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The reason Sorcerer/Sage CC is OP in PvP

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > PvP
The reason Sorcerer/Sage CC is OP in PvP

Tumri's Avatar


Tumri
02.15.2012 , 05:40 PM | #361
Quote: Originally Posted by Chaostie View Post
You can have a good number of them, but you most definitely cannot have them ALL. And if you take as any as you can, the only thing you're going to be able to do is CC, forget any viable healing or damage.
1. Yes you can. Read the original post. Look at the specs linked.

2. HEALING? You want to be able to have HEALING talents too?

3. You lose minor DPS talents when speccing for all the CC.
Wrath
Pre-Launch Hardcore Guild that has moved on to better games.
www.wrathnation.com

Tumri's Avatar


Tumri
02.15.2012 , 05:41 PM | #362
Quote: Originally Posted by shaidarlol View Post
no, i am not saying that at all. i'm simply saying since apparently in your case, skill can and does over come these imbalance/overpowered abilities. wouldn't that suggest it's not the abilities in question that are overpowered, but the player base lacking in skill?
If a sorcerer rolling his face on the keyboard can be worth more than a player that is doing fairly well but may not be playing perfectly there is a problem. Skill can overcome but that's not an argument for balance. Sorcerer skill floor is fairly high but their skill ceiling isn't that low either. At equal skill levels a Sorcerer is currently the best class for PvP by a decent margin. This means at a LOW skill level they are the best class. At a HIGH skill level they are still the best class. At any place on the skill spectrum where two players are the same the Sorcerer is better. If I played a Sorcerer I would do better than on my Marauder by a decent margin.

This is not balanced.
Wrath
Pre-Launch Hardcore Guild that has moved on to better games.
www.wrathnation.com

shaidarlol's Avatar


shaidarlol
02.15.2012 , 05:44 PM | #363
Quote: Originally Posted by Tumri View Post
If a sorcerer rolling his face on the keyboard can be worth more than a player that is doing fairly well but may not be playing perfectly there is a problem. Skill can overcome but that's not an argument for balance.
we have different ideas what imbalance is then, because to me when something is imbalanced, skill cannot overcome it.

edit: the 2nd part of your last post to me is pure speculation, because you can never prove this by any means currently.

Tumri's Avatar


Tumri
02.15.2012 , 05:46 PM | #364
Quote: Originally Posted by shaidarlol View Post
we have different ideas what imbalance is then, because to me when something is imbalanced skill can't overcome it.
That's not imbalanced then. It's just simply broken beyond belief. An imbalance is a significant advantage. Skill also provides a significant advantage. If a highly skilled player can do far better on one class when compared to another that's imbalanced.
Wrath
Pre-Launch Hardcore Guild that has moved on to better games.
www.wrathnation.com

shaidarlol's Avatar


shaidarlol
02.15.2012 , 05:51 PM | #365
Quote: Originally Posted by Tumri View Post
That's not imbalanced then. It's just simply broken beyond belief. An imbalance is a significant advantage. Skill also provides a significant advantage. If a highly skilled player can do far better on one class when compared to another that's imbalanced.
ok, so is there a sorcerer on your server that you can say is as good as you are?
and if that player exists, will you show me a screen shot of such performance?

edit: i think if you can't provide this screen shot, i will have to say your last post holds no merit, which can be further implied to your OP.

booshido's Avatar


booshido
02.15.2012 , 06:00 PM | #366
Quote: Originally Posted by Lormif View Post
And harpoon is all you need. You know force run only takes you 30meters right? So it is not like you could not harpoon me, knights can jump to me if I run from them.. It is not like my run is guaranteed to get me away. In fact after one person it becomes exponentially more difficult to get away.
What you aren't realizing is that sorcs/sages are not bound like gospel to what the other healers/dps have to abide by.

I'm an IA Medic, and the moment I get focused I have to LoS if I don't have guard on me. This usually means I have popped my shield probe. Sorcs/Sages? Yeah, they can LoS if they want but they can hang out longer in the fray because they have a sprint that can get them to the warzone health boost or LoS at the last moment.

As the example you provided, all a sorc has to do is have their short CDs up and it's EZ mode. Regardless what the proponents claim, Sorcs/Sages have a low skillcap. I wouldn't call it facerolling, but it IS low. So, you get charged by melee, you have so many options, it makes me sad when I look at my IA. CC? KB? Snare? Bubble? Sprint?

I'm not an advocate for nerfing Sorcs, I AM AND ADVOCATE FOR OTHER CLASSES HAVING MORE UTILITY.

Two examples to request this:

I was at a pvp event on my server. All the high-end pvpers were there. All the names you see in WZs and think to yourself..."yes, this will be a good game." ------- I saw 1 IA Medic (me), 2 snipers, and 1 scrapper. The rest were force users or BHs. There were at one point over 50 people there.

The other example is -- why the hell can't I put my ****** "moderate" shield on other people? It makes no sense. IA medics are known to be weaker in both pvp and pve, and it's things like this that makes us weak.

TD:LR

Sorcs/sages don't need nerfs - the rest of us need more utility.

Tumri's Avatar


Tumri
02.15.2012 , 06:00 PM | #367
Quote: Originally Posted by shaidarlol View Post
ok, so is there a sorcerer on your server that you can say is as good as you are?
and if that player exists, will you show me a screen shot of such performance?

edit: i think if you can't provide this screen shot, i will have to say your last post holds no merit, which can be further implied to your OP.
First of all the fact that you don't even know what an imbalance is makes me question the validity of your posts on a topic about class balance. How you think everything that can be overcome by a MASSIVE skill advantage is balanced is beyond me. It's completely silly to think of game balance that way.

Second of all I don't take screenshots when other people beat me. Not on purpose anyways. One Sorcerer named "Nytran" regularly matches or beats my damage though. On top of that he provides FAR more utility. All I'm good for in a WZ is one AoE immobilize once every 1.5 minutes(he can do this on a 20s CD) and damage(He can do more by virtue of being ranged in group PvP and therefore harder to focus/kill).

Edit: one of my screenshots shows him about 90k above me. i must have missed it and took the screenshot since it wasn't sorted by damage. http://i.imgur.com/j1x4v.jpg

Edit2: Nytran is one of the only Sorcerers I've met that bothers to use half a braincell in PvP. He's one of the few that actually bother to use Force Slow and Whirlwind in WZs.
Wrath
Pre-Launch Hardcore Guild that has moved on to better games.
www.wrathnation.com

Lormif's Avatar


Lormif
02.15.2012 , 06:03 PM | #368
Quote: Originally Posted by booshido View Post
What you aren't realizing is that sorcs/sages are not bound like gospel to what the other healers/dps have to abide by.

I'm an IA Medic, and the moment I get focused I have to LoS if I don't have guard on me. This usually means I have popped my shield probe. Sorcs/Sages? Yeah, they can LoS if they want but they can hang out longer in the fray because they have a sprint that can get them to the warzone health boost or LoS at the last moment.

As the example you provided, all a sorc has to do is have their short CDs up and it's EZ mode. Regardless what the proponents claim, Sorcs/Sages have a low skillcap. I wouldn't call it facerolling, but it IS low. So, you get charged by melee, you have so many options, it makes me sad when I look at my IA. CC? KB? Snare? Bubble? Sprint?

I'm not an advocate for nerfing Sorcs, I AM AND ADVOCATE FOR OTHER CLASSES HAVING MORE UTILITY.

Two examples to request this:

I was at a pvp event on my server. All the high-end pvpers were there. All the names you see in WZs and think to yourself..."yes, this will be a good game." ------- I saw 1 IA Medic (me), 2 snipers, and 1 scrapper. The rest were force users or BHs. There were at one point over 50 people there.

The other example is -- why the hell can't I put my ****** "moderate" shield on other people? It makes no sense. IA medics are known to be weaker in both pvp and pve, and it's things like this that makes us weak.

TD:LR

Sorcs/sages don't need nerfs - the rest of us need more utility.
this is not about healing spec.

Lormif's Avatar


Lormif
02.15.2012 , 06:06 PM | #369
Quote: Originally Posted by Tumri View Post
First of all the fact that you don't even know what an imbalance is makes me question the validity of your posts on a topic about class balance. How you think everything that can be overcome by a MASSIVE skill advantage is balanced is beyond me. It's completely silly to think of game balance that way.

Second of all I don't take screenshots when other people beat me. Not on purpose anyways. One Sorcerer named "Nytran" regularly matches or beats my damage though. On top of that he provides FAR more utility. All I'm good for in a WZ is one AoE immobilize once every 1.5 minutes(he can do this on a 20s CD) and damage(He can do more by virtue of being ranged in group PvP and therefore harder to focus/kill).

Edit: one of my screenshots shows him about 90k above me. i must have missed it and took the screenshot since it wasn't sorted by damage. http://i.imgur.com/j1x4v.jpg
The fact that you cant understand that the topic is subjective is part of your issue...

booshido's Avatar


booshido
02.15.2012 , 06:07 PM | #370
My point still remains. Your utility is too powerful. To argue against is simply foolish and you've fallen in love with your class and enjoy the ease to put up big numbers.

And last I checked, Sorc healers are more of a ***** to take down than dps, so yes, I made a post about Sorcs as the title of the thread described.