Please upgrade your browser for the best possible experience.

Chrome Firefox Internet Explorer
×

Soa Random Impossibleness.


Codek's Avatar


Codek
03.20.2012 , 03:15 PM | #11
Quote: Originally Posted by Turst View Post
I see what you're trying to do there, but your "solutions" for Situations 1 & 2 don't really cover it. There is nothing you can do in either of those cases.
I disagree, as a mercenary healer I watch the people running for the orbs and time my heals to go off just after contact. One cast heal to one immediately followed by a instant cast heal to the other, ensured their health is high enough to survive what ever could follow that. I don't do this every time due to obvious reasons but half the time I'm aware if someone is already in the air or not based on what I see in the raid frames. On top of that, when I go myself I use my own bubble shield and take only around 35% of my health.

There is far worse things then situations 1 and 2 occurring in that fight. All of which involves someone doing something stupid before hand. Taking extra ticks of damage from orbs, hitting two orbs at once, not hitting the orbs at all. These are the unpredictable situations that, when conjoined with the RNG, will lead to health being around 5% or less
~Codek

Turst's Avatar


Turst
03.20.2012 , 04:59 PM | #12
Quote: Originally Posted by Codek View Post
I disagree, as a mercenary healer I watch the people running for the orbs and time my heals to go off just after contact. One cast heal to one immediately followed by a instant cast heal to the other, ensured their health is high enough to survive what ever could follow that. I don't do this every time due to obvious reasons but half the time I'm aware if someone is already in the air or not based on what I see in the raid frames. On top of that, when I go myself I use my own bubble shield and take only around 35% of my health.

There is far worse things then situations 1 and 2 occurring in that fight. All of which involves someone doing something stupid before hand. Taking extra ticks of damage from orbs, hitting two orbs at once, not hitting the orbs at all. These are the unpredictable situations that, when conjoined with the RNG, will lead to health being around 5% or less
I can appreciate your perspective, and I can make the assumption that you are a very good healer and your guild is lucky to have you. But what happens if you're in a mind trap and the other healer gets pulled in the air? just like the scenario I mentioned in my earlier post. There is nothing a healer can do about that, just like I said.

One of our attempts, our Sorc healer blew up his ball, started casting a heal on himself and was immediately pulled into the air. Even with that, he WOULD HAVE survived the fall damage if he hadn't landed on top of another lightning ball. Which will supposedly be fixed in 1.2... but I'm not holding my breath.

Codek's Avatar


Codek
03.20.2012 , 05:23 PM | #13
Quote: Originally Posted by Turst View Post
I can appreciate your perspective, and I can make the assumption that you are a very good healer and your guild is lucky to have you. But what happens if you're in a mind trap and the other healer gets pulled in the air? just like the scenario I mentioned in my earlier post. There is nothing a healer can do about that, just like I said.

One of our attempts, our Sorc healer blew up his ball, started casting a heal on himself and was immediately pulled into the air. Even with that, he WOULD HAVE survived the fall damage if he hadn't landed on top of another lightning ball. Which will supposedly be fixed in 1.2... but I'm not holding my breath.
I never really understood where the problem arises when one healer is tossed and the other is trapped, both effects last around 10 seconds and the only damage the occurs during this is two orbs, no one should die in the process since everyone should be high on health anyways and it's not like someone will take an orb and get tossed because a healer is already in the air. The tank will take a few hits which aren't bad and become practically nothing if they decide to pop a cooldown.

Sure when the healer lands and the other is broken free, there is a ton of damage to be healed up for but that's the exact moment cooldowns are made for. I've never really noticed an issue with getting everyone at least at 50% by the time the next air toss occurs and setting priory immediately to who gets the orbs next.

and I agree completely with the orb -> toss -> orb combo is just ruthless. My guild has done everything we could think of to avoid that one and it still occurs occasionally. Not enough for it to be a game breaker though.
~Codek

Inzi's Avatar


Inzi
03.20.2012 , 06:09 PM | #14
Quote: Originally Posted by Turst View Post
I see what you're trying to do there, but your "solutions" for Situations 1 & 2 don't really cover it. There is nothing you can do in either of those cases.

and.. since when did bug fixes = nerfs? Even still, being successful at raid content in this game is less a matter of skill/gear and more a matter of luck and beating bugs.
It's your choice whether to take advice or not. But my suggestions are coming from the perspective of somebody who has been doing this boss 2-3 times per week for 2 1/2 months. The healing really isn't as intense as the OP made it out to be and if your raid cannot survive when one or both healers is incapacitated, you have larger problems than "rng."

As for "bug fixes", the fight was directly nerfed. Balls were nerfed to do less damage. Mind traps were nerfed to have less health. The number of balls spawning was nerfed in phase 3. The whirlwind & mindtrap rng was nerfed so that you wouldn't have the healer out of an entire phase. LITERALLY one night I didn't see but 20 seconds of phase 2 on multiple attempts. This is not a bug fix. This is manipulating the mechanic to make it easier for groups to down it. In addition, the raid warning announcement of who is being targetted by balls was implemented. This is a HUGE nerf as this was one of the most difficult parts of the fight initially.

Being successful in raids right now does not take a lot of gear or skill, I agree. But it has nothing to do with rng. Name one single fight that is rng-centric. Sure there are attempts that are more difficult than others because of luck, but that doesn't prevent you from downing the boss. The number of ACTUAL bugs in the endgame right now is SIGNIFICANTLY lower than these forums would let on.

TL;DR: Stop blaming your lack of progress on rng or bugs. There ARE bugs and there ARE some attempts that are more complicated because of luck, but you can overcome them with organization, communication, and a tiny bit of skill. Come to these forums for suggestions and help, but if you're too stubborn to listen, don't blame the game for your own failings.
A home for busy adults seeking high level PvE in a respectful, mature atmosphere.
Ferne R'y | Sage

Inzi's Avatar


Inzi
03.20.2012 , 06:12 PM | #15
Quote: Originally Posted by Codek View Post
Sure when the healer lands and the other is broken free, there is a ton of damage to be healed up for but that's the exact moment cooldowns are made for. I've never really noticed an issue with getting everyone at least at 50% by the time the next air toss occurs and setting priory immediately to who gets the orbs next.
/agree

To add to this real quick, something I've found that helps in this exact scenario is to call out exactly who I'm going to heal. That way both healers are more effective at topping the raid off.
A home for busy adults seeking high level PvE in a respectful, mature atmosphere.
Ferne R'y | Sage

Merraith's Avatar


Merraith
03.20.2012 , 09:11 PM | #16
About the only thing in this fight that can kill you timing wise is eating a ball and getting tossed immediately after. This is a perfect situation to save medpacks for, or healers to throw hots on someone right after they explode their ball (They did nerf the hell out of this fight when they tell you with Giant Red Letters who lightning balls are targeting...surprisingly enough these will be the same people you should worry about landing a hot on quickly, amazing how simple that idea is). You do get a combat rezz for a reason. All the other "RNG" claims are situations that good communication and play can solve by having a plan to deal with.

If a healer getting tossed and one in the trap suddenly means your raid dies, your dps needs to break them out faster and the raid needs to figure their **** out. The only person who should be taking damage in this scenario is the tank and the healer in the air. Everyone else can maintain until they break the trap and the tank can pop cooldowns.

Gavin_Darkl's Avatar


Gavin_Darkl
03.20.2012 , 09:20 PM | #17
Quote: Originally Posted by Siksix View Post
Scenario 5: One person is targeted by an orb and gets picked up, you have milliseconds to pop the Orb in this case or the Orb will just wander through the raid until the guy thats flying lands at too low health to survive the blast from the Orb thats waiting for him.
I got this Bug 3 times in a row, I popped the LB once but then when I was in the air I was already dead. What you have posted here are good examples of bugs and a lack of proper testing.

Gavin_Darkl's Avatar


Gavin_Darkl
03.20.2012 , 09:22 PM | #18
There was 1 other situations that you did not say here. It happen to us tonight. Our healer died when he was at full health No where near another LB or other people. He ran into the LB, LB did not pop 3 seconds later healer was Dead LB gone.

Turst's Avatar


Turst
03.21.2012 , 04:11 PM | #19
Quote: Originally Posted by Inzi View Post
TL;DR: Stop blaming your lack of progress on rng or bugs. There ARE bugs and there ARE some attempts that are more complicated because of luck, but you can overcome them with organization, communication, and a tiny bit of skill. Come to these forums for suggestions and help, but if you're too stubborn to listen, don't blame the game for your own failings.
I'm not "blaming" any lack of progress on anything. My guild didn't start operations until about a month ago, once a week. We've cleared 4/5 HM EV and will be doing KP this week on HM and I'm completely satisfied with that. I could care less where my progress stands compared to other guilds.

The intent of my original post was to agree with the OP, I just happened to come across your "holier-than-thou" snotty post and thought it needed to be responded to. In addition, when the boss resets 3 times in a row because someone got stuck when the floor fell out from under us.. I think I can safely blame the game if I so choose. Those 3 in a row came just after we spent an hour fighting a bug on the council (fight>reset>fight>reset...). Oh, and did I mention the puzzle bug? Bug after bug after bug after bug.

Excuse me for expecting end-game content to work properly when the game has been out for 3 months.