the raid is standing at max range to and going ape on the boss. With this though we have 3 healers stand in with the melee and 1 with the ranged so that we have our healers always in close range to healing our tank after the fire/frontal cone effect.
Mouse droids is never a problem when they come out.
The probelm/mechanic that gets us on this fight is he will pull all the melee AND our tank into the ranged group for that dumb void zone. This causes our fire to get plopped in a very very undersirable position and a frotnal or back AoE cone to go down on the raid.

My only thoughts to why this occurs is because maybe there are supposed to be a predestined number of ranged and if there are say 10 ranged he will pull in the melee. From there a chain lighting effect takes place and brings the tank with him. This is my only idea to why this occurs.


In conclusion its two mechanics that gets us on both bosses. For either Jarg/Sorno or Karagga does anyone have any suggestions on how to avoid the mechanic or a whole different strategy to avoid this in 16m? (Hard Mode doesn't have the same problem yesterday we got tired after 45 min on both and just switch to hard mode to kill them. The mechanic's don't occur then.)

macumba's Avatar


macumba
03.21.2012 , 08:09 AM | #2
we just did our unyielding run and killed them several times.
this encounter is the most uncertain when it comes to the speedrun, thats for sure ;-)

actually we just bring both down to about 45% (if any of them goes below 40% the "your turn, my turn-one shot phase begins)
however if any of the two dies, this stops. from the moment you bring one of them under 40% the race begins, you need damage, you need defensive cooldowns (personal and external, all of them).

what we did last week and that served us well, was to wait for another probe phase and begin burning then.
we do kill jarg first though (dunno why really, but we do). we also make sure we still have the combat rez available when reaching the burn phase
(if anyone dies before that, someone made an avoidable mistake)

in the burn phase we inevitably lose people, as long as you don't lose more than about 6-8 you should still be able to kill the second.


with karagga I would definitely agree with your assumption that not too many people should be in melee range.
we have 2 very important positions in our raid when coming to karagga. one being the tank, the other being one ranged who has the biggest range to karagga (the void zone will almost always go on him) but he needs to be very clever about positioning himself. (once we had both positions with different people and wiped the rest of the evening, while we oneshot him the id before without anyone dying).

how many healers do you use ? we use 5 and that helped big time towards clearing the instance and the fights became very controllable.
Just because you're not paranoid, doesn't mean they're not out to get you.

Norlon's Avatar


Norlon
03.21.2012 , 09:54 AM | #3
We run with 5 healers. The composition sometimes can change. Normally though 2 sorc's, 2 BH's, and 1 operative. If it were up to me I would swap a BH with an Operative, but that means that there is another operative healer on the server lol.

But I get what your saying on karaga, one week its a perfect one shot, the next its a week we resort to hard mode after an hour.

Are you saying that Karaga will pull in your tank sometimes as well?

And I was a tad unclear on your description of karraga I have seen a strat with two different ranged groups is that what your are talking about?


And your strat on Jarg and Sorno is very interesting on burning one we had a theory the closer they are in health together that effect doesn't occur (probably a lucky fluke that week.) We will try the 45% strat next week for sure. (The one thing that I hate about this sort of strat type is that its completely unavoidable by the raid the players death. In wow and Rift and other raiding PvE style games you could AVOID a one shot death but there were mechanics that would cause a insta wipe sort of stuff. This game you simply can't avoid it....)

Congratz on your unyielding run btw!!

macumba's Avatar


macumba
03.21.2012 , 10:23 AM | #4
2 camps (1 melee and 1 ranged) and one single person standing behind the ranged camp.
that person will be the target for the vortex most of the time. he stands just as far enough away so that the ranged who are not pulled away are not affected and also so that he won't pull anyone onto the rocket or fire vector of karagga. (he has to be clever about positioning himself, we have one person do that always, once he wasn't there and we replaced him with someone equally clever and somehow it did not work out. our tank never gets pulled away, we however have more problems with over aggroing on karagga than we have with other bosses, so maybe your tank lost aggro and got sucked in?

melee <-> ranged <-> single person outside always stand in a more or less straight line.

with jarg and sorno we aim 45% (5% margin to be on the safe side) one ranged stays on sorno through the burn phase to kick the heals (tank kicks unload) I don't think having them within 1-2% range while taking both down to ~45% is necessary. it's important that there's not too much left of sorno once jarg is dead ;-)

keeping my fingers crossed for you (a little luck might be useful ;-))
Just because you're not paranoid, doesn't mean they're not out to get you.

Inzi's Avatar


Inzi
03.21.2012 , 11:49 AM | #5
Here's how to live through the Rail Shots on Jarg and Sorno

Basic strat: take both to about 45% as other people have said. THEN BURN JARG. The reason you burn Jarg and NOT Sorno is because of the debuffs they get when one of them dies.

Sorno's debuff causes him to deal more and more damage the longer he lives. Obviously this is painful, but if he's the only one alive, the only person taking dmg is the tank so you cycle tanks and cooldowns.

Jarg's debuff causes him to deal more and more damage the longer he lives... AND TAKE LESS DAMAGE THE LONGER HE LIVES. This is why you get rid of him first.

The railshot mechanic will ONLY work when both of them are alive. That's because one of them "marks" targets and then then other shoots them. (Hence your turn my turn.) So the way to survive this is to preemptively pop defensive cooldowns right after they start "time for plan c? plan c? how about plan D..... your turn my turn." i.e.: USE A SNIPER BUBBLE AND GET EVERYBODY UNDER THERE. 1 sniper bubble will work for each rail shot phase if you time it properly and it WILL save people from being one shot.

The other key is to dispell the burning dot. It looks like a yellow grenade. It will be harmful to people with low health.
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Norlon's Avatar


Norlon
03.21.2012 , 09:02 PM | #6
Ok I gotcha thx for the help. Haha and thank you for the luck we will defiantly use some. We will defiantly be trying both strats......the strat's are helpful. Hopefully we will be able to get this stuff done and get our two hour clear haha.

sang's Avatar


sang
03.22.2012 , 12:44 AM | #7
Jarg & Sorno:

In my opinion this is the hardest fight in the game. Some suggestions I'll reiterate that others have mentioned:
  • Get them both to around 45%, then max burn on Jarg. The only people still on sorno should be 1 tank + 1melee dps to help with interrupts
  • I know its hard, but healers should clense off the fire DoT from your raid members. It ticks for substational damage and its much easier and efficient to remove it than heal through.
  • Alternate sniper shields during the rail shot phases and have your raid members ready with personal cooldowns. If available, also try to have your sorcs bubble as many people as possible.
  • Get good DPS - This fight is worlds different with good DPS in your raid. You won't notice a difference until Jarg & Sorno hit 40% and you really need to start burning Jarg down as fast as possible. Good DPS will make this happen quicker = less chance of dying from rail shot

Karagga:
  • This is going to be painful to hear, but I think this is arguably the worst fight for melee DPS. If you can bring range DPS, bring as many as possible. I know it sucks, but this entire encounter is infiniately more difficult when you start having a majority of melee DPS.
  • GET A GOOD TANK - A skilled tank can be the sole reason for a kill. Positioning is everything and if your tank constantly positions the boss such that raid damage is minimized to the absolute limit, a kill is almost a near guarantee if you have a competent group.
  • Spread out your healers - Try to have it so all your healers aren't near each other such that they are all sucked into a vortex out of range of the tank. While this happens, the tank often takes a pretty sizable nuke to his HP and unless he was topped off or has another healer in range, death is very possible - and likely.
  • Kill droids quickly - If you have snipers, have them alternate OS for the mouse droids. BHs can use death from above, etc etc. The quicker the droids are dead, the less chance they do damage and the more damage you can put on the boss.
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macumba's Avatar


macumba
03.22.2012 , 03:47 AM | #8
I'd like to add two more things to whats been said.

we use a ranged that stays on sorno because he places that bomb on the tank that does splash damage to anyone in range.

karagga:
as I play a sniper, I can say the mouse droids are on approximately the same timer as a skilled orbital strike (~45 secs) and he will always cast his drill right before releasing them.
(he uses the drill more often, but if its not near the cool down of orbital strike the mouse droids won't appear)

fight starts -> 10-15 seconds after first drill cast -> mouse droids right after that. (after that every drill that coincides with my orbital strike cool down)
when the cast is half way through I call out mouse droids and start casting orbital strike. everony with ranged ae will now be prepared and have massive ae raining down on the droids as they appear. this way our melee don't even have to move -that much- and karagga eats the ae as well.
Just because you're not paranoid, doesn't mean they're not out to get you.