I cannot imagine that F2P who won't spend $15 for a subscription, are spending that much money on Cartel Coins.

I did... Thinking about what I've spent since f2p its definitely more than had I just subbed for 8 months or so.

I'm not sure what demographic in the player base I'd represent, but it was more the principle of a sub (money for nothing) that was the problem, not any desire to play for free. When bioware presented opportunities to spend as -I- chose to spend it I did quite readily (of course you can assume that I got hooked on the game by f2p then preferred just the same as any subscriber would have).

Just in case.. Preferred isnt that bad.. Coming in from the other way.. I'll still maintain the way it's documented is more a scare tactic to hold existing subs rather than totally demoralise free players (though you could break this down into detail sure). Of course, any old subs who have dropped to preferred and are actually happy with the experience will never be heard from again to share their experiences...

Well it can be very handy for people like me who switch to preffered status soon. I buy unlocks in the GTN from time to time to gain a status that is close to subscription. And then i will have a look if this is turns out to be cheaper then a subscription. If so this might be something i take advantage of.

Well just mentioned that I'm from the other angle.. Been playing since f2p launched and this is my second month of sub. I have nearly all the cartel unlocks on my account also, while your mileage may vary depending on what you do the only restrictions that had a voice as preferred was the escrow and the queue for crafting crew skills. Everything else is manageable (though you might be on the gtn more than before).

The other annoyances are there sure.. But when you save on that first month of sub (and spending becomes directed by you when you see a new shiny) its turns out positive, both being preferred and the cartel market (or paying for escrow unlocks).

I did... Thinking about what I've spent since f2p its definitely more than had I just subbed for 8 months or so.

 

I'm not sure what demographic in the player base I'd represent, but it was more the principle of a sub (money for nothing) that was the problem, not any desire to play for free. When bioware presented opportunities to spend as -I- chose to spend it I did quite readily (of course you can assume that I got hooked on the game by f2p then preferred just the same as any subscriber would have).

 

Just in case.. Preferred isnt that bad.. Coming in from the other way.. I'll still maintain the way it's documented is more a scare tactic to hold existing subs rather than totally demoralise free players (though you could break this down into detail sure). Of course, any old subs who have dropped to preferred and are actually happy with the experience will never be heard from again to share their experiences...

For the casual players, sure, preferred is fine. But for me even the little things that you can't unlock - like the credits cap - are important part of how I like to play the game.

As for your demographic, I don't know, maybe a few F2P players do spend some money. But I don't believe they could or would ever spend as much as someone who enjoys the game and has already invested time and money in it. To be honest, my opinion on playing for free/being a subscriber is the exact opposite to yours. If I were playing a game for free it would mean that I'm either trying it out or that I don't like it enough, so I sure as hell wouldn't spend money on it.

So why would you guys name something "unlimited" if it is in fact not unlimited.

 

The Unlimited Content Bundle comes with the following:

5 weekly pass: warzones

5 weekly pass: flashpoints

5 weekly pass: space missions

5 weekly pass: operations

 

now correct me if im wrong, but wouldn't unlimited mean FOREVER, not just 5 weeks worth?

okay, I will correct you. Unlimited doesn't mean forever...well to be more precise, it can but it doesn't have to. You can for example have unlimited access for a limited amount of time.

The meaning of unlimited depends on which limits are being lifted. In this case the limit of x amount per week is lifted for a certain time frame.

In marketing this is a looseley used term as it is. I think it's safe to state that you never should take marketing too literally to begin with. Because really, the weekly pass for ops doesn't actually allow you unlimited access since nobody can do an ops more than once a week. So technically it isn't unlimited.

So how can they defend the use of it? Because this package as it is offered lifts the f2p restrictions on what they call "extended content" for the given time period.

Considering that it's 50% off and still more expensive than a month's sub, I would guess this package is more for people who sell these items at the gtn. Therefore bringing down the prices of said items a the gtn. So really, if you're f2p, I'd see this as a positive because people with lots of money can buy these to make credits in game and it allows you to buy these passes at lower prices in game at the gtn. This in essence could make it possible for f2p players to access this content more often without spending actuall cash.

Bottom line is, BW doesn't mind who pays for it as long as somebody does. So, I'd take this as a positive instead of complaining about it. Look beyond the label and how much it costs in CC. Look at what it could do for prices/availability of these items on the gtn, making it easier for f2p players who simply can't or don't want to afford them with real money.

For the casual players, sure, preferred is fine. But for me even the little things that you can't unlock - like the credits cap - are important part of how I like to play the game.

 

As for your demographic, I don't know, maybe a few F2P players do spend some money. But I don't believe they could or would ever spend as much as someone who enjoys the game and has already invested time and money in it. To be honest, my opinion on playing for free/being a subscriber is the exact opposite to yours. If I were playing a game for free it would mean that I'm either trying it out or that I don't like it enough, so I sure as hell wouldn't spend money on it.

Sadly the credit cap is a necessity as it restricts gold selling. SWTOR is one of those few games where gold seller messages are a rarity. I'd like to keep it that way. The escrow things are as good as it gets in that sense.

As I said above. As f2p don't look at the price in the CM but look at the prices dropping on the gtn for these items. I believe that is why they are doing this.

Didn't someone try to sue makers of the film 'The Neverending Story'?

Sure, because it was such a bad adaptation of the book (just like the Eragon movie)

For the casual players, sure, preferred is fine. But for me even the little things that you can't unlock - like the credits cap - are important part of how I like to play the game.

 

As for your demographic, I don't know, maybe a few F2P players do spend some money. But I don't believe they could or would ever spend as much as someone who enjoys the game and has already invested time and money in it. To be honest, my opinion on playing for free/being a subscriber is the exact opposite to yours. If I were playing a game for free it would mean that I'm either trying it out or that I don't like it enough, so I sure as hell wouldn't spend money on it.

Well you can.. It's $2.40 for 600k. So if you have 350k and 600k plus in escrow, pay your 2 fifty and suddenly you have 950 available to spend. They've even built a custom dialog to do this directly from your inventory window.. You don't even need to purchase the unlock cartel item. It is a very strong point though that depending on how many credits you make and spend a month the escrow cost gets a bit stupid and subbing is the better deal.

Are you saying that if you liked a game you wouldn't bother trying to play a f2p available game as free and just sub? I could also be strange.. But I had a great time making a game in itself out of min/maxing my preferred experience with cartel coins and unlocks from the gtn. It was fun. What about if you came into the f2p game with no expectations and it eventually grew on you?

Well, that's the reason they're not doing that. You go back and forth between preferred and subscriber, but if you could unlock everything once and for all what would be the point in ever going but to subscribing, once you've reached 55?

 

Who knows, though? they might try it at some point. Imho, it would be extremely stupid to give subscribers one more reason to feel undervalued and risk losing your main source of income. Because, let's face it, their source of income is mainly our subscriptions and the money subscribers pay for Cartel Coins - I cannot imagine that F2P who won't spend $15 for a subscription, are spending that much money on Cartel Coins.

I play barely one or 2 Fps at the moment and haven't seen a op from inside for weeks. I do dailys, play for reputation and achievments. So if i buy one pack it would a.) give me credits for selling the stuff i don't need and b.) not only one but probably 2 or 3 months of unlocks i can use whenever i want.

Of course i have to look first if buying only the ones i need is cheaper at the end. Not shure about this. But there is a player group that can do way better with preffered status then others. (mostly casuals as i became one in the last weeks.)

While the word "unlimited" doesn't necessarily mean time what struck me as ridiculous is the price, why would anyone with the right mind buy it instead of sub for a month for less?

 

Unless subscription is due to be phased out in favour of a full F2P model this doesn't make any sense...

And wait until it's no longer 50% off. Why would anyone pay the full price for that pack?

And wait until it's no longer 50% off. Why would anyone pay the full price for that pack?

that's a good question, you could jsut buy a gametimecard for that money

Well you can.. It's $2.40 for 600k. So if you have 350k and 600k plus in escrow, pay your 2 fifty and suddenly you have 950 available to spend. They've even built a custom dialog to do this directly from your inventory window.. You don't even need to purchase the unlock cartel item. It is a very strong point though that depending on how many credits you make and spend a month the escrow cost gets a bit stupid and subbing is the better deal.

Not good enough for me.

I generally don't like restrictions but restricting how much credits I can have at a given moment (because, even with the escrow there is still a limit) is a deal breaker for me. I like to play the market - part of my "fun" in the game is crafting, selling and making credits.

Are you saying that if you liked a game you wouldn't bother trying to play a f2p available game as free and just sub?

No, what I'm saying is that I would play a F2P game to try it out, but I wouldn't spend money on it if I didn't feel I liked it enough to subscribe. To me it seems stupid to spend money on a game that I don't like "enough" to subscribe to. If I really like it, I will subscribe and any extra money I spend will be for things that are on the shop knowing that I'm spending my money to enhance my enjoyment and not to make the game bearable. Don't know if that makes more sense.

Well if i can play the game the way i want without paying as much as with a subscription why not? Shure that means that you are not playing 2,3 or 4 hours a day but why pay for a service if the only things i use from the service are for free?

Don't get me wrong i am with you i will always buy a sub when i try a new game. And i will buy a subscription again if they release something that it is worth to me for buying a subscription but at the moment that is not the case. That of course doesn't mean that is stop playing i just adapt my payment model to my playstyle.

Not good enough for me.

I generally don't like restrictions but restricting how much credits I can have at a given moment (because, even with the escrow there is still a limit) is a deal breaker for me. I like to play the market - part of my "fun" in the game is crafting, selling and making credits.

 

No, what I'm saying is that I would play a F2P game to try it out, but I wouldn't spend money on it if I didn't feel I liked it enough to subscribe. To me it seems stupid to spend money on a game that I don't like "enough" to subscribe to. If I really like it, I will subscribe and any extra money I spend will be for things that are on the shop knowing that I'm spending my money to enhance my enjoyment and not to make the game bearable. Don't know if that makes more sense.

No it doesn't do that.. Every single credit you make above the cap is still counted and yours.. What the escrow means is that you only have access to the cap. So as preferred once youve hit 350k, every credit you get there after has the message 'xxx credits has been added to your escrow'. The only time you pay is if you want to spend more than 350k in one go (at endgame this is the more likely scenario) or say you spend yourself down to zeroish and want to get at your escrowed funds. They have smaller amounts for less cartel coins also.

Yes, that makes a lot of sense. In my head different logic appealed, the fact that I could still play an mmo without paying a sub (though this is not at all linked to whether I -will- spend money on the mmo if a great ad hoc/micro transaction purchase was made available). From playing wow for too many years I appreciate the freedom of still having the option to play an mmo and not have to get my money's worth out of the sub (or avoid the inverse of paying money for nothing if life says I can't play much on a particular month).

to me it seems the item description is correct

UNLIMITED CONTENT BUNDLE - is a pack of items that allows you to enjoy the content without any limits imposed by the payment model.

It's their bundle. They can name it anything they like.

 

They can call it RootBeer & Cheese Surprise if they want. All that matters is that they disclose what's inside so that you can review the contents before you purchase it.

 

That said... the passes inside give you weekly unlocks for...wait for it.. UNLIMITED ACCESS to the contents covered by the passes for the duration of the pass. AND.. since it is a ...wait for it.. A BUNDLE of UNLIMITED ACESS PASSES....the laws of the universe remain intact after all.

Andryah, gotta give it to ya, your post are (mostly) well thought out, and (mostly) doesn't contain any BS!

it's false advertisement at worst.....intentional misleading at best. Not surprising in either case here really. You had to know they weren't going to give out unlimited anything in this game.

No its not. The items in the pack give unlimited access while they last. Have you people really not ever bought anything from any store or business before?

it's false advertisement at worst.....intentional misleading at best. Not surprising in either case here really. You had to know they weren't going to give out unlimited anything in this game.

Advertisements/product names can always be taken too seriously and you could argue that they are misleading

Take the apple macbook air for example:

the name is air, so should I feel mislead, when it is made of other things than air?

and the sentence "All the power you want. All day long" should I feel like I was given wrong information, when I can't just establishe a world domination in a day, because maybe that's the power I want.

All day long could be taken as misleading as well, because as they state later on the site, the battery lasts for about 9-13 hours without a recharge, that's not a whole day

Advertisements and product names are there to sell something and not to give all the information you need about the product.

UNLIMITED ACCESS to the contents covered by the passes for the duration of the pass. AND.. since it is a ...wait for it.. A BUNDLE of UNLIMITED ACESS PASSES....the laws of the universe remain intact after all.

Some folks are just too literal. I'm glad you have a knack for breaking things down. Maybe they should have called it the "unlimited access" bundle. Then again, this bundle for Preferred and F2P players is 2600+ CCs. That's about $22.00 from the CM. Makes more sense just to sub lol.