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If you oppose add-ons and combat logging....


archifikoss's Avatar


archifikoss
01.05.2012 , 08:03 AM | #21
Quote: Originally Posted by HugoJenkins View Post
How do u propose we weed out the ppl that arn't improving?

Oh and here's an idea, how Bout a target dummy that spawns a dps meter only viewable by the person usin the dummy. That way a person could practice their rotation and seewhat works and what does 't.
This is a good idea. I'd take it one step forward and implement a "combat simulator" of sorts, where you can not only practice rotations group synergy etc. either alone or with others, but also you could be equipped with the gear set of your choice for yuor time in the simulator to see the improvement from what you have to what you will have should you acquire it.

ShinyMcShine's Avatar


ShinyMcShine
01.05.2012 , 08:11 AM | #22
Quote: Originally Posted by StealthNerf View Post
You don't need combat logs to improve. You just need to time how long you take to take down a mob. If you do it faster, then you've improved.

It's pretty easy to see improvements in rotations without logs.
DPS on a short living mob and DPS on a long sustained boss fight are 2 very different things. The only useful thing you're going to learn is how much burst DPS you have, but it still won't give you a clue to tell you how efficient your actual rotation is.

Helagoth's Avatar


Helagoth
01.05.2012 , 08:22 AM | #23
Quote: Originally Posted by Holograham View Post
This "add-on" debate will rage on till the end of time but I don't think BW will let 3rd party companies make add-ons for their game.
I have played many mmo's since the release of FF11 (personally my favorite mmo of all time) some have been good and some have been very bad, SW:TOR sits on the good side for me. But this doesn't mean that some things can't be fixed/added.

1. Allow UI customization, ie. re-sizable and movable elements
2. Allow a combat log and parsing

This is all anyone NEEDS, you could set your screen up how you like it and you could go over combat logs to your hearts content improving your game or helping others. Add-on's are unneeded and once you open that door you can't shut it, also I wouldn't mind having mouse over but can do without macros, they tend to make people lazy and I fear people will start making them to spam the chat channels.

Agree 100%. I don't care about addons, I care about making my UI look the way I want it to, and being able to figure out how me and my buds screwed up so we can fix it. Allow addon's or build it in, I don't care.

Fixed, unchangeable UIs work in single player games because you play through them, then stop. They don't work in MMO's because a lot of us play way too much, and will spend way too many hours for the next several years staring at our screens.


Also though, dead horse is dead. They said they want to do this, they just couldn't get it done before EA made them ship the game to get in for Christmas. The real question is, how hard will it be for them to implement considering the client isn't really built to do it. If they didn't allow for any provisions for such things, (IE the UI element locations aren't dynamic in the underlying code), then don't expect UI customization until the first expansion.
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LeSamourai's Avatar


LeSamourai
01.05.2012 , 08:29 AM | #24
Quote: Originally Posted by Starglyte View Post
I don't raid, so its not a problem for me.
This. I don't raid as much, nor does the majority of the playerbase, so it's a non-issue for me.

Also, there are WAY WAY WAY more important things to address first.
meh, I just want to play SWTOR

GuiltyParty's Avatar


GuiltyParty
01.05.2012 , 08:42 AM | #25
Quote: Originally Posted by HugoJenkins View Post
How do u propose we weed out the ppl that arn't improving?

Oh and here's an idea, how Bout a target dummy that spawns a dps meter only viewable by the person usin the dummy. That way a person could practice their rotation and seewhat works and what does 't.
See right there it is how do we weed out people theses kind of things will lead to "Nope your not good enough go away" and only the same people will have any chance to do anything Next theyllbe wanting gear score for raids ...lol

Rigwit's Avatar


Rigwit
01.05.2012 , 09:06 AM | #26
Quote: Originally Posted by Hairless View Post
Go see how much "fun" you will actually have when you are in a raid full of 7 or 15 others who also play the game for "fun", don't use any add ons, clueless about min-maxing and boss mechanics, and don't bother to improve, all in the name of "having fun because it's a game".

You will wish that you had some of the add on nerds here to compensate for the lack of performance from your "have fun only" buddies because, trust me, you will not have "fun" wiping repeatedly for dumb reasons to a boss that should be easily defeated.
Raiding existed and was successfully done well before add-ons and min-maxing, and it was a lot of fun even. However, knowing the boss mechanics (preferably learned through experience) and the willingness to improve how you play your class are quite vital. Also, realizing it's not all about you, and listening to raid leaders that likely know the raid far better than you helps

Add-ons aren't a problem for the most part, there's just a few that ruin things, and those are the add-ons that turn everything into easy-mode/lazy-mode, and basically remove all need for tactics. Things like gearscore I wouldn't even mind, because I seldom group/raid with a pickup group, and things like damage meters I've always found interesting, although they were never a reason for me to kick someone from a group/raid. However, add-ons that auto-cancel a heal when the target is above xx% for example alter the game, and those shouldn't be allowed.

HugoJenkins's Avatar


HugoJenkins
01.05.2012 , 10:02 PM | #27
Quote: Originally Posted by GuiltyParty View Post
See right there it is how do we weed out people theses kind of things will lead to "Nope your not good enough go away" and only the same people will have any chance to do anything Next theyllbe wanting gear score for raids ...lol
Don't need gear score to see who isn't gearing properly, plus it can manipulated (ie. Pvp gear). We want to see who is gearing properly but can't play their toon effectively for the content. This happens alot. Why should others suffer got a couple ppl's short comings?

Ekemeister's Avatar


Ekemeister
01.05.2012 , 10:09 PM | #28
It's not having a damage meter that bothers me. What bothers me is the mass stupidity that fails to interpret the difference between damage and player performance. No one wants to get kicked because they "cc an add" or "helped save and off-healer" instead of bowing down to the "Gods of ye olde dps stats."

Remember only two AC's do one role: Sniper/Gunslinger & Marauder/Sentinel. Everyone else is a hybrid to at least some extent.

Quote: Originally Posted by GuiltyParty View Post
See right there it is how do we weed out people theses kind of things will lead to "Nope your not good enough go away" and only the same people will have any chance to do anything Next theyllbe wanting gear score for raids ...lol
Also, Mods, Armorings, and Augments allow for PvE gear to be used long past their level req. I generally use my lightsabers for six to eight levels because i upgrade the mods.
Sith Assassin Helm & Hood? :Not included with purchase of SWTOR.

PhoenixMatrix's Avatar


PhoenixMatrix
01.05.2012 , 11:04 PM | #29
Quote: Originally Posted by Hairless View Post
Go see how much "fun" you will actually have when you are in a raid full of 7 or 15 others who also play the game for "fun", don't use any add ons, clueless about min-maxing and boss mechanics, and don't bother to improve, all in the name of "having fun because it's a game".

You will wish that you had some of the add on nerds here to compensate for the lack of performance from your "have fun only" buddies because, trust me, you will not have "fun" wiping repeatedly for dumb reasons to a boss that should be easily defeated.
Lots of MMOs out there that don't allow add-ons. Some have quite the player base (not as big as WoW, but not all of em are tiny either). That scenario doesn't happen. People are still pretty good. The bads just give up pretty quick and move on to other games.

Foenixz's Avatar


Foenixz
01.05.2012 , 11:41 PM | #30
Quote: Originally Posted by Hairless View Post
Go see how much "fun" you will actually have when you are in a raid full of 7 or 15 others who also play the game for "fun", don't use any add ons, clueless about min-maxing and boss mechanics, and don't bother to improve, all in the name of "having fun because it's a game".

You will wish that you had some of the add on nerds here to compensate for the lack of performance from your "have fun only" buddies because, trust me, you will not have "fun" wiping repeatedly for dumb reasons to a boss that should be easily defeated.
I had lots of fun before addons made WoW BORING. WE do not need elitist attitudes to get where we need nor crutches for those who cannot learn to play.
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