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Is Revan overrated?


TeH-DeVa's Avatar


TeH-DeVa
03.06.2012 , 07:19 PM | #471
Quote: Originally Posted by Rayla_Felana View Post
Malak was nothing like weak, how was Revan stronger than any other Jedi of the time? got a substantive quote for that? or is it merely your opinion, also he did not single-handedly defeat the Mandalorians, both Alek and Surik were leaders that won him many vital battles, Surik more than anyone, without her force bonding technique and her great power of persuasion and inspiring loyalty, Dxun could not have been taken by anybody.

She also masterminded the entire battle of Malachor V.
It's explained many times that Revan was the one behind the entire war. Both strategys and on the frontline. He obviously has people there to help him win certain battles as does every commanding officer but he was still the key and reason it was won.

Malak was very weak and knew he would never beat revan. That's why he fired on his ship.
The BellHat Legacy
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-The Legendary Bounty Hunter 'Deva' Path of the Starsider and Bria server in SWG-

Airmo's Avatar


Airmo
03.06.2012 , 07:19 PM | #472
Quote: Originally Posted by Rayla_Felana View Post
"I remember the look you had when you turned to me. It was the longest you'd ever looked at me. You didn't say anything—just a nod. Events move quickly then, even in my dreams. Flashes, explosions, you—falling. I could feel the pain around me. And then the memory. The drifting hulks of the Mandalorian ships, the dead—allies, friends, strangers. And then the echo. Lingering. The sound I awaken to in my nightmares."
―Bao-Dur to Surik


"Finally, as the fighting grew intense, Meetra Surik observed that the Mandalorians had taken the bait and that her trap was set to spring. With a nod of her head, she commanded Bao-Dur to activate the secret weapon. Moments later, she watched in horror as a significant portion of both fleets were suddenly drawn from orbit into a vast gravity vortex that was powerful enough to crush the countless ships into the planet's crust and fracture the world to its very core."

A mix of KotOR 2 dialogue with Bao-Dur and the Knights of the Old Republic roleplaying game manual character descriptions.
I thought it was said it was Revan's plan? I think it was in a timeline video or something.. good chance I'm wrong though so. I'll have to check.
"Darkness is a friend, an ally. Darkness allows us to understand others, to see what they value when they believe no one else is looking. It allows us to be honest with ourselves, to express those values that we would disavow in the light. The light blinds us. It is only in the dark that we see clearly."

TeH-DeVa's Avatar


TeH-DeVa
03.06.2012 , 07:20 PM | #473
Quote: Originally Posted by Rayla_Felana View Post
"I remember the look you had when you turned to me. It was the longest you'd ever looked at me. You didn't say anything—just a nod. Events move quickly then, even in my dreams. Flashes, explosions, you—falling. I could feel the pain around me. And then the memory. The drifting hulks of the Mandalorian ships, the dead—allies, friends, strangers. And then the echo. Lingering. The sound I awaken to in my nightmares."
―Bao-Dur to Surik


"Finally, as the fighting grew intense, Meetra Surik observed that the Mandalorians had taken the bait and that her trap was set to spring. With a nod of her head, she commanded Bao-Dur to activate the secret weapon. Moments later, she watched in horror as a significant portion of both fleets were suddenly drawn from orbit into a vast gravity vortex that was powerful enough to crush the countless ships into the planet's crust and fracture the world to its very core."

A mix of KotOR 2 dialogue with Bao-Dur and the Knights of the Old Republic roleplaying game manual character descriptions.
this game deemed kotor 2 to never exist...they took apart biowares story it was done by a different company...anything kotor says overwrites what kotor 2 said...and kotor 2 noted revan as the hero of the mandalorian wars

*edit* it'd be as if some star wars fan created star wars episode 7 and decided everything that happened 1-6 happened differant and decided to add their own things to it (kotor 2)...and then geroge lucas created his own ep 7 and decided to pretend the stupid fans never existed (tor)
The BellHat Legacy
Forever rocking the Bell Hat!
Beleka! The tiny but legendary Chiss Merc Arsenal of the Jung Ma Server
-The Legendary Bounty Hunter 'Deva' Path of the Starsider and Bria server in SWG-

Wolfninjajedi's Avatar


Wolfninjajedi
03.06.2012 , 07:20 PM | #474
Quote: Originally Posted by TeH-DeVa View Post
That excuse could be used once...maybe twice...possibly even three times. But the Jedi allowed the entire galaxy to be ravaged by the empire many many many many many many times. It was always because they believed the Sith to be gone and became arrogant and content with their power. They decided the sith would be gone forever and decided to just sith on their council and feel invincable.

The sith and jedi are just as evil as another it just depends on how you look at them.

Anakin skywalker brought balance to the force not by defeating the sith but by removing both sith and light from the galaxy. One can not exist without the other and as long as one remains the other will as well. The only true peace and balance to the galaxy means there is neither. That is why when luke restarted the Jedi order the sith immediately returned many times.
Well considering the sith hadn't been around for a very long time up until TPM, of course they would think the sith are gone thats not being arrogant thats just something they believed up until Maul showed up. Arrogant by definition is exaggerating one's importance or abilities, we never see the jedi say

"Oh hey were better then some army of clones, lets not use them and win this war by ourselves."

Never did they say that, they knew what their limitations were.
"There is one lesson you've yet to learn. How to become one with the Force!"
―Cin Drallig to Darth Vader

Maucs the Tauntaun King, former SWG player.

Airmo's Avatar


Airmo
03.06.2012 , 07:23 PM | #475
The Mass Shadow Generator was created by the Zabrak tech specialist Bao-Dur, under orders from the Jedi Knight Revan, in the year 3,960 BBY. The weapon was the centerpiece of a trap with which Revan hoped to bring about a conclusive end to the Mandalorian Wars. Overseeing the device's use was Jedi General Meetra Surik who would later come to be known as the Jedi Exile. Revan lured the Mandalorians to Malachor V, and a massive fleet battle ensued in orbit. During the fighting, Surik commanded Bao-Dur to activate the secret weapon with a single, silent nod. Moments later, a significant portion of both fleets were suddenly drawn from orbit into a vast gravity vortex that was powerful enough to crush the countless ships into the planet's crust and fracture Malachor V to its very core.[1]

http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Mass_Shadow_Generator

It sounds like it was more Revan's plan here.
"Darkness is a friend, an ally. Darkness allows us to understand others, to see what they value when they believe no one else is looking. It allows us to be honest with ourselves, to express those values that we would disavow in the light. The light blinds us. It is only in the dark that we see clearly."

TeH-DeVa's Avatar


TeH-DeVa
03.06.2012 , 07:23 PM | #476
Quote: Originally Posted by Wolfninjajedi View Post
Well considering the sith hadn't been around for a very long time up until TPM, of course they would think the sith are gone thats not being arrogant thats just something they believed up until Maul showed up. Arrogant by definition is exaggerating one's importance or abilities, we never see the jedi say

"Oh hey were better then some army of clones, lets not use them and win this war by ourselves."

Never did they say that, they knew what their limitations were.
No. The sith never were defeated at all. They had existed for about 500+ years before episode 1 and had never once been gone. The jedi just were to lazy to look and find the clues around them.

Yes we do see the Jedi that way. It's the entire reason palpatine rose to power and was able to stand infront of them without them knowing. They believed themselves these great people and all powerful yet were so weak and arrogant and unknowing.
The BellHat Legacy
Forever rocking the Bell Hat!
Beleka! The tiny but legendary Chiss Merc Arsenal of the Jung Ma Server
-The Legendary Bounty Hunter 'Deva' Path of the Starsider and Bria server in SWG-

TeH-DeVa's Avatar


TeH-DeVa
03.06.2012 , 07:24 PM | #477
Quote: Originally Posted by Airmo View Post
The Mass Shadow Generator was created by the Zabrak tech specialist Bao-Dur, under orders from the Jedi Knight Revan, in the year 3,960 BBY. The weapon was the centerpiece of a trap with which Revan hoped to bring about a conclusive end to the Mandalorian Wars. Overseeing the device's use was Jedi General Meetra Surik who would later come to be known as the Jedi Exile. Revan lured the Mandalorians to Malachor V, and a massive fleet battle ensued in orbit. During the fighting, Surik commanded Bao-Dur to activate the secret weapon with a single, silent nod. Moments later, a significant portion of both fleets were suddenly drawn from orbit into a vast gravity vortex that was powerful enough to crush the countless ships into the planet's crust and fracture Malachor V to its very core.[1]

http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Mass_Shadow_Generator

It sounds like it was more Revan's plan here.
You have to remember there are kotor 2 fanbois as well who like to insult the revan fanbois.
The BellHat Legacy
Forever rocking the Bell Hat!
Beleka! The tiny but legendary Chiss Merc Arsenal of the Jung Ma Server
-The Legendary Bounty Hunter 'Deva' Path of the Starsider and Bria server in SWG-

Rayla_Felana's Avatar


Rayla_Felana
03.06.2012 , 07:25 PM | #478
Quote: Originally Posted by Airmo View Post
Yes I know that.

Traya tricked Nihilus but how did Surik? He tried to feed on her force power but he couldn't so then they just fought, that was more Traya's doing then Surik. By leading him to a place with promise of food but then he never got any and the hunger was weakening him.

While I agree Traya is a master and most certainly ****** in her own right I think her power was more in manipulation and deception then anything else, I don't think she would stand a chance in a fight with Sion and Nihilus. Agreed on the test thing.
Surik tricked im twice, first by taunting him into feeding on her, then by making him battle Visas, she was force bonded to him, by making him fight her, she disrupted their force bond, which weakened him even more.

In actual combat they would win because of their nature, but she had no weaknesses, there was nothing to exploit, and her knowledge was very difficult to overcome, she had skill in everything, but she trained Surik so well, she had been overtaken, the reason I believe she could defeat Nihilus and Sion, is because she already has, by using Surik as the weapon to do that, as is Traya's way.

Rayla_Felana's Avatar


Rayla_Felana
03.06.2012 , 07:27 PM | #479
Quote: Originally Posted by Airmo View Post
I thought it was said it was Revan's plan? I think it was in a timeline video or something.. good chance I'm wrong though so. I'll have to check.
The timelines are written specifically in Master Gnost-Dural's knowledge, and Erickson stated himself, any differences are because he wasn't exactly correct, he was using popular knowledge and history, Surik was forgotten in time.

Wolfninjajedi's Avatar


Wolfninjajedi
03.06.2012 , 07:29 PM | #480
Quote: Originally Posted by TeH-DeVa View Post
No. The sith never were defeated at all. They had existed for about 500+ years before episode 1 and had never once been gone. The jedi just were to lazy to look and find the clues around them.

Yes we do see the Jedi that way. It's the entire reason palpatine rose to power and was able to stand infront of them without them knowing. They believed themselves these great people and all powerful yet were so weak and arrogant and unknowing.
Did I say the sith were defeated? No, I said they were gone for a long time up until their re-appearance in EP 1, and the jedi did search for them they just didn't have any idea where to look.

What? How does Palpatine standing in front of them, make the jedi arrogant? If they were truly arrogant and believed they were all knowing, they wouldn't have the whole "clouded the future is" no they would make something up and say thats what would happen.
"There is one lesson you've yet to learn. How to become one with the Force!"
―Cin Drallig to Darth Vader

Maucs the Tauntaun King, former SWG player.