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Karagga's Palace - G4-BC


Poochymama's Avatar


Poochymama
02.07.2012 , 08:31 PM | #21
Quote: Originally Posted by Merraith View Post
When you're getting the damage buff on every burn and landing 12K+ hits it more than makes up for it.
I'm positive that's what they were going for, and that is no doubt the reason that the normal mode has more health, but in the end someone goofed up the numbers. A little math makes this somewhat obvious.

Ex:

Raid A has 6000 raid dps normally (a made up figure). With a 30% up-time on the fire debuff for normal mode(good estimate for normal mode assuming 2 good solvers ), and a 15% up-time on hard mode(using left,right,left,right), over the course of 6 mins, Raid A will average about

9600 dps on Normal Mode
and
7800 dps on Hard Mode

So, going from Hard mode to Normal mode, a raid can expect about a 20% (give or take a few %) increase in overall raid dps. To account for this, BioWare gave the normal mode boss more HP. Unfortunately, they increased his health by more than the aforementioned 20%. Hard mode to Normal mode, you're looking at a 1.5 to 2.1 mil health increase, or a 40% health increase. Obviously something is amiss here, either increase the Hard Mode version's health, or decrease the Normal Mode version's health.

That being said, neither fight is particularly challenging when compared to what we've seen in other MMO's, but the Normal mode does require significantly more dps in order to avoid enrage. On top of that, Hard Mode also has the added benefit of either of the other 2 guns, and also seems to spawn less droids.

Go try the hard mode, you'll be pleasantly surprised at just how much easier it is than the normal mode.

Merraith's Avatar


Merraith
02.07.2012 , 09:06 PM | #22
Quote: Originally Posted by Poochymama View Post
but the Normal mode does require significantly more dps in order to avoid enrage. On top of that, Hard Mode also has the added benefit of either of the other 2 guns, and also seems to spawn less droids.

Go try the hard mode, you'll be pleasantly surprised at just how much easier it is than the normal mode.
The bolded part is absolutely not true when taking into account the damage buff you have up every burn. I have no idea what you guys are doing as far as your dps lineup or where you're having them placed during this fight but it's not even close. We killed Nightmare and Normal last week, did Nightmare again tonight, and it's just not the case. Wouldn't even know Normal had an enrage until I read it from threads about this. 1 shot it every week including last one. Should be great fun running normal again later this week laughing about people claiming it's harder than hard mode fights.

Stabbitha's Avatar


Stabbitha
02.07.2012 , 09:52 PM | #23
We got him down a couple of nights ago by letting our button guys practice getting their turn around time down as low as possible (we now get a solve in about 27 seconds which means you get the 20 second debuff time + 7seconds to clear up stun droids). Remember, you can light up the towers without actually agro'ing the boss, so if you're having a slow turn around on solves or your dps is lacking, it's good to get up to the best speed possible on firing the debuffs.

I OT as shieldtech and we have a jugg MT him (the superior defense left the jugg with stacks falling completely off him without needing to taunt some of the time as the boss just wouldn't get a hit to reapply it). BH and dps jugg on buttons, 1 healer up, one down, just do 1/2/1/2/1/2 (don't bother with 3 or it's stun droids, they won't aggro you at point 2) and our dps popped adrenals every CD. On the last rotation (just under 10% health to go, 5.45 or so) we got our button pushers to come down to add dps and got him about 5 seconds after enrage went off.

For droids, I usually cable pull the droid from the other pad when the spawn so they are together then carbonise. Then we just aoe them down (flamethrower/sorc lightning storm etc) on top of the boss with no loss of dps. Our button pushers pop or throw back mines on the consoles (bh merc can self heal, jugg can survive and our top healer tops them off).

Getting the debuff is far more important than button pushers helping with dps while he's vulnerable (we tried 3 button pushers then we'd run down to do dps but it always left us 25% odd at enrage).

As a casual friends guild, we were quite chuffed at getting this guy down as it was a technically demanding fight.

unipwn's Avatar


unipwn
02.07.2012 , 10:05 PM | #24
I don't get how you can fail to it on normal, and no it is not easier on hard mode.
Normal mode is so easy we just use 1 healer to solve the puzzle alone and have all the dps on the boss full time, we also used this tactic on hard mode, but we had to change it to 3, one at each terminal on nightmare.

The content is already easy enough, if you start shouting for pve nerf most players will leave the game due to no challenge which is barely there already.

I have even taken pugs who only just dinged 50 and learned them the fight and got them through it with no problems.

Poochymama's Avatar


Poochymama
02.08.2012 , 02:36 AM | #25
Quote: Originally Posted by Merraith View Post
The bolded part is absolutely not true when taking into account the damage buff you have up every burn. I have no idea what you guys are doing as far as your dps lineup or where you're having them placed during this fight but it's not even close. We killed Nightmare and Normal last week, did Nightmare again tonight, and it's just not the case. Wouldn't even know Normal had an enrage until I read it from threads about this. 1 shot it every week including last one. Should be great fun running normal again later this week laughing about people claiming it's harder than hard mode fights.
I would say that nightmare is possibly a harder enrage to beat, but Normal is definitely harder than Hard.

It's really not even up for debate. You get a 20%ish raid dps increase by having double the fire debuff time on Normal, but you have to burn through 40% more life. Not hard to see that the enrage is harder to meet on Normal.

Poochymama's Avatar


Poochymama
02.08.2012 , 02:37 AM | #26
Quote: Originally Posted by unipwn View Post
I don't get how you can fail to it on normal, and no it is not easier on hard mode.
Normal mode is so easy we just use 1 healer to solve the puzzle alone and have all the dps on the boss full time, we also used this tactic on hard mode, but we had to change it to 3, one at each terminal on nightmare.

The content is already easy enough, if you start shouting for pve nerf most players will leave the game due to no challenge which is barely there already.

I have even taken pugs who only just dinged 50 and learned them the fight and got them through it with no problems.
The enrage is harder to meet on normal. You have to burn through 40% more life but you only get a 20%ish increase in raid dps.

unipwn's Avatar


unipwn
02.08.2012 , 03:07 AM | #27
Quote: Originally Posted by Poochymama View Post
The enrage is harder to meet on normal. You have to burn through 40% more life but you only get a 20%ish increase in raid dps.
It's not hard you must be doing something totally wrong. It's not for fun me and others are saying it. KP is actually getting pugged on my server, so I really think you must be doing something totally wrong, or just plain bad dps.

-Neomop-'s Avatar


-Neomop-
02.08.2012 , 04:09 AM | #28
Quote: Originally Posted by Poochymama View Post
The enrage is harder to meet on normal. You have to burn through 40% more life but you only get a 20%ish increase in raid dps.
When will you UNDERSTAND that EVERY ONE of the debuffs in normal mode apply molten armor for your dps burns???

There's a reason why there's 40% more HP and that's because in HM only one of the cannons apply molten armor.

Since you can't use the same cannon twice, you have more than twice the time to burn him while he has molten armor debuff on compared to a HM fight.

DivisionBell's Avatar


DivisionBell
02.08.2012 , 04:12 AM | #29
Quote:
The bolded part is absolutely not true when taking into account the damage buff you have up every burn. I have no idea what you guys are doing as far as your dps lineup or where you're having them placed during this fight but it's not even close. We killed Nightmare and Normal last week, did Nightmare again tonight, and it's just not the case. Wouldn't even know Normal had an enrage until I read it from threads about this. 1 shot it every week including last one. Should be great fun running normal again later this week laughing about people claiming it's harder than hard mode fights.

Merraith, I really don't know why you bother posting in these threads. Why not offer some constructive help instead of (in every post) bumming yourself! You can claim to have one shotteded it all day mate but, I don't believe you and it helps no one. In any case I digress...

Took our guild a couple of nights to get this guy down on normal and, it's a clear step up in difficulty compared to any other boss in both raids (on normal).

After a number of different methods, what worked for us was, 3 guys just doing the consoles as fast as possible. Two tanks switching about 5 stacks of the debuff and only burning the boss on the right and middle points. One healer up top and the other on the bottom.

Managing the stun droids at the bottom and the mines at the top is key to the fight. We found that using knock-backs on the two stun droids round the fire points worked really well (trooper concussion round and guardian force push). The guys on the consoles either popped the mines and healed or, again used knock-backs to push them down.

Once you get the rhythm of the fight, it isn't too bad.
"You who is without mercy now pleeds for it?"

Hojdar's Avatar


Hojdar
02.08.2012 , 04:17 AM | #30
We had 3 clickers, one of them was melee, so when we burned the boss he jumped down to dps, then a healer or dps pulled him up again for fast clicks. 3 clicks really speeds this up. Also, we had two tanks switching aggro ofc, aswell as a melee dps downstairs taking out the stun droids.

My guild had enrage timers on other bosses, but after getting a rythm going with the three clickers, doing this before the enrage was no probs.