COMMUNITY

Hey all,

no I wasnt banned. Not that someone thinks because I went silent. It just saddened me so much, that for a time I just did not know what to say anymore.

I am grateful Bioware has opened the thread again, and allowed the words gay and lesbian now. Though I can't hide that I am quite disappointed. Bioware games had always been about complex ethical questions, about vast, diverse realities, and as such I had never expect Bioware of all companies to be so... narrow in this question. I was a Bioware fan so long... it was really a shock to see the thread closed.

Thanks to all the supporters, and even those who in civilized words disagreed, since debating things is what makes a modern society work.

To those who find this debate inapropriate, I want to say this: It is really not my desire to offend people, and trust me, fighting a fight over a trivial computer game is really the LAST thing I would want to do. Or fight at all! I hate fighting, I hate the need to argue with people, but it is the sheer necessity that drives me to fight this fight, because I feel it is a necessity, something of higher importance than my personal peace. Believe me, no one would wish more than me than I would not have to do this, than GLBT people would be "just part of humanity", a normal trait as if someone had blue or brown eyes. But my friends, that is not the case. That is not the reality I live in. The reality is, that being gay or lesbian still is something DIFFERENT. It is not that we fight over the usage of the words "straight" or"heterosexual".


I want to keep this civil and serious. If you find this debate uninteresting, ok, but please be so kind and then just stay out of it. Despite the hurt, I understand when you are straight, it might be difficult to really understand how it is, not to be. What it means just to be regarded as nonexistend, or as an offense. We accept the usage of the word gay as something bad like a cosmic event, like an unalterable fate.

It is not we GLBT people who brought politics into game, it is those who used our name as bad words and those who want to forbid calling ourselves as we chose. We have no started this, but we will not yield either, because for us it is of essential important to be recognized in our existence, and that there are no places like "here are no gays allowed". Once in America there were places where "No Blacks where allowed". Was that right?


I have said what I wanted to say, and as glad as I am of this turn, I will keep a cautious eye on this. But why we always have to fight for our rights... I dont know. I never understand this, what we have done to you that you treat as like dirt. I just dont know.

Edit: Times changed, it seems

So, nevermind

Very well then, but you did delete threads in which it was being discussed instead of just pruning the trolls and flames correct? And since you deigned to grant me a direct reply, I'll ask you again, if the terms "gay" and "lesbian" do not exist in Star Wars (although quite frankly I don't know how you can make such an assertion as you are not a Lucasarts employee and have no say over Star Wars canon), then how should Juhani's, Goran Beviin's and Medrit Vasur's preference for members of the same sex be referred to?


Notice though is this thread he never said there weren't, he just said that the terms didn't exist, although quite frankly that's almost obviously playing with semantics from someone who has no idea about canon. And considering this being said on the forums of the company that created a lesbian character in KotOR I find it rather astounding.

The voice of the public really can make a difference and brilliant to see.

Bioware I'm certain didn't censor the words to cause offence and instead to try and stop any kind of misuse of the words. Like I said in my post, it's a very grey area politically and something that can cause problems whatever way you look at it.

All credit to Bioware though for rethinking the action and I sincerely hope the decision won't lead to multiple cases in which people misuse the words. I'm sure Bioware will be wanting to focus on the game development rather than getting involved in these kind of political issues.

Juhani isn't a lesbian, it was a dialogue glitch. Same with Visas in KotOR II.

If you wanted to go for a same-sex relationship in a Bioware game, Liara in Mass Effect comes to mind . . .

Well - Bioware have basically just shown they can be "black mailed" to change policy based on acting out.
Whether the words should be censored or not I care little about - because this is a gaming site and not a sexual orientation website and they're not something I'll use in the context of the computer game - but I find it unsettling how easy it seems to be to get Bioware to "back down".

I think they just opened up for a whole batch of trouble.

Jade Empire? Then again, that was just "Fade to black" before anything was seen.

Easy? What was easy about this?

And why is changing your mind based on a debate bad? Would it be better if everyone in the world stubbornly holds to his opinion no matter what?

Straights are very straight in computer games, so it isnt WE GLBT people who brought sexual orientation to games. Love and sexual themes exist in games. There are tons of open straight characters in games! None of THEM ever hides their sexual orientation. So why must we?

And you of course have proof of this? And I guess all the not too subtle inferences are glitches too? Like when Belaya says they'd spend nights alone under the stars? And how Dak Vesser wasn't her "type"?

Wrong, Liara wasn't female, the Asari and mono-gendered, there is no male and female, so even if female Sheppard and Liara "got it on" it's not a same sex relationship because Sheppard is female and Liara is a mono-gender.

I am perfectly aware that the Asari are mono-gendered, but for all intents and purposes it is a lesbian relationship between her and female Shepard.

And of course you have proof that it's not a glitch?