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Deserter Lockout, terrible new mechanic

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > PvP
Deserter Lockout, terrible new mechanic

killdozerone's Avatar


killdozerone
08.09.2020 , 11:49 AM | #71
Quote: Originally Posted by TrixxieTriss View Post
I see quite a lot of premades on Star forge at the times I play. Both in lowbies, Mids and lvl 75. They really stand out because 75% of my games are arena.
Itís actually really sad because I know some of the names and they are often ranked players. The experience is like putting a solo queue team with an ELO of 1100 up against a grank team with an ELO 1500
Bioware donít do that to ranked because itís unfair and everyone would cry about it. But Bioware and many premaders thinks itís ok to do it in Regs?
I can tell you before this lock out buff was added, I would just leave those matches. Now we canít and you get stuck into a loop rotation where every other match is against them and they taunt you in chat. Itís actually worse than the toxicity Iíve seen in ranked. They kill any enjoyment you might be having and people stop queuing, which kills the queue faster than it used to.
Whatís worse is it also keeps making matches 3v4 against these guys. So not only do you pop against a premade, you also have one less player. But if we decide to leave the match, we get slugged with a 15min deserter timer.
I can categorically say from my experiences in a low pop environment, that the debuff is actually hurting pvp pop times and numbers outside of primetime. Itís doing more harm than good.
Good post I agree. Now that every reg is a sweat fest they mine as well do away with ranked and just make every reg warzones have a ranking. The fact that ranked pvpers are forming groups on discord and sweating in regs just shows that they are scared of facing players of equal skill and just want Easy stomps against inexperienced pvpers new to the game and honestly solo queuers In general. You basically just hope that you get a quality premade on your side or your ****ed. Iím an average pvper, I do 10k dps In certain arena matches but the change needs to go.

Raansu's Avatar


Raansu
08.09.2020 , 12:54 PM | #72
Spoiler


I don't know what to tell you here. My experience is the complete opposite, but I also play during the servers actual prime time. If I recall you have said you play during the early morning hours because I'm guessing your from Australia. The experience is gonna be different because its not the servers prime time. I know it sucks, but you can't just completely change the game to accomodate low pop hours.

TrixxieTriss's Avatar


TrixxieTriss
08.09.2020 , 02:22 PM | #73
Quote: Originally Posted by Raansu View Post
Spoiler


I don't know what to tell you here. My experience is the complete opposite, but I also play during the servers actual prime time. If I recall you have said you play during the early morning hours because I'm guessing your from Australia. The experience is gonna be different because its not the servers prime time. I know it sucks, but you can't just completely change the game to accomodate low pop hours.
Yes, Iím in a Australia.

I do understand and agree you shouldnít change the game for a small percentage of players, But itís bigger than that if you step back and look at the whole picture and the history of the game. Iím fond of saying that pvp is an eco system and what affects one part affects the rest eventually. This is another example of that.

As someone whose been shafted left and right by Biowareís server closures, Ive been on the front line of watching how outlying problems I experience, have ended up being problems for the whole of the game months down the line. Think of my experiences as the canary in the coal mine.

Iíve found after playing this game since launch, that what starts to affect low pop times will eventually make its self known to prime time players.

A good example of this was before the last merger. As someone who played the fringes of primetime, I was on a front row seat to see it shrink to an ever small bracket. People who played right in the middle of prime time told me I was lying or imagining it, but 18 months later, those same people were screaming at Bioware for mergers because they couldnít get as fast pops when they logged in because prime time had shrunk.

The thing is, the problems that were affecting the shrinking of primetime back then were generated by Bioware (just like this time) and were mostly fixable if they had listened to the feed back to what some of us were saying. But Bioware either werenít interested or didnít get the feed back delivered to the Devs (bad community management). On top of that there was a concerted effort by some to deride or attack people on the forums who were trying to point out what was happening and where it would lead.

I get that you arenít experiencing what I am, I know when I play in prime time (which I do get to do more now since covid), it can be a markedly dIfferent experience. But what affects low pop times, will gradually encroach on prime time and prime time will get shorter. Once that starts to snow ball, itís very hard to stop it without some artificial means to prop up the population numbers for the queues, aka, server mergers. Which is what they did last time and we all saw how well that worked out for the quality of pvp. More pop, but worse quality because good pvpers ended up leaving.

In the past Iíve made certain observations and predictions when it comes to things like this and Iíve mostly been right. Of course, Iíve been wrong a few times too and I not shy to admit if Iím wrong. But if my experience this last week is anything to go on, then I think we will start to see a massive reduction in pvp participation over the next few months if Bioware hold this course without making some tweaks.

As for my ideas. They arenít really that radical because most are just versions of the way things have been before. The only new thing Iíve suggested is a reduce size in the premades to a limit of 2 persons.

The other things are just tweaks to the system that Bioware have only recently adopted. Iím personally not a fan of giving stuff for losing. But I donít think mission completion should be tied to only winning.
By making the losses count towards the missions again, they can still adjust it so that you have to work for the wins (which is what I think Bioware are going for) is whatís needed. Under the old system you got 2 points for a win and 1 point for a loss. What Iím proposing is give 3 points for a win and 1 point for a loss.

Then with the lock out timer, reduce it down from 15mins to 10mins during primetime and 5 mins when the queue reverts to popping arena because you already have less people in the queue. Because the last thing you want to do is prevent those people from requeuing for 15 mins or 10 mins. That is a sure fire way to kill the queue fast because when the pops slow, people naturally stop queuing on their own, they donít need more of an incentive.
There should also not be a lock out timer in lowbies and Mids. Itís already a ghost town most of the time.

See the lockout timer is essentially affecting all those other legitimate players in the queue when you get down to 8 players and 1 player leaves. That means for the next 15 mins, the queue will pop 3v4 or 2v3. And you canít leave or you get a lock out timer yourself. Now you can say stay, but if you are 3 pugs vs 4 man premade, you have no hope of winning 99% of those matches and you wonít get any rewards for staying (ie mission completion).

Which brings me to another point I wanted to make a thread about, but will start here. The queue needs to stop back filling 2v2, 3v3 matches once they start unless someone leaves. If you play the first round and itís 3v3, then it should lock the back fills so the next round is 3v3. It should not give one team a back file and hope the other team gets one too. Iíve played way too many matches this week where you win the first round, but lose the match because the system gives the other team a 4th player after the first round has been completed.

There is no magic bullet here to make everyone 100% happy. All Bioware can do is try and tweak what they are doing fast enough so that their policies donít negatively affect pvp participation and kill it (Which is whatís going to happen if they arenít careful).