I agree that thermite is objectively more powerful, but proton has three major things going for it:

1. Proton torpedoes are starwarsy and thermites are not.
   
2. Proton torpedoes are awesome giant blue balls of death (unless they enemy has a missile break in which case they are giant blue balls of impotence)
   
3. I'm quite fond of the extra 1.5km range.
   

Also if you deliberately avoid the extra speed talent and lock onto the bomber at max range you get to troll them for a really long time before it actually hits.

I take the extra arc on both torps on all ships that have them now. I'm of the opinion that a point blank with either is just as good with or without the speed talent, but is way easier to launch with the extra wide, and at long range the extra speed often never matters- the ship either has a break or it doesn't, and the speed seems to so rarely matter there. The times when the lock break will come up midflight are just not normally good for either speed of torp.

Also, the extra arc greatly reduces the "ninja lock loss", normally caused by the server thinking they blipped out of your circle. You have a much larger circle on the server too, after all.

(and ofc extra kill zone is IMO mandatory crew passive on any build that wants to land any kind of torp)

I found that the extra speed was really great for midrange launches, but I think as time passed it rarely cheeses the threshold of reaction like it used to- the player is either incapable of breaking the lock, or capable, mostly, these days.

I take the extra arc on both torps on all ships that have them now. I'm of the opinion that a point blank with either is just as good with or without the speed talent, but is way easier to launch with the extra wide, and at long range the extra speed often never matters- the ship either has a break or it doesn't, and the speed seems to so rarely matter there. The times when the lock break will come up midflight are just not normally good for either speed of torp.

 

Also, the extra arc greatly reduces the "ninja lock loss", normally caused by the server thinking they blipped out of your circle. You have a much larger circle on the server too, after all.

 

(and ofc extra kill zone is IMO mandatory crew passive on any build that wants to land any kind of torp)

 

 

I found that the extra speed was really great for midrange launches, but I think as time passed it rarely cheeses the threshold of reaction like it used to- the player is either incapable of breaking the lock, or capable, mostly, these days.

Yes. I agree with all this. The ninja lock loss, the point blank launch, everything.

I find a bit sad that the speed talent doesn't really have a use... And lately I wondered : "what if the firing arc was improved by 2 degrees as baseline, and the talent would improve it only for 2 degrees further instead of 4 ? Would it be more tempting to go the speed route given the arc route would be less game-changing ?"

Yes. I agree with all this. The ninja lock loss, the point blank launch, everything.

 

I find a bit sad that the speed talent doesn't really have a use... And lately I wondered : "what if the firing arc was improved by 2 degrees as baseline, and the talent would improve it only for 2 degrees further instead of 4 ? Would it be more tempting to go the speed route given the arc route would be less game-changing ?"

Well... On a double torpedoes T2 GS, I would go with speed simply because a GS doesn't have enough boost to get in close and launch the torp. on a long range Quell too.

Updated, will add a few more slightly altered builds that I've changed over time. For example, I almost exclusively use Wingman/Running Interference across all ships (minor exceptions to the rule) and I've come to love Laser Cannon.

Put a thermite dot on something, and he'll pop out from behind a satellite and just end that guy.

Truth. I can smell Thermite trails in space.

Yes. I agree with all this. The ninja lock loss, the point blank launch, everything.

 

I find a bit sad that the speed talent doesn't really have a use... And lately I wondered : "what if the firing arc was improved by 2 degrees as baseline, and the talent would improve it only for 2 degrees further instead of 4 ? Would it be more tempting to go the speed route given the arc route would be less game-changing ?"

I'd be inclined to say yes. I think the ninja lock loss is a major, if not the major, reason why the firing arc upgrade is so much better.

Personally I'd love it if they used concussions as a firing arc base line and brought thermites/protorps in line with the degree difference already established between concs and clusters (24 & 28 degrees respectively). So it'd look like this (with crew passive): thermites/protorps 20 degree firing arc, concs 24 degree, clusters 28 degree. It would help sooo much in countering the ninja lock loss and make them much more viable in a dogfight.

I found that the extra speed was really great for midrange launches, but I think as time passed it rarely cheeses the threshold of reaction like it used to- the player is either incapable of breaking the lock, or capable, mostly, these days.

I've been noticing this a lot myself. I just dismissed it as due to my skills being super rusty but I guess not if others have noticed this too.

I actually still believe that missile speed is incredibly important (moreso with Proton since the locks don't randomly disappear as much). I rarely ever have trouble locking torpedoes due to the reduced firing arc (though I recognize that clearly, others do). Giving your opponent less time to react will always be important in a game like this. It's why point-blanking is so useful. Since that can't be done all the time, minimizing travel time maximizes the chance you'll actually deal damage with your heavy-hitter. At 1000m, 2000m, 3000m, wherever. Especially with the increasing use of Power Dive.

It's nice to see an option that actually has good trade-offs while avoiding the boring, old "+dmg this or +dmg that."

Another interesting personal experience is that since running Thermites exclusively on scouts, I don't have nearly as much trouble maintaining locks if I overcompensate for their trajectory (which is easier to do thanks to superior pitch/yaw). Yeah, that bug is still there, but it isn't there in addition to the difficulty of locking on more agile targets with a hulking strike fighter (among other things).

I'm thinking we should probably update a few of the builds at the front. For example I really don't think we should have quads/cluster sting at the front anymore.

Also I was thinking we should add a tip in the gunship section about how important it is to fire at your target as close the middle of your firing arc as possible. By pushing past your target and snaping back as you get to full charge, to get more accuracy out of your shots.

I think a small write-up about power management would be good too.

Specifically:

1- The effects of F1-F2-F3 (from devpost http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?p=7296379)

F1:

+10% blaster damage

-10% base capacity to shield max

-10% base speed to speed

+50%base regen to Blasters regen

-25% base shield regen to shield regen

-25% base engine regen to engine regen.

F2:

-5% blaster damage

+20% base capacity to shield max

-10% base speed to speed

-25% base regen to Blasters regen

+50% base shield regen to shield regen

-25% base engine regen to engine regen.

F3:

-5% blaster damage

-10% base capacity to shield max

+20% base speed to speed

-25% base regen to Blasters regen

-25% base shield regen to shield regen

+50% base engine regen to engine regen.

2- Top times to press these. Examples:

> (obvious) If being pursued, F3 is very solid. It boosts your engine regen, which is your primary run tool, and your speed.

> (nuanced) If LOSsing around a satellite or rock, alternating between F3 and max throttle and F2 and min throttle will give you a wide variance in speed, the first giving you a lot of speed, the second giving you much more turning radius than any other setting.

> (obvious) When attacking an enemy, F1 is almost mandatory. You make sharper turns and deal 16% more damage than F3, and deal 16% damage than F2, and your blaster power comes back much faster.

> (obvious) Most shields do not regen under fire, so switching out of F2 is advised. But it can be swapped back to for great effect if you want an arc to regen fast and you have stayed out of fire on that arc for a couple seconds.

> (obvious) On a gunship, you often want to be in F1 mode when sniping. This gives you back a lot of power.

> (nuanced) If you are using F3 to get places and then switch to sniper mode, what you do depends on what you think will be happening. If you plan to take one-two shots and then leave, just never leave F3. If you plan to do that a few times, then switch to F1 right away (minimizing your railgun energy loss to charging), and about as you launch your first shot, switch back to F3 for a bit to dip into that sweet "engine power NOT recently consumed" regen. Basically, play your engine pools based on what you think will be needed.

> Generally F3 is better defense than F2, but both are needed. If you have a choice betwixt a few seconds at F3 plus a few seconds at F2, this will give you more regen for each than all that time at F4.

3- Emphasize how important energy management is to proper play.

4- Emphasize maximum throttle when you need engine power and aren't under fire.

5- Boosting and switching to minimum throttle repeatedly is very good for varying your range, but because boost has an initial cost to turn on AND you never leave "engine power recently consumed", this will be very hard to maintain for a long time. It's much easier on a scout, and also easier with quick charge shields.

F3:

-5% blaster damage

-10% base capacity to shield max

+20% base speed to speed

-25% base regen to Blasters regen

-25% base shield regen to shield regen

-25% base engine regen to engine regen.

I'm pretty sure F3's positive effect isn't that your shields regen less, I believe this is just a copy paste error. It should read +50% base engine regen to engine regen.

Yea, sorry, fixed.

Though hey, who knows, it isn't like we get patch notes...

Yea, sorry, fixed.

 

 

Though hey, who knows, it isn't like we get patch notes...

• Fixed a bug where Galactic Starfighter was a part of Star Wars: The Old Republic.

• Fixed an issue where players thought content updates or balance changes for Galactic Starfighter would occur any time soon.

• Repaired a few broken lights in the Republic Fleet Hangar Bay.

• Increased crying about railguns.

• Type 2 scouts now offer quadruple requisition when using Burst Laser Cannons.

• Decreased odds of Star Wars: Battlefront offering serious starfighter gameplay to rival Galactic Starfighter in order to raise overall subscription levels.

• Fixed a bug where Drakolich thought consoles had value outside of being paperweights.

• Corrected an issue where Verain thought he was going to do something else besides post on the Starfighter forum.

Dunno man, those are pretty solid notes.

• Fixed a bug where Galactic Starfighter was a part of Star Wars: The Old Republic.

• Fixed an issue where players thought content updates or balance changes for Galactic Starfighter would occur any time soon.

• Repaired a few broken lights in the Republic Fleet Hangar Bay.

• Increased crying about railguns.

• Type 2 scouts now offer quadruple requisition when using Burst Laser Cannons.

• Decreased odds of Star Wars: Battlefront offering serious starfighter gameplay to rival Galactic Starfighter in order to raise overall subscription levels.

• Fixed a bug where Drakolich thought consoles had value outside of being paperweights.

• Corrected an issue where Verain thought he was going to do something else besides post on the Starfighter forum.

 

Dunno man, those are pretty solid notes.

Seems pretty solid. Ryuku approves.

All builds updated, relevant information added. Further reinforced the idea that Wingman is ridiculously good and you are crazy for not using it. Ensured links to the already awesome tutorials are functioning. Annihilated some poor people on the Blackened Chicken.

... so in other words, more work has been done in this thread than GSF has received on its own in the past few months.

Addressing a comment made a while ago: No, I am not posting every permutation of every build in existence. You are welcome to do that and I will happily link it under "if you have a desire to bore yourself reading pages and pages of text without any logic or purpose behind them, click here." If you ask me, there's really only 3-4 solid ship options in serious matches anyway (which is a shame). Oh, before I forget...

... Hydrospanner.

Not enough love for Quads.

No, there's exactly the right amount of love for Quads.

Quad lasers are available on: The type 3 bomber, all strike fighters, the type 2 scout. Five of the twelve ships.

The type 3 bomber can go either way with its weapon. Stasie recommends heavy lasers, and I generally agree- neither weapon is good at high deflection, and as a bomber you can't often get a good bead on anyone. His other reasons are very solid, and the ability to ignore armor on enemy bombers is very important.

The type 2 scout build is a very solid one. It is arguably the strongest build in the game for that ship. But, since the type 2 scout has like every good component, other builds are available, such as the devastating "quads and pods" build. This build is not as general purpose, but it is absolutely linked to at the bottom.

The type 3 strike has quads recommended. The type 1 and 2 do not, and the reasoning is sound, given the roles recommended.

No one is claiming that quads are trash, however.

But there's quite the appropriate amount of love, and no further.

Lately I've been spending a lot of time flying the Sledgehammer/Decimus. This thing can really be a dangerous ship in both TDM and Domination. While overall not quite as OP as T1/T2 Scout and T1/T3 Gunship, it can certainly hold its own. It may not surive as long as a T3 Strike, but it certainly has more firepower.

The way I set it up -- it feels the way a Strike Fighter was meant to feel, albeit a bit slower. It has the same turning rate as a default Strike. It has tons of firepower far and close range. It can both avoid and absorb plenty of hits. With Powerdive, its mobility is actually not as huge of a weakness as you might expect. It still has terrible passive mobility but you can dart around quickly every 10 seconds and be a really annoying turtle to kill.

Additionally, this ship is actually very good at "bomber busting" -- which is what the ship tooltip actually states is its purpose. The HLC is great at quickly clearing turrets, mines, and drones at a safe range. Then once you get close to the bomber you can really slow him down by dropping an interdiction drone. This makes it actually viable to land HLC shots (which are terrific even against charged plating deflection armor builds). And your 2000 armor hull can survive plenty of his mine drops.

Using Stasie's format here, hope that's ok...

B-5 DECIMUS // SLEDGEHAMMER

:: COMPONENTS

Primary Weapon: Heavy Laser Cannon (T4 Ignore Armor, T5 Shield Piercing)

Paired with Wingman and range capacitors, this gives you a super accurate medium-long range weapon that can be used to "snipe" shots by centering the target and tapping the button. The ignore enemy armor upgrade allows you to clear a node from turrets/drones extremely quickly and easily. Shield piercing lets you play clean-up to finish off enemies that have low hull with full shields.

Secondary Weapon: Cluster Missiles (T4 Increased Range, T5 Double Volley)

This is your medium-short range option since slow ship turning rate and high tracking penalty of the HLC makes them less useful when enemies are up close.

Engine: Power Dive (T3 Increased Turning Rate)

With practice you can use this move to travel huge distances, even with 0 engine power available. This effectively lets you get behind a wall and out of line of sight (LoS). This makes it very difficult for Gunships to kill you. You will laugh when a Gunship nails you with a full Ion Railgun because you can usually get out of his 15000m range as well as LoS. And if a Scout is chasing you, drop an Interdiction Drone (more on that later) and spam cluster missiles. This Engine really offers a massive boost to the ship's mobility and removes the "sitting duck" weakness associated with bombers. If you want to kill this T3 bomber then be prepared for a long annoying chase. The increased turning rate combined with the turning capacitors (more on that later) effectively gives this ship the same turning as a default Strike.

Systems: Interdiction Drone (T4 Increased Interdiction Effect, T5 Additional Active Drone)

As stated earlier, this can be very effective in combination with crafty use of powerdive. When getting focused by a Scout, find a good nook to hide behind, and drop the drone. Spam a bunch of cluster missiles and you will likely kill him or at least put a nice dent in him.

The drone can also be used offensively. Let's say you're trying to cap a satellite and you're cycling through enemies with the tab button. A gunship is 14000m away. Do you hide? You would have to as a T1 or T2 bomber. But what I like to do with the T3 bomber is to powerdive toward the gunship, get in 3000m range, drop the drone and pound him with HLC and clusters. The beauty here is that you can survive a lot of hits point blank and/or hits from supporting teamates.

Shields: Overcharged Shield (T3 Right Side)

This shield brings your base up to 2700 shield and 2000 armor for a total of 4700 hit points. And with the T3 upgrade you can instantly regenerate 450 shield (thanks Verain), so effectively this ship has 5150 hit points. That means 4 slug railguns, 7 close up BLC shots, 6 double volley cluster missiles. Obviously crits will change these values but the point is that it's not easy to take down.

Thruster: Turning Thrusters

The 10% boost here combined with the 10% boost on Power Dive gives this bomber the same turning as a default Strikefighter. This is extremely useful in keeping the enemy in your sites for cluster missiles. It is also somewhat important for centering your HLC shots.

Reactor: Large Reactor

More shields to protect yourself with. Most kills are done through high damage in a short period.

Capacitor: Range Capacitor

PowerDive makes the active mobility very good. However, this bomber's passive mobility is still very very slow. So the more range you have, the better. A lot of times you will find yourself almost stationary while lining up and "sniping" targets with HLC in the 6000-6900m range.

Magazine: Regeneration Extender OR Munitions

I think this selection is personal preference. If you find yourself using more HLC than clusters, then select the Regen Extender. If you find yourself running out of clusters a lot, pick Munitions. I personally pick Regen Extender because I can usually resupply cluster missiles from a friendly drone.

:: CREW

Copilot: Salana Rok / Akaavi Spar (Wingman)

Gives you a higher chance of hitting enemies that are off-center (heavy lasers have a huge tracking penalty) and targets with evasion. Hitting Wingman will get you more kills on high-evasion targets (like gunships and scouts) at a medium to long range.

Offensive: Jaesa Willsaam / Qyzen Fess (2 degrees to firing arc, 6% accuracy)

Most of the other offensive crew choices are very lackluster and do not contribute anything to bomber damage. Accuracy and firing arc help your heavy lasers and cluster missiles out.

Defensive: Xalek / M1-4X (10% shield power pool, 9% damage reduction)

More hitpoints.

Tactical: Salana Rok / Akaavi Spar (sensor focus range & communication / communication & dampening)

Increased sensor focus range for finding enemies across the battlefield and communication range for a better view of the battlefield. Primarily chosen for the active ability, Wingman. Unfortunately, the Republic only has two options for Wingman, neither of which are all that great.

Engineering: Blizz / C2-N2 (10% engine power pool, 13% engine efficiency) or Yuun / 2V-R8 (13% weapon power efficiency, 13% engine efficiency)

Personal preference. I use Yuun/2V-R8 for more HLC shots.

Overall I find this ship is a lot more fun to play than the T3 Strike. And this build is very effective in both Domination and TDM -- whereas with the T3 Strike you are better off building the ship specifically for one of the two match types

This should always be on first page!

I wonder if we could have one post that always on first page of the forum and keep all the useful guide posts and links.

This should always be on first page!

 

I wonder if we could have one post that always on first page of the forum and keep all the useful guide posts and links.

I agree. If only there were some way to integrate this guide into the game like how DotA does with some of their guides. How many terrible builds could be avoided by making this guide required reading?

I agree. If only there were some way to integrate this guide into the game like how DotA does with some of their guides. How many terrible builds could be avoided by making this guide required reading?

I do wonder why they won't sticky this. The number of bumps in this thread is always extraordinary.

Probably because they (devs) think it's inappropriate to highlight one player's post as a sticky, especially since it has his name on it. It is useful, but there are more appropriate places for it like Dulfy's website, or 42gaming. More people would see it there anyways, I know a lot of gsfers who don't use the forums, but use Dulfy's daily.

Well, given that there are currently 22 stickied player written guides in the Class and Role forums, a number of which are linked on Dulfy as, "See this post if you want the full explanation," I'd guess that there's no official policy against stickies for player written guides to SWTOR gameplay on the official SWTOR forums.

A lot of those guides have the author's name in the titles.

There's a forum moderation and community relations team, and whoever is assigned to the GSF forum hasn't stickied much of anything here.

We've never heard anything about how they decide what to sticky, so we're not in a position to know why this guide isn't stickied while other guides of similar nature and quality in other parts of the forums are.

It's a nuisance because it dilutes the useful content of the thread with bump posts, but it doesn't get to be a serious problem until we run into the post limit with all the bumps.

I hope those players you know don't rely on Dulfy for GSF info too much outside of the build calculators. Some of the how-to-play guides haven't been updated since Beta.