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No Gear Check in the LFG tool?

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > General Discussion
No Gear Check in the LFG tool?

rhirne's Avatar


rhirne
06.08.2012 , 10:14 AM | #551
OK, understand this. BW can't set a standard because there is not one to set. Unless a particular encounter requires XYZ piece of equipment, how can BW say what is a "minimum" requirement?

Players over the course of YEARS have shown that they can come up with very creative ways of beating various levels of content. Developers have even come out right and said "We hadn't even THOUGHT of completing that content that way!" Even personally, I've been in groups in various MMO's and we have ALL said "OHH this ain't gonna work... We are sure to die. We don't even have a tank." Then all the sudden you come up with some crazy strategy that everyone in the group also says "OHH this is just stupid." You do the content and it's like "I CAN'T BELIEVE IT WORKED!!"

When you take the HUMAN element out of it, how can you determine if the group will succeed or fail? How are determining if PersonG can actually hold his own? If you wanna see some crazy groups, as much as people hate on it, look at FFXI. I don't know how many times I was in the craziest of groups that wasn't the "minimum" required and we still found a way to do the content. The Ninja class was NEVER meant to be a tank class (for those who didn't know). The developers admitted "Yeah, we never even THOUGHT of using Ninja that way. But somehow, the players found a way."

I'm not saying gear is not important. Going into a lvl 50 fight with lvl 1 gear on - yeah that's a problem. But completely ignoring the human element just isn't an option. What if BW says "You need XYZ gear at a 'minimum' to do this content" and then people start completing it regularly with "ABC" gear which is NOT the minimum. What then? They just proved you don't need BW "minimum" requirement to complete the content and their gear-check means absolutely nothing.

Not all people are the same, not all people are the same skill level, not all people see the same thing on-screen during a battle, and not all people think the same. Might an encounter be a bit tougher becasue you went RouteG instead of RouteB - yeah very possible. But that doesn't mean it can't be done.
On Tatooine, and in Balmorra's night
No Sith shall escape my sight
To those who follow the Dark Side's plight
Beware the power - A JEDI'S LIGHT

Lord_Ravenhurst's Avatar


Lord_Ravenhurst
06.08.2012 , 10:18 AM | #552
I really hope BW wonīt cater to the elitist whiners, if someone with green gear comes to your group, help getting him better geared..!
YOU wanted a LFG tool, go with your guild or go with random people who queued up.

RolyartNala's Avatar


RolyartNala
06.08.2012 , 10:22 AM | #553
Quote: Originally Posted by Lord_Ravenhurst View Post
I really hope BW wonīt cater to the elitist whiners, if someone with green gear comes to your group, help getting him better geared..!
YOU wanted a LFG tool, go with your guild or go with random people who queued up.
I'm fine with helping someone, but there is a difference between helping and carrying. I don't want to carry anyone; every group member should be pulling his or her weight. A minimum gear check is required for a good LFG tool, because if the LFG tool keeps pairing players up with random bads who have no gear and no clue, then nobody is going to use the damned thing.
The Xoon Legacy
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Galbatorrix's Avatar


Galbatorrix
06.08.2012 , 10:27 AM | #554
Quote: Originally Posted by Lord_Ravenhurst View Post
I really hope BW wonīt cater to the elitist whiners, if someone with green gear comes to your group, help getting him better geared..!
YOU wanted a LFG tool, go with your guild or go with random people who queued up.
Yeah, because the LFG tool completely failing due to constant kicks/drops/degrading/etc should end up working out just fine. The only way to make this tool succeed being same server is if you make each group have a chance at success. Go buy some level 50 greens for you and 7 of your favorite guild mates and then try SM EC. Come back to us and let us know how far you get.

Also, if I'm allowed to queue for heroics right away, why should I bother with regulars? I can just queue up for heroics and hope the other three people can carry me through so I can get free leet gear....

wutru's Avatar


wutru
06.08.2012 , 10:39 AM | #555
Quote: Originally Posted by RolyartNala View Post
I'm fine with helping someone, but there is a difference between helping and carrying. I don't want to carry anyone; every group member should be pulling his or her weight. A minimum gear check is required for a good LFG tool, because if the LFG tool keeps pairing players up with random bads who have no gear and no clue, then nobody is going to use the damned thing.
Well said. I agree. There should be a check in place, especially when people are wearing pvp gear!

RachelAnne's Avatar


RachelAnne
06.08.2012 , 10:46 AM | #556
Quote: Originally Posted by RolyartNala View Post
I'm fine with helping someone, but there is a difference between helping and carrying. I don't want to carry anyone; every group member should be pulling his or her weight. A minimum gear check is required for a good LFG tool, because if the LFG tool keeps pairing players up with random bads who have no gear and no clue, then nobody is going to use the damned thing.
Too bad that gear does not show who has skill and who not. Usually those in epics suck horrible, but were carried by their guild.

Lets face it, a good player with a working guild wont use the LFG. At the LFG you will find those who are not in a guild or just bad players.

After all you were not born with epics, but demand that others are.

amnie's Avatar


amnie
06.08.2012 , 10:47 AM | #557
so, this has nothing to do with the gear check but I didn't want to make a new topic for this...

can you find single people with the group finder or only completely random? (aka I have 5 people for an ops, can I look for the last three missing...)

Monoth's Avatar


Monoth
06.08.2012 , 11:08 AM | #558
To people wanting a gear check....

Simple answer is to join a guild and play with people you know, just because someone passes a gear check doesn't mean there any good.

Also even with the group finder I will still form my Pug OP groups using General Chat, that way I can see for myself what type of gear they have, they don't need to be all pimped out in Tionese gear to do Eternity Vault story mode, just like you don't need full Columi to do Hard Mode EV either...

The other issue I see with Group Finder will be needing specific classes to get pass certain bosses, for Example in KP you need a range tank and a melee tank for the Brother Bosses, you also need a Smuggler or Trooper healer to remove the debuff on the range tank (so you can't use two Sage/Sorc healers), if you don't have this odds are your going to get stuck on these type of bosses.
F2P is like driving on a long stretch of highway with toll booths every 1/2 mile

Karl-Just-Karl's Avatar


Karl-Just-Karl
06.08.2012 , 11:57 AM | #559
It doesn't make a lot of sense that players would be allowed to FLG on content that would be impossible for them to complete. There are gear checks built into at least two of the operations, why would it be a good idea to let the player get to that point and fail?

Captain_Zone's Avatar


Captain_Zone
06.08.2012 , 12:06 PM | #560
Quote: Originally Posted by Kitzinger View Post
In about a year we are going to have the same individual saying, "I remember how great the old LFG Tool was... Didn't help you to find others to do any Flash Points, Operations, anything. It was wonderful but nobody ever used it."


Yeah, because getting yourself to full Rakata and Black Hole Gear as a Powertech Tank is having your hand held... I'm not the one whining about my future on getting kicked from operations for not having the appropriate gear unlike yourself. Just wanting to point that one out.


Because everyone runs around in crap gear with good gear in their bags wanting to do HM and Nightmare mode Operations... seriously?
If you have **** gear on and you want to do an Operation that requires a substantial lvl of gear to pass then the failing is on you. Go do some HM Flash Points, Story Mode EV and KP, then do some Hard Mode EV - KP / Story Mode EC, and then you won't have to whine about being kicked for not being geared enough.
I've ran into some Elitist crap already. "I don't want to teach anybody the Operation." "I just want people who already know how to do the Operation." and so on. This is an actual conversation I had with a Guild Leader. I don't have time for people like that either. /gquit.
I run Lost Island 4-5 times a week to teach others how to do it. I just ran Kaon today with a new 50 today so he could start getting gear.
With that being said, some operations require everyone to be at a certain level of readiness and when one person doesn't meet that requirement then it brings the whole group down. That isn't being elitist that is being honest.


And I disagree. I would like Bioware to make the minimum standard and not the players. This would get rid of most of the elitist opportunities and could even act as a guide. When you have players dictating the standards then you get variances from group to group because each person has their own ideas of what the minimum standard should be. Instead I would like "ONE" standard that everyone knows ahead of time so nobodies time is wasted including the player seeking a team to do the operation with.


Met one already. I don't have time for that either. If you don't have time to teach a new player an operation then I don't have time to help you out when one of your players don't show up.
Wow, bro. Check yourself before you ASSUME anything about me. Do I want to do Operations? Not particularly. Do I like doing PvP? On occasion. Am I good at it? Yes. Now, for the BIG question: Do I want someone from halfway across the galaxy blind inviting me to group? No. My one real pet peeve from my days in City of Heroes and the WoW beta is the Blind Invite. It's the main reason why I keep my Ignore Group Invites turned on. But even when people blind invite with the Ignore Group Invites turned on, it spams my chat channel until I once again have to take time out from playing to put that person on my Ignore List.

And before you accuse me of being anti-social, I prefer to play with my gf and/or our friends. When they're on, I turn my Group Ignore off to get grouped up. Unfortunately, when I change the setting on one toon, it changes the settings on all my toons for the Group Invite Ignore feature.

I am against the LFG tool. Can't stand it. It's WoWers that wanted it, and after playing WoW in beta and constantly putting up with the sheer stupidity on display there, I went back to EVE where intelligence is in much more plentiful supply. In spite of TOR's similarities to WoW, I am a Star Wars and BioWare fan. Also, the break from constant PvP in EVE is a relaxing change of pace.
. OPOD
The New Jedi Code: "Keep Calm & Carry a Lightsaber"