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Notes on BioChem and Cybertech in Game Update 1.1

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > General Discussion
Notes on BioChem and Cybertech in Game Update 1.1
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trotsky_tor's Avatar


trotsky_tor
01.13.2012 , 03:47 PM | #101
Quote: Originally Posted by DragoVaughn View Post
I like how everyone always forgets Armstech. As it's even worse than artificing, had no BOP items AT ALL...
Not sure why you quoted me on that :P In my suggestion, Armstech would get Armstech-only Barrel mods.

Psykhe's Avatar


Psykhe
01.13.2012 , 03:50 PM | #102
Quote: Originally Posted by Leilei View Post
You guys are going at this the wrong way. ADRENALS are the problem! not med packs and not stims.

ADRENALS

Either bring them down from blue to green or change the reusable one to have x charges
That.

Med packs are strong, but the adrenals are downright ridiculous. Either reduce the costs for the consumable version by at least the factor of 10 or give the reusables a long cooldown.
Adrenals are useful in every fight, if a non-biochem user would use them like this he would have to pay a minimum of 100k per hour for that.

Wraeththu's Avatar


Wraeththu
01.13.2012 , 03:59 PM | #103
Quote: Originally Posted by Felioats View Post
No matter how small the bonus is, it will always be a bonus you can't get any other way.

You need to add something exclusive other than gear to all of the "crafting" crew skills.
This. Biochem will always be superior, even if it's +1 stat, until such time as the other professions have some use. Right now they don't. You can MAYBE make some money on them, after a lot of investment and time, but that time could have been better spent just killing mobs. If I'd sold all the mats I've spent on training and REing patterns, not bought crafting schematics from the trainer/GTN, and not wasted time on it, I'd be at least a million credits ahead. Considering I can maybe sell an item for 10k credits, and half of that its mat costs, It's unlikely I'll ever recoup my costs.

But for this privilege I get... nothing? Gear that's worse than commendation gear. Customs that are (at best) just recolors (or worse exactly the same) of customs you can get unlimited numbers of by doing a daily heroic.

Crafting is bad. I'm willing to accept that there wasn't enough time to flush it out. But BW needs to own up to its mistakes, even if it doesn't know of a current solution. Until it does, it just looks incompetent and lazy. At a minimum, given how much of this game is ripped off from other more-successful games previously, they could have had the decency to rip off one of the crafting systems that worked. Of the last 4 MMOs I've played, WoW, Rift, Eve, Aion; this is the worst crafting game I've seen. It's only slight above Tabula Rasa in usefulness.

I_Grock_Spock's Avatar


I_Grock_Spock
01.13.2012 , 04:00 PM | #104
Good move. I was looking into one of the guilds on my server, and they don't even let you APPLY unless you have a 400 in BioChem (or are female IRL).

Vitiock's Avatar


Vitiock
01.13.2012 , 04:00 PM | #105
Just curious but is every BOP that is crafted going to get the REQUIRES treatment, because if you don't all this means is everyone is going to sit with biochem as their crew skill until they have to spend X time grinding to a different one and back.

Cayse_Harker's Avatar


Cayse_Harker
01.13.2012 , 04:01 PM | #106
I still don't get why they didn't just make these Ineligible for PVP use. Let PvPers use vendor consumables exclusively.

If this is a PvP issue, why not a PvP solution?

Lexster's Avatar


Lexster
01.13.2012 , 04:01 PM | #107
Quote: Originally Posted by Greyfeld View Post
I completely agree. There is absolutely zero reason for commendation vendors to sell prototype gear. And on top of that, green gear is available on a vendor for credits, making green gear total vendor trash that isn't even worth listing on the GTN when it drops from random mobs.



I don't really agree with this. I don't know if infinite use is too much or not, but it's hard to gauge in the game's current incarnation. I know it seems like infinite charges is an "unfair advantage" or whatever, but it's currently compared against crew skills that are literally worthless as they currently stand. The only real unfair advantage might be adrenals in pvp, but that goes for anybody who's shelled out the credits for adrenals.



Yeah, no. See, if you make all crafted armor/weapons orange, then you move the sales paradigm from stat-based to aesthetics-based. Instead of searching for the gear that out-ranks your current gear, you have to search through gear designs to find out what you want, and then you'll never buy a new piece of gear again. It's bad for the economy, and bad for any crafting profession that isn't Cybertech.

Though having 1 augment slot for every piece of prototype gear, 2 augment slots for artifact gear, and 3 augment slots on a crit is a great way to make crafted gear relevant (and also make augments actually worth listing on the GTN).




I completely agree.



I don't know about having it tradeable. I think there should be at least one or two items that each skill can make that are BoP and only those skill-users can use. It makes those skills worth keeping after you've crafted the highest level gear.
With crafters making armor/weapons that are all orange in quality it allows people to tailor their looks. With this game putting out mods to alter gear, non orange crafted gear is pretty much overlooked and unneeded. My suggestion would allow crafters to have several different looks for each type of armor.

Barrels/hilts/enhancements are made by noncybertechs. Cybertech would create armorings and modification slot items. Not really that bad.

My reason for no BOP for any crafter is really a couple. 1) It prevents another item from being placed into the economy. If only one person can use this, a cry for nerf is inevitable. At some point a min/maxer will spreadsheet the bonus one gives over the other and this will become fotm just for 1 item. 2) Armor/mods/etc cant really have BIS items as well as BOP. It just wont work.

DarthSublimitas's Avatar


DarthSublimitas
01.13.2012 , 04:02 PM | #108
Quote: Originally Posted by Cayse_Harker View Post
I still don't get why they didn't just make these Ineligible for PVP use. Let PvPers use vendor consumables exclusively.

If this is a PvP issue, why not a PvP solution?
Because that would entail them actually having to do some work and it's so much easier to nerf something than go into and make a few modifications on the code.
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Greyfeld's Avatar


Greyfeld
01.13.2012 , 04:02 PM | #109
Quote: Originally Posted by GabeAmatangelo View Post
Additionally, we will continue to monitor and tune crafting professions to ensure they are in line with combat targets and toward the goal of keeping them viable in end game but not mandatory for participation. Currently there are several Armormech, Armstech, Synthweaving and Artifice recipes that can be found in end game content. We will be adding more in future updates.

-Gabe
That's all fine and dandy, but what about crafting while leveling? We have yet to hear anything from anybody (mod, dev, manager, or peon) regarding the fact that commendation gear outshines crafted gear at all levels of gameplay.

Can somebody at least let us know whether Bioware intends on addressing this issue or not?
.
<FinalWave>

Vitiock's Avatar


Vitiock
01.13.2012 , 04:04 PM | #110
Quote: Originally Posted by Cayse_Harker View Post
I still don't get why they didn't just make these Ineligible for PVP use. Let PvPers use vendor consumables exclusively.

If this is a PvP issue, why not a PvP solution?
This wasn't just a PVP issue, biochem provided (and still does) a bonus to PVE that couldn't be obtains easier elsewhere