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Why so much hate for remastered star wars films?

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > STAR WARS Discussion
Why so much hate for remastered star wars films?

DarylMusashi's Avatar


DarylMusashi
01.04.2012 , 04:33 AM | #31
Quote: Originally Posted by xnoxiousx View Post
I dont understand all the hate for star wars bluray collection and so on.
Love bluray but i wish it had all unchanged movies a option.

Except for the Han shooting first part everything else i think was needed. like I said before, it helps with continuity, brings better effects and makes things look less cheesy (I mean if 4,5,6 were shot in modern day, the battles would be more epic (I mean you have to admit that CG gives you abilities to bring wonders to the screen like the Old Republic trailers)...imagine the battle of Endor if it was more CG but the live action parts stayed intact or the Empire strikes back snow battle.

Like i said, i'm all for making thing caught up with the times...if some prefer the old stuff...the can play their VHS Star Wars and let others watch the new movies.
I have two reasons personally beyond just rose colored nostalgia glasses.

Han shooting first gave an old western feel to his character that is lacking if Greedo shoots first. Han was like a gunslinger in the original.

Jabba's Palace scene became a Warner Brothers cartoon in the remake, and just didn't appeal to me at all.

These are just my own personal opinions on the matter.

Edit: Oh yeah, how could I forget the "NOOOOOO!!!". I had managed to bleach that from my brain, but yeah that is a deal breaker. I refuse to watch the redone versions. I have kept a working laser disc player and copies of the the original trilogy like they were shown theatrically.

GhostRiderLSOV's Avatar


GhostRiderLSOV
01.04.2012 , 05:35 AM | #32
It's weird but I haven't checked yet, do we have a "noooooo!" emote? (not just a "no")

I think we should get one.
"Every little thing that helps."
Hile'Iteu Lightgrasp - Jedi Guardian
On the Frostclaw server

Spikeskcd's Avatar


Spikeskcd
01.04.2012 , 06:07 AM | #33
Quote: Originally Posted by Vecke View Post
It's not the end of Episode 3 that people are complaining about. At the end of Episode 6, when Vader makes his...final decision... in regards to Luke and the Emperor, Lucas has now taken the "NOOOO!" from Episode 3 and dubbed it over that scene in Episode 6. It's a terrible edit and it has no place in that scene.
Agreed

It didn't work before in 3 it is worlds worse in 6!

LordMerrick's Avatar


LordMerrick
01.04.2012 , 05:51 PM | #34
Quote: Originally Posted by Vecke View Post
It's not the end of Episode 3 that people are complaining about. At the end of Episode 6, when Vader makes his...final decision... in regards to Luke and the Emperor, Lucas has now taken the "NOOOO!" from Episode 3 and dubbed it over that scene in Episode 6. It's a terrible edit and it has no place in that scene.
I agree that is awful. Haven't seen it but I can imagine what a train wreck it is. I also remember back now to the first time I watched episode 3 and my reaction to vader yelling "no!" was one of displeasure......like it didnt fit right. Something was out of place. I guess i just didnt react as strongly as others. Maybe because, like everyone else, I dont think the prequel trilogy was very good. But UNLIKE everyone else.....i didnt think the original trilogy was so hot either. I found it pretty boring. I am far more in love with the IDEA of Star Wars than with any of the movies. The idea of having telekinetic powers, weilding a lightsaber, exploring space, meeting alien species, piloting space ships....is all very awesome, and its the reason I bother with star wars at all. It wasn't until i watched all 6 movies in proper sequence that I began to appreciate the story in its entirety, and respect the poorly told but epic tale of a man's fall to darkness, son fighting father, and final redemption.


But thanks to this post below I went and watched these reviews of star wars 1-3

Quote: Originally Posted by Tirrallas View Post
This guy knows where its at.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FxKtZmQgxrI
and while I absolutely love this review......and agree with much of his take about movie mechanics and so forth....several very important plot points have completely escaped this guy and he is wrong on nearly half the stuff he says. Just recalling from memory, I'll post a "for instance" in a new post below

Zekkau's Avatar


Zekkau
01.04.2012 , 05:58 PM | #35
Some just have not read the novels, and therefore don't know about the struggle that (in the storyline) is going on within Vader.

While I don't quite like the NOOOOO at the end of Ep. III (It should have been more of a angry ARRRGHHHH with the deaths of the medical personnel, reflecting his embrace of the dark side) the NOOO in Ep. VI is perfect, especially because its reflecting his redemption.

LordMerrick's Avatar


LordMerrick
01.04.2012 , 06:24 PM | #36
Aside from the annoying fact that he sounds like he is talking with food in his mouth it soon becomes clear through his review that he lacks comprehension of several key plot points. On the one hand he derides the action sequences and begs for something more complex, and next when the very thing he asks for smacks him in the face, he lacks the intellectual capacity to recognize it.

Keep in mind the reviewer believes that every one of his sarcastic questions constitute additional proof that the star wars prequels are garbage heap built on stupid premises that have no plot. Recalling from memory some of his questions: “why would the trade federation wanna blockade trade?”

Answer: Ostensibly they are asserting control in order to coerce Naboo to agree to pay them a much higher tax. IE….they’re ostensibly doing it to get richer. THAT is what the trade federation gets out of it. This sort of thing happens every day in real life. But the plot thickens…..what they are REALLY doing is acting as pawns in a chess game played by the sith lord himself. He is maneuvering the galaxy into a position of open war. His efforts are ultimately impeded by Anakin skywalker, who sets palpatine's master plan back 10 full years.

His next question: "So the trade federation sets up a blockade so the planet doesn’t have any access to space, which instantly causes some kind of problem that never gets introduced (record screech) “I don’t get it”

Answer: A blockade from trade cuts a planet off from any resources. Without resources the economy dies, and after that the citizens die.

Not sure how he confused the Cuban missle crisis with world war 1…..maybe it was a joke.

Question: "So why does the trade federation have a military if they are merchants?

Answer: look up the definition of the word Federation. The source of their power is money, the source of their money is trade, and bullying smaller planets who wish to trade into paying taxes to this larger, powerful federation of rich planets. What planet doesn’t have an army? What tax collector doesn’t have an army?

“ I aint never read a book and I aint about to start”
Answer: I dont wanna touch this in case it was a joke


Next question: "So anyway I realize palpatine is using the blockade to advance himself politically”

No: palpatine *engineered* the blockade. Huge difference. He was so close to understanding, and yet so far away.

“why couldn’t they survive on the resources of their planet alone?”

Answer: Hello? An occupying army was moving in on them. What government in the universe would take that lying down?

His next sarcastic question: “how come in phantom menace a protocol driod recognizes jedi but in the original trilogy nobody knows what a jedi is?”

Answer: The original trilogy was set about 20 years after the **extinction** of the jedi. A whole new generation of people have grown up, for many of them their parents have already died, and they have never seen a jedi before in their life. It isnt a stretch to imagine the empire made jedi a taboo subject....all references and material and discussion of them illegal and punishable by law and so forth. And besides, a protocol droid lives longer than any human, has a perfect memory, and was around during the jedi heyday.


------

In his review of attack of the clones he wonders aloud how and why the clones were made before the droid army was, calling this a stupid plot hole.

Answer: It was explained during the movie that a mysterious person representing the jedi council commissioned the construction of a clone army 10 years ago. The timeline is perfect – the order was placed right after Palpatine’s first attempt to incite a galactic war got derailed by young Anakin skywalker. Not one to be discouraged, Palpatine immediately went to work on a new plan. We learn from Jango fett that the name of this mysterious jedi who ordered the clone army was “Tyranus”, also known as count dooku….AKA the apprentice who replaced darth maul under the leadership of Lord Sidious AKA Chancellor Palpatine. After dooku fights yoda, Lord Sidious tells dooku “welcome back ***lord Tyranus***”

If anyone needs further explanation, palpatine wants to create a war, and in order to do so, he needs to create no one, but 2 armies, and he needs the galaxy to be unaware of his involvement.

Next our sarcastic reviewer wants to know why out of a federation of galaxies there is not already an army….and seconds later he begins talking about the military creation act, completely unaware he answered his own question. They were in a time of peace where a standing army was illegal. We had a time in early America with a very similar law – a time when a standing army was illegal and did not exist. Furthermore the army of a single planet or even a few volunteer planets would be no match for a droid army that was designed to conquer an entire galaxy.


Our reviewer then wants to know why don’t they just force palpatine to donate blood so they can count his midichlorians to see if he is a sith??. There are so many things wrong with that I hardly want to waste space on it. First you don’t just demand blood from the chancellor of an entire galaxy. It doesn’t happen. Secondly, the fact that he has potential as a force sensitive does not constitute proof that he is a sith lord.


Next question: he asks why is senator Amidala being assassinated for no reason? And he calls this a plot hole.

Answer: There is a very good reason for her assassination – The reason is because she was the spearhead of the anti-military creation act. She was the single biggest obstacle to Palpatine’s goal of inciting war. Remember it was Palpatine who put the contract out on Amidala....thru dooku....thru jango fett...and so on down the line.


The reviewer wonders why the assassin sniper doesn’t just shoot Amidala thru the window instead of using bugs. In the very next scene of his youtube video he shows the window with the droid dropping bugs inside – with closed blinds. How is the assassin gonna see padme thru blinds? From across the street?


Next Question: Why did jango fett hire an assassin instead of doing the job himself?

Answer: to remove himself and his employer from the murder…..putting several more layers between them ensures they don’t get caught. Notice how the shapeshifter got caught by the jedi? That could have easily been jango caught by the jedi instead. Its just smart business to hire someone else.

Next he goes on this long satirical and sarcastic spiel about palpatine's ability to predict the future....and how this is stupid. When in fact if you paid attention in Return of The Jedi…..seeing the future is one of palpatine’s strong points. Yoda does it too….only not as skillfully as the dark lord. In star wars it is a jedi ability. No explanation needed.


I do have to agree with the reviewer about the love scenes…they were simply the worst of all time...anywhere book or movie....and this one thing alone is what tanked movie number 2.


Next our comical kidnapper whines about Yoda using a lightsaber. He rags on one of the coolest things in the star wars universe, complaining about why dooku doesn’t do acrobatics like yoda and so forth….entirely missing the point that there are different sword fighting styles or forms, just as it is in real life.

Fencing is not the same as samurai sword fighting and fighting one handed with a light sword is a very different style from a two handed heavy sword. They look different in action, and they have different speeds, advantages, and weaknesses. Yoda uses a fighting form that utilizes force power to move his body in acrobatic moves in order to overcome his age, his disability (the cane), and his small size. Dooku’s style is more reserved and subtle, and he can afford to use that form because he is larger.

Dooku’s form is far less aggressive and offensive than Yoda’s form but the downside to yoda’s form is that it tires you out very quickly and it thereby necessitates beating your opponent very quickly. What exactly does the reviewer expect to happen when the two opponents are equally matched in force strength? He doesnt say. Perhaps he thinks that yoda should just…..quit?


I don’t know what his problem is with children or where his hatred of them stems from but he spends like 10 minutes bashing children and (I hope) it is his problem alone. I’m sure that’s not one of the points everyone agrees with him on and so it doesn’t really need to be deconstructed.


Finally: he wonders why palpatine doesn’t just skip the war altogether and use his influence and charisma to mindwipe all the senators into making him an emperor. He insinuates that this option makes the entire war pointless and unnecessary, thus making the entire story unnecessary. That was just..... kind of stupid. Its well established that force persuasion is limited in its effectiveness. Furthermore he had the jedi on watch with the capability of arresting palpatine the minute they heard all these senators suddenly talking about making him emperor for no apparent reason. He would have given his identity away...or at least doomed his own plan to failure. He needed a legitimate reason for rising to power in order to avoid setting off alarm bells in the head of that pesky republic watchdog – the jedi council.


There are several more errors in his arguments but this post is already way too long and I'm not going to create a youtube video just to reveal the faults in HIS youtube video.

LordMerrick's Avatar


LordMerrick
01.04.2012 , 09:08 PM | #37
sorry, kind of posted this in the wrong thread. Where people were actually talking about plines reviews

Claidh's Avatar


Claidh
01.05.2012 , 01:52 AM | #38
I just want my original, un-special editions. I bought the DVDs that had the originals a few years back and they are a prized possession now. I'd like to have them on Blu-Ray, but I can live without it.

My list of hatreds of the remasters are many.
Just from ANH:
I want Obi-Wan's original Krayt dragon call back.
Han shoots Greedo in cold blood. There was no exchange of gunfire. This is what made Han the coolest guy in the entire series.
No Jabba CG shots.
No need for fan-wanking with the unnecessary Boba Fett scenes.
No giant praying mantises in the cantina.
The expanded Mos Eisley was all right, but the Jawas and Rontos were lame and looked terrible, as did the unnecessary flying droid with the stormtroopers.
If you're gonna add something, add the Anchorhead scenes with Luke and Biggs since it actually makes his death at the end more poignant.
No CG stormtroopers in the Death Star (when Han runs down the hall).
Either do all CG fighters in the final fight, or all models. The mixing and matching looked terrible.
If you're going to upgrade something, why not the computer screens? Bring the 1976 technology at least up to the RotJ levels. What were the Death Star plans made on, a TRS-80?

I however, am ok with taking out the cardboard soldiers flanking the final walk at the awards scene.

ESB: (they seemed to have mucked around with this movie least of all)
Windows in Cloud City: Good
Wampa flailing around armless: unnecessary.
Fixed the "monkey eyes" Emperor: Good.
Expanded views of Bespin: Good
In an earlier special edition, Luke screamed when he dropped off the platform, thereby destroying his "I'd rather die than join you" moment and defeating the nobility of the moment. Thank mecha-Shiva they removed that (although I haven't watched it on Blu-Ray, so they may have put it back in).

RotJ:
The Muppet Show Jabba palace and extra musical number: ridiculous.
The Audrey II / Sarlacc pit: terrible.
Vader's "No, Noooooooo!": unnecessary, subtext destroying, moment killing.
Hayden Christenson ghost instead of Sebastian Shaw: inconsistent and intrusive.
I don't dislike the new song, but the celebration across the galaxy montage was ridiculous and goes against all the stuff that's been written afterwards. No such problems with a simple Yub Nub song.


Side note: When they made the OT, wasn't it awesome to know that somewhere at Elstree studios there was a full-sized Millennium Falcon sitting in a sound stage? You could walk around it, touch it, climb inside it... CG filmmaking is "ok, walk across this green platform and up that green ramp. Now watch this ping pong ball and pretend it's an alien. Films went from getting to play with cool toys and artists building props and sets to just walking around with your imagination and hoping they don't make you look silly.
Squadron 11.11.11 Never Forget

felamoth's Avatar


felamoth
01.05.2012 , 02:15 AM | #39
It's getting late and I have got to get to bed so I have not read the whole thread. My apologies.

I have to say that I have no problems with any of the movies. None. I remember watching episode V in the theaters, then VI and I was hooked. I get too lost in the story that the movie is telling to pick apart the visual effects and cg backdrops added. Is there a need to have the Tatooine desertlife in the background as Obi and Luke move through Mos Eisley? No. Does it ruin the movie for me? No. I actually liked the fact that they had windows in Cloud City so that you could see what the entire place may look like instead of a white wall.

To me the best scene in all the movies was when Anakin looked up at Obi and screamed "I hate you!". After watching and loving these movies since I can remember, THAT scene stands out the most of any.

As for Vader's NOOOOOOO! at the end..... he lost his wife AND the the emperor blamed it on him. That signified the transformation for Vader. Was it cheesey? Maybe. Did it ruin the whole Saga? Not for me.

I can watch these movies on blu-ray, dvd, vhs, or the little hand held projector thingy that I had as a child. They will never get old.
Who you calling "scruffy looking"?

Pirate_Ron's Avatar


Pirate_Ron
01.05.2012 , 11:16 AM | #40
Quote: Originally Posted by xnoxiousx View Post
I dont understand all the hate for star wars bluray collection and so on.
Love bluray but i wish it had all unchanged movies a option.

Except for the Han shooting first part everything else i think was needed. like I said before, it helps with continuity, brings better effects and makes things look less cheesy (I mean if 4,5,6 were shot in modern day, the battles would be more epic (I mean you have to admit that CG gives you abilities to bring wonders to the screen like the Old Republic trailers)...imagine the battle of Endor if it was more CG but the live action parts stayed intact or the Empire strikes back snow battle.

Like i said, i'm all for making thing caught up with the times...if some prefer the old stuff...the can play their VHS Star Wars and let others watch the new movies.
Here's why. Lucas keeps revising it to make it "perfect". Now lets look at another Lucas gem shall we. One in such perfection that it needs no more polish. Howard the Duck. With his lack of remakes it has to be perfect by his standards.

I want him to stop Howard the Ducking my Star Wars. The more he Ducks it up, the worse it gets.