Sith Assassins Are Bad for DPS Raiding

Why is the advanced class called Assassins again?

I did my first raid yesterday. been thrown out of groups before but let me tell you its about the group.

Yes we are squishy and melee and cant do much about it. But I am pretty sure I was out DPSing the operative when It came to bossess. For ow hp enemies, he could destroy them before I could. However, for sustained damage when I could stand behind then boss and let rip, I doing pretty decent damage.

I am pure deception, with 2 decent pieces of gear. Remember popping relic, using procs and I could hit decent numbers easy. On a VS, VS, Maul, VS,VS, Shock,Disharge kinda rotation I was doing 800 VS, 3k maul, 2.5k discharge, 2.5k shock and 2.5k assassinates

For one rotation that becomes 3200+3k+2.5k+2.5k = 11k. at under 30% enemy health add assassinate and its pretty decent.

I dont really care about the number the op was belting out, but there is not way he could out damage this over say 4 rotations which is how long your force would last if done properly.

It's pretty trivial to DPS in Dark Charge, just start in Lightning Charge and switch stance during one of the obvious break points in most raids. If no such things exist, you might have to take a slight DPS hit at the start, though Energize really doesn't add that much DPS so you could just DPS in Lightning Charge even if you're Darkness speced if you're not worried about AEs.

I'm not sure how people come up an idea of how much DPS you're doing without combat logs. The only mob you can measure is the 4th boss in EV and I'm always on the mob with the most HP, and I usually kill it before other people kill the mob with second most HP. Of course that doens't really say anything without knowing what other people are doing but I don't see any glaring weaknesses.

Someone actually made a petition thread to change the Assassin class to Wraith. I think it'd be more fitting too. We're not very Assassin-y, to be honest. I love my character though, fully specced deception sin. My damage is fine, my PvP is fine, you just have to not be retarded.

Without damage meters any guild that blames class X on why they can't finish bosses is basically using that as an excuse on why they just aren't good enough to win.

Sounds like a guild full of nubs that like to blame problems on the easiest thing possible.

I can do 5k crits. In fact, I can do 5k crits while 3 dots are active on the enemy, also rolling crits of their own at the same time. Madness assassin. All it takes is a few bad examples to make us all look bad. Comparative to other dps I've encountered I actually have been getting the feeling that we could use a nerf if anything.

Partially true. It's hard to say for sure when it comes to long fights, but you can notice trends in how much damage a 'sin is likely to bring compared to an OP etc. My personal feeling, having played both OP and 'sin at lvl 50, is the obvious "OPs burst like mad". After that it evens out and feels more or less the same over a bossfight. As an OP you can vanish + HS to burst again, as a Sin you do a higher and less finicky dps.

Marauders are just OP atm though. I'm not sure their actual DPS is that different from Sin/OP, but they have sweet, sweet buffs.

I've always wanted to try Madness in a raid, but I usually roll with Deception as I have gotten used to it. I must say that I don't feel like I'm terrible at it. For now I believe the closest "meter" you can get to is with the Infernal Council. As Deception, I usually finish on time or just slightly after the other DPS. This is of course without being able to use Force Cloak for the extra force regen (not sure if that would cause my guy to go attack someone else and F it up or not, so haven't tried) or being able to use Maul. Of course, I know other classes have abilities they can only use from behind as well and can't on this fight.

I know Madness spec theoretically should pull more sustained DPS. I haven't tried it yet, but I imagine it would be a real pain to be Madness on a fight like Soa, where you just have short windows where you have to kill something else or bursting him down in phase 3. This is where I think Deception would be a better spec, but that's not to say that Madness isn't viable either.

Basically, I believe I do fine as a Deception assassin. I believe Madness assassins can do fine as well given sustained damage. It may feel weak at times when Blackout and Force Cloak are on cooldown and you're hovering near 0 force, but once those cooldowns are back up the damage is quite nice. Also, many classes have the same low-dps phases in their rotations, as they're all usually limited by their resource at some point.

As it's been said many times, it's hard to really tell for sure without a damage meter, but I don't believe that Assassins are hindering any operation.

I raid HM OP's and I'm always finished 1-3rd (being beat by sorcs only, by max 2-5 seconds) on the marauder solo boss (100k~ hp). Difference is usually some lucky crit. Deception spec and this is without useing maul, because obviously I can't cc the mob.
So actually I loose out on some dps and still do good.
Anyone saying assassin dps don't have dps potential don't know what they are talking about.

4k deathfield crits, while my dots tick and crit for 600... yea... I'm good. Sins can battle res, offtank with the press of a button and I'm sure were only out dpsed on bosses by a marauder, we can also taunt to save healers and self heal to help lighten the load on healers. I can't tell if you were serious or not with this thread cuz you would really have to be a dick to not let your best friend come with you when there's no way to prove he is sub optimal.