I think maybe experimenting by allowing all Op specs to have access to defense / resist chance after using Exfiltrate but attaching a rate limit to it "Can only occur once every X seconds".

In defense of Exfiltrate, this nerf would kind of render the effect useless since Operatives use the roll so much regardless of the evasion-effect. We use it to cover ground, we use it as a gap closer, we use it as an escape tool and we use it as a defensive cooldown. See what I mean when I said they put all their eggs into one basket?

I find that making Sever Force/Creeping Terror spamable made me use it less for its tactical utility. I don't want to sit and count to nine in my head whenever I've cast the ability, so I don't. If I need the root effect I'll pray that it's available but it's largely out of my control. In 1.x I would sometimes use it for the damage and other times I would use it for the utility, but whenever the ability was ready I knew the root was ready, as well.

In general, I dislike those effects that can only occur every once per x seconds. Unless there's a way to track their cooldowns that I'm not aware of?

Phasewalk needs to be nerfed; change my mind.

 

People will disagree with me but I honestly think it's the truth. While most of these abilities do as you say, they aren't as bad as Phasewalk. I won't go into too much detail because I've already exhausted myself trying to explain it over the years why it is not healthy for the game.

See:

http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=960142

 

With a bit of fine-tuning, I believe these abilities can remain in the game with mostly the same functionality.

 

Exfiltrate: Add a rate limit for resist / dodge chance. "Can only occur every x seconds"

Predation: Remove defense chance, reduce duration, or a reduced movement speed percentage for friendly players

Phasewalk: Reduce range or consume all force upon use

 

I think these 3 are the outliers when it comes to movement ability balance, and they should be revisited after X years of being in the game.

Phase walk should not be nerfed IMO.

Nerfing sorcs would kinda be like buffing Fury.

That isn't to say I think they are bad or need serious buffing, I don't think that generally speaking, but they sure as hell don't need nerfing. They should definitely consider their place tho in 6.0. A notch two up on the totem poll I

I'm sure would be met with some glee [within reason, of course].

And yeah, by all means, Nerf Perdation, not like they don't need to spend a utility point to use a base movement buffing ability so they don't have to dump their DPS every time they use it, not like Berserk matters to Maras. Sides, it'd be funny to nerf Carnage for the 9th this meta. No reason to stop now.

Regarding Exfiltrate, I don't consider myself well enough versed to speak to it fairly, so I leave that ability to better, more experienced minds to debate on.

so they don't have to dump their DPS every time they use it

mara dps doesnt lower on use of predation because it doesnt respect gcd. it is considered a dcd and therefore can be used whenever causing little to no difference to a maras dps.

and for the record... I agree with this. I never believed the 10% def chance was a good addon, and making it so it buffs the op group by 50% rather than 70% does not seem overly drastic considering how much bs comes of an entire 8man cycling endless predation.

like your entire team being able to chase that poor pt. or sorc hlrs being able to kite half the dps classes for 5 minutes.

@slim bud do you realize that every class in this game has less energy to manage than sorcs do? they have have 100 energy, a sorc has 600. not only that but every class in this game cept for maras and juggs regenerate energy with no interaction at all. using basic attack doesnt regen your energy, it gives you some dps while your energy auto returns. this is why its important that sorc have this, because they have no abilitys at all that cost nothing. if they are out force tough luck, no dmg till they get enough back.

Regarding Exfiltrate, I don't consider myself well enough versed to speak to it fairly, so I leave that ability to better, more experienced minds to debate on.

It is hard to get a debate going as few people seem to actually read what I'm writing. They read the title and right from the start they've already decided to dislike and discredit whatever points I may have, not reading the text as a whole but rather react on details they can counterargue, such as "without exfiltrate Operatives would be broken", as if I wouldn't understand that.

But sadly, there aren't really all that many people to debate with. It's the same people, commenting over and over. I guess that kind of speaks for the game's health. In a way that makes it way easier to maintain a thread, but it also means there's less perspective given to one's ideas. I knew what I was going to propose wasn't going to be popular but I was ready to have a debate, as I zealously believe that the game would be better if the abilities mentioned in my original post were removed in conjunction with a lot of Crowd Control effects that's been added over the years.

Being subject to a stun isn't a fun experience, especially not when you see a white bar that is supposed to protect you from said stuns trickle down as you wait to re-enter the battlefield from the spawn area. By adding more mobility abilities to the game, they didn't make the experience more fluid. Quite the opposite. I miss the day when my primary method of traversal in PvP revolved around WASD*.

* btw, this is obvious hyperbole for effect. Get a grip.

But sadly, there aren't really all that many people to debate with. It's the same people, commenting over and over. I guess that kind of speaks for the game's health. In a way that makes it way easier to maintain a thread, but it also means there's less perspective given to one's ideas.

I agree with this. I think about it everyday when I posts on the forums here now.

I remember when the server sections were highly active, let alone the general chat section.

Now, it's us same half dozen clowns discussing pretty much the same thing we discussed 3-6 years ago. Class imbalances, game bugs, no new content, no communication from the SWTOR people, PVP class imbalance, etc.

Sad days.

mara dps doesnt lower on use of predation because it doesnt respect gcd. it is considered a dcd and therefore can be used whenever causing little to no difference to a maras dps.

 

and for the record... I agree with this. I never believed the 10% def chance was a good addon, and making it so it buffs the op group by 50% rather than 70% does not seem overly drastic considering how much bs comes of an entire 8man cycling endless predation.

 

like your entire team being able to chase that poor pt. or sorc hlrs being able to kite half the dps classes for 5 minutes.

 

@slim bud do you realize that every class in this game has less energy to manage than sorcs do? they have have 100 energy, a sorc has 600. not only that but every class in this game cept for maras and juggs regenerate energy with no interaction at all. using basic attack doesnt regen your energy, it gives you some dps while your energy auto returns. this is why its important that sorc have this, because they have no abilitys at all that cost nothing. if they are out force tough luck, no dmg till they get enough back.

Yes it does. If you use your 30 stacks to use predation you than have to build 30 stacks again to use Beserk, Everytime you use Predation, you can't use Beserk now. Building 30 stacks takes time. DPS = Damage per Second. You are adding more seconds until you can use Beserk if you use predation. It's always a DPS loss if spend your 30 stack to use Predaition instead of using your Berserk,

Always. Every single time.

Get on a dummy, every other time you have a 30 stack use predition. So do Predition, build 30 stacks than use beserk, build 30 stacks than use prediation than build 30 stacks than use beserk.

Than do a second dummy parse where you just use Beserk when you get a 30 stack everytime and never use predition.

Than come back after you upload those two parses on Parsley and link them here and show me where the one that you use predition doesn't have it's DPS effected at all and does the same DPS [or nearly so] as the one you use your 30 stack for predition.

Anyone who is using Predition specifically as a DCD is an idiot. As an added bonus to its other effect, umm, okay why not. Specifically as a DCD? No.

10% defense for some seconds or I am allowed to move again/ answer the call as fast as possible, I know which ones I would consider more appropriate a use for it in PVP. Given the amount of CCs that get thrown around every 2 seconds ad nauseam, I know what I am prioritizing.

Ask tanks how effective Defense is in PVP,

I don't know one Marauder of any Spec that considers Prediation as a DCD persay. They see it as a movement buff and what you need to use to activate your extra breaker if you took that utility which most marauders in the will take assuming they are competent and know there class. Fury can maybe get away without because they have a 6 second CC immunity every 24 seconds as a buy product of Gravity Vortex which is granted when they use Force Crush.

It has a 30 CD but that starts immediately, they have the first 6 seconds of that cooldown with the CC immunity in effect, and when it ends after 6 seconds that leaves 24 seconds on the cooldown. Now, that doesn't necessarily mean they will use Force Crush than, no one has to use any ability at anytime if they don't want to and not care about how that effects things, we'll assume however that most players will seek to maximize their effectiveness and use things when it would be most beneficial to use them. The more times they use Force crush [providing it's used wisely] the more time they will be immune to CC.

I'd imagine even some Fury Marauders would take it for just that much more 'I can do whatever I want, screw your CCs'.

6 and half years Carnage Marauder. I don't mind that you don't like me, that's fine, but please, don't be silly about it.

It's a straight up DPS loss your way, the worse case being for carnage, but even the other two. Rage = attacks/options and you can't DPS when you're dead, even some small heals can mean the difference between standing and swinging your lightsabers and lieing down doing nothing but causing some of your team members to trip over your sorry dead ***. It also means one of those people is gonna get hit by someone who had you still been standing you woulda been the one hit instead.

Berserk doesn't matter for Marauders. Just whole extra button you gotta push. Who needs that drama?

It is hard to get a debate going as few people seem to actually read what I'm writing. They read the title and right from the start they've already decided to dislike and discredit whatever points I may have, not reading the text as a whole but rather react on details they can counterargue, such as "without exfiltrate Operatives would be broken", as if I wouldn't understand that.

 

But sadly, there aren't really all that many people to debate with. It's the same people, commenting over and over. I guess that kind of speaks for the game's health. In a way that makes it way easier to maintain a thread, but it also means there's less perspective given to one's ideas. I knew what I was going to propose wasn't going to be popular but I was ready to have a debate, as I zealously believe that the game would be better if the abilities mentioned in my original post were removed in conjunction with a lot of Crowd Control effects that's been added over the years.

 

Being subject to a stun isn't a fun experience, especially not when you see a white bar that is supposed to protect you from said stuns trickle down as you wait to re-enter the battlefield from the spawn area. By adding more mobility abilities to the game, they didn't make the experience more fluid. Quite the opposite. I miss the day when my primary method of traversal in PvP revolved around WASD*.

 

* btw, this is obvious hyperbole for effect. Get a grip.

Well I didn't want to ignore the fact that the string was really intended to discuss that ability, that's why I thought I should at least comment on it, but I wanted to make clear, I don't feel I have enough actual experience with it to fairly make any sort of definitive statement about it.

I'm not a big fan of being sunned and ccs every 2 seconds myself so you definatelty have me on your corner on that part!

I'm not really sure what the best road to take would be. People get use to the things they have and they tend not to like change and even more so when they feel they are being singled out. Sometimes though it is necessary.

I'm sure it's a hard call to make especially when you know no matter what you do you are going to piss a lot of people off [even when it's justified!].

Definitely not something I should get a vote on tho heh. I leave it to those who should have a vote on it because they have experience with from both sides [used against, and as the user. - I don't like anything used against me heh ].

Im not sure how to respond about alll that jargon about pred costing "stack" except to STRONGLY advise you to rethink not taking the utility "pred is now on 30 second cd instead of costing stack"

its times like this that really make me wonder about you grim. the other point of interest was when you advised other mara to just fight to the death at 10% hp and die... instead of camoeing at 10% and trying for a run and hl. your argument was something like it "strains" your team to fight with only 3 people.... but I wonder how many theyll have when you die in 5 seconds since you decided to kamikaze your 10% instead of camoeing.

Im not sure how to respond about alll that jargon about pred costing "stack" except to STRONGLY advise you to rethink not taking the utility "pred is now on 30 second cd instead of costing stack"

 

its times like this that really make me wonder about you grim. the other point of interest was when you advised other mara to just fight to the death at 10% hp and die... instead of camoeing at 10% and trying for a run and hl. your argument was something like it "strains" your team to fight with only 3 people.... but I wonder how many theyll have when you die in 5 seconds since you decided to kamikaze your 10% instead of camoeing.

It's kinda crazy someone would theory craft mara pvp while assuming a mara wouldn't take relentless (30 second cool down for pred) and unbound (root break on pred and an extra 30% speed on top of the 50% for pred).

Using predation on demand, at the exact moment you need it, is probably one of the most important things a mara can know. You can't wait for the stacks, and saving the stacks would hurt your damage.

Need to save your teammate/healer who suddenly got hard focus swapped? .........use predation.

Need to break line of sight cause an enemy threw up a overpowered dcd or burst? ..............use predation

Need your dps to catch up to that sorc that just used phase walk?.............use predation

Need to give your huttball carrier a boost so he can get across the acid area?.........use predation

Need to get your team to the nodes faster at the start of a match?.......use predation

...and probably a billion other uses. Predation, and it's root break utility, works on every member of your operation.

It's not nearly as useful unless you use it at the right time, and having to wait 4-5 gcds to build stacks isn't going to cut it. A mara who wants their team to win probably takes both predation utilities.

Im not sure how to respond about alll that jargon about pred costing "stack" except to STRONGLY advise you to rethink not taking the utility "pred is now on 30 second cd instead of costing stack"

 

its times like this that really make me wonder about you grim. the other point of interest was when you advised other mara to just fight to the death at 10% hp and die... instead of camoeing at 10% and trying for a run and hl. your argument was something like it "strains" your team to fight with only 3 people.... but I wonder how many theyll have when you die in 5 seconds since you decided to kamikaze your 10% instead of camoeing.

He is a decent mara.

I always see people give Grim grief on the forums about his gameplay but in regs he does well above average DPS even without heals.

I don't know what utilities he uses, or if he kamikazes too much, I just know he presses buttons good and puts out good DPS compared to tons of other mara I seen in WZs.

I never questioned his dps. supposedly he was once a NiM raider, so I always assumed he could dps.

there have been 3 points in his posts on this forum that have really made me go "HuH??!!......"

• he wasnt aware that the blood ward utility heals you for 3% every time your attacked during saberward
  
• he doesnt take pred 30 sec cd utility (??!)
  
• and he does not support camoeing and healing at low hp on mara.
  

also.. Im pretty sure at one point he advocated that carnage and anni should get to keep original RA effect... regardless of the fact that cc imunity does not make or break a spec in pvp or that most dps classes really only have 1 viable dps spec out of 2/3

(I feel like the pvp forum is slowly spiraling into a hangout for old school pvpers where we just talk. Im pretty sure we all understand by now that bioware doesnt care what we think of balance and doesnt want or care about our input.. since you know.. they never respond to any nerf or buff thread.)

I never questioned his dps. supposedly he was once a NiM raider, so I always assumed he could dps.

 

there have been 3 points in his posts on this forum that have really made me go "HuH??!!......"

 

• he wasnt aware that the blood ward utility heals you for 3% every time your attacked during saberward
  
• he doesnt take pred 30 sec cd utility (??!)
  
• and he does not support camoeing and healing at low hp on mara.
  

 

also.. Im pretty sure at one point he advocated that carnage and anni should get to keep original RA effect... regardless of the fact that cc imunity does not make or break a spec in pvp or that most dps classes really only have 1 viable dps spec out of 2/3

 

 

 

(I feel like the pvp forum is slowly spiraling into a hangout for old school pvpers where we just talk. Im pretty sure we all understand by now that bioware doesnt care what we think of balance and doesnt want or care about our input.. since you know.. they never respond to any nerf or buff thread.)

I don't understand his logic sometimes, and I'd say he's a bit eccentric but I think he's lying when he says he doesn't camo out and go heal up lol. I mean seriously what mara doesn't do that.

As for BW, I never once seen them comment in the PVP section, ever. I also never seen any sort of discussion with them regarding class balance in PVP either.

Seems they make class balance changes for PVP based on secret influencers or some other way, they don't seem to interact with players about PVP on the forums that's for sure.

Well I didn't want to ignore the fact that the string was really intended to discuss that ability, that's why I thought I should at least comment on it, but I wanted to make clear, I don't feel I have enough actual experience with it to fairly make any sort of definitive statement about it.

Oh, I wasn't criticizing that. I was mainly commenting on "so I leave that ability to better, more experienced minds to debate on." It's impossible to get a debate going because even those who play Operatives would rather just write "lol", instead of reading and exploring ideas.

 

As for BW, I never once seen them comment in the PVP section, ever. I also never seen any sort of discussion with them regarding class balance in PVP either.

 

Seems they make class balance changes for PVP based on secret influencers or some other way, they don't seem to interact with players about PVP on the forums that's for sure.

Hasn't that always been the case though? Rather than listening to the people that play PvP 24/7 and do nothing else in the game, they make changes based off of a few developers that casually do PvP here and there.

(I feel like the pvp forum is slowly spiraling into a hangout for old school pvpers where we just talk. Im pretty sure we all understand by now that bioware doesnt care what we think of balance and doesnt want or care about our input.. since you know.. they never respond to any nerf or buff thread.)

The pvp forum is our water cooler. I channel my inner kermit-sipping-tea meme every time I post here.

Hasn't that always been the case though? Rather than listening to the people that play PvP 24/7 and do nothing else in the game, they make changes based off of a few developers that casually do PvP here and there.

Yeah pretty much.

The pvp forum is our water cooler. I channel my inner kermit-sipping-tea meme every time I post here.

That's me, too. I basically use the forums to chat and discuss stuff with people who also enjoy SWTOR. I use it to vent, or just to chat mostly about SWTOR stuff.

As for thinking anything I write here is ever considered for use by the devs, that thought left years ago when I wrote ad nauseum about how awful and dumb it was that they removed the 3.0 gearing system and mods vendors.

So, to get things back on topic, is it the desync issue that bothers you? Ergo, if you fix the problem, you fix the problem? Holo Traverse, as I understand it, is buggy but it does require a target.

Yes. BioWare has been adding abilities that their game can't handle and it has had an averse effect on the gaming experience. If they could fix the desync issue I'd probably be okay with these new abilities, even if I do prefer the slower pace of the original game. But it seems to me that they're incapable of fixing this issue, so what's the right thing to do? If they were to remove these abilities for pvp then pve-players would be upset. But sometimes I think you have to do what's right and not what's popular. World of Warcraft did as much with their ability pruning, and with their highly controversial change to the global cooldown in their latest expansion (https://www.wowhead.com/news=283908/comprehensive-list-of-abilities-added-to-the-gcd-in-battle-for-azeroth). I had a lot of friends who were pretty livid about the GCD-change but once the game launched it seemed to blow over real fast. The point was to slow down the pace, and in my opinion, it did.

Yes. BioWare has been adding abilities that their game can't handle and it has had an averse effect on the gaming experience. If they could fix the desync issue I'd probably be okay with these new abilities, even if I do prefer the slower pace of the original game. But it seems to me that they're incapable of fixing this issue, so what's the right thing to do? If they were to remove these abilities for pvp then pve-players would be upset. But sometimes I think you have to do what's right and not what's popular. World of Warcraft did as much with their ability pruning, and with their highly controversial change to the global cooldown in their latest expansion (https://www.wowhead.com/news=283908/comprehensive-list-of-abilities-added-to-the-gcd-in-battle-for-azeroth). I had a lot of friends who were pretty livid about the GCD-change but once the game launched it seemed to blow over real fast. The point was to slow down the pace, and in my opinion, it did.

It blew over because everyone unsubbed from wow as a result of their changes

It blew over because everyone unsubbed from wow as a result of their changes

The ability pruning started in Warlords of Draenor (2014) and while the expansion wasn't very popular, the main reason was the Garrisons. Legion was considered to be a good expansion. Battle for Azeroth has not been as hot though, but that's mainly because their Azerite gear was largely a failure (admitted even by themselves). I don't know what the population is like these days but I wouldn't be surprised if they've been in a steady decline since Cataclysm. The game is over 10 years old now, after all. Do you think the game would have been more popular if they had kept adding abilities over the years?

It's obvious that you don't much like the idea of losing Exfiltrate. I'd love to hear your honest perspective rather than this hot air that doesn't contribute anything. Did you play Operative back in the original version of the game and, if so, what did you think about it? In which expansion was the Operative at its prime, in your opinion?

It blew over because everyone unsubbed from wow as a result of their changes

I think that Exfiltrate, in the current suite of skills for the Operative, is a necessity. I'm all for fixing the problem, so as to eliminate the desyncing that exists. I remember back in 2012 and 2013 that Sith "speed" would cause problems and it really pissed me off, then. The issue, though, is that, if Exfiltrate cannot be fixed and is removed, what do you do to pump up the survival skills of the Operative? As it stands, Concealment Ops have NO tree specific perks to pump up self healing - Healers get their skills, obviously, and Lethality Ops get that "free zero GCD, zero energy, zero TA use super heal" if you Exfiltrate twice. Yet, the one Op that is 100% melee gets nothing. So, you're idea of removing it would have to be balanced by either several cool down additions OR risking breaking Healer Ops entirely by pumping up current cool downs. I'm not sure that people would be ok with turning Ops into a stealth melee version of a Vangard Trooper.

Lethality Ops get that "free zero GCD, zero energy, zero TA use super heal"

its a 7k hl non crit and 13k crit. its also only available every 8-10 seconds. and requires you to be able to roll to do it.

its not "broken" lol

I think that Exfiltrate, in the current suite of skills for the Operative, is a necessity. I'm all for fixing the problem, so as to eliminate the desyncing that exists. I remember back in 2012 and 2013 that Sith "speed" would cause problems and it really pissed me off, then. The issue, though, is that, if Exfiltrate cannot be fixed and is removed, what do you do to pump up the survival skills of the Operative? As it stands, Concealment Ops have NO tree specific perks to pump up self healing - Healers get their skills, obviously, and Lethality Ops get that "free zero GCD, zero energy, zero TA use super heal" if you Exfiltrate twice. Yet, the one Op that is 100% melee gets nothing. So, you're idea of removing it would have to be balanced by either several cool down additions OR risking breaking Healer Ops entirely by pumping up current cool downs. I'm not sure that people would be ok with turning Ops into a stealth melee version of a Vangard Trooper.

Yes, removing exfiltrate would only work in the larger picture of an ability pruning across the board. In my opinion, BIoWare needs to revisit the classes and distribute various CCs, mobility abilities and immunities to the right classes. As it stands right now, it feels like everyone has access to roots and root breaks, everyone has access to a gap closer/escape tool, everyone has access to CC-immunity and everyone has access to reflect. This may not be true, but it's not far from it.

It's gotten to the point where Exfiltrate is the best defensive tool for Operatives, and similarly, Force Speed is the best defensive tool for Shadows/Assassins if you spend your utility points buffing the ability (sure, force shroud is extremely strong but force speed has a shorter CD; I often use it to cushion big hits). Should a mobility cooldown really provide that much survivability? Distancing yourself from your opponent should be survivability enough, but Concealment Operatives and Snipers are encouraged to use their rolls, not for the distancing, but in order to avoid damage completely. I'll admit there is some skill involved in pulling this off, but why put so much of their survivability into one ability? I personally don't want to use Force Speed as a defensive cooldown, but that's where we are at.

its a 7k hl non crit and 13k crit. its also only available every 8-10 seconds. and requires you to be able to roll to do it.

 

its not "broken" lol

At not point did I ever say that it was broken. Did you read Lethality Op as "Lethality is OP"? Op = Operative. And, I'm well aware that you have to roll to do it which is why I wrote that it procs off of Exfiltrate (ie. the roll). Did you even read what I wrote? Seriously!

Yes, removing exfiltrate would only work in the larger picture of an ability pruning across the board. In my opinion, BIoWare needs to revisit the classes and distribute various CCs, mobility abilities and immunities to the right classes. As it stands right now, it feels like everyone has access to roots and root breaks, everyone has access to a gap closer/escape tool, everyone has access to CC-immunity and everyone has access to reflect. This may not be true, but it's not far from it.

 

It's gotten to the point where Exfiltrate is the best defensive tool for Operatives, and similarly, Force Speed is the best defensive tool for Shadows/Assassins if you spend your utility points buffing the ability (sure, force shroud is extremely strong but force speed has a shorter CD; I often use it to cushion big hits). Should a mobility cooldown really provide that much survivability? Distancing yourself from your opponent should be survivability enough, but Concealment Operatives and Snipers are encouraged to use their rolls, not for the distancing, but in order to avoid damage completely. I'll admit there is some skill involved in pulling this off, but why put so much of their survivability into one ability? I personally don't want to use Force Speed as a defensive cooldown, but that's where we are at.

Exfiltrate is a weird gap closer / defensive "get out of there" combo tool. Ops got it for the same reason that Assassins got Force Speed. The lack of armor and health predicated the need for an ability to get the player out of a mess that a Light/Medium armored character isn't supposed to be in. At release, Ops didn't need it because the burst was such that the engagement window was short enough to not need it. Assassins needed it because, and I'm reaching back to 2012, their initial pre-buff burst was really low. Then they got buffed in early '13 and everything went sideways for a while. Another reason that Ops didn't need it, at release, was the combination of their wide tool set, the fact that they could kneel to avoid jumps/pulls, and they still had "roll to cover" to allow them the engagement area movement.

In reality, Exfiltrate only exists because the skill package got pruned. Once classes were determined at level 1 and abilities were consolidated to their appropriate classes - I really miss having Explosive Probe, Kneel, Roll to Cover, and Snipe on my Op, it was quickly found that Ops needed something to elongate the engagement range and to allow them to gain ground, when in pursuit of a target. Let's be honest, Sever Tendon and the Curbing Strategies (Masterful skill - Overload Shot reduces target's speed by 40% for 6 seconds) are both lackluster, since their restricted to a 10 meter max range. So, if they didn't add Exfiltrate, what would the option have been?

While I agree that Exfiltrate is probably note great for the game, I'd say that it isn't game breaking. I'm all for fixing the desync issue. Since I've just come back to the game, since 2013, I'm still trying to catch up to the changes. But, I'll say this:

• I don't like all of the CC in the game and it was as much of a problem 6 years ago as it seems now

• It seems VERY strange that there are so many anti-CC tools, which is the natural arms build compensation to mass CC

• All of the movement tools seem overblown and I don't understand the need for additional movement abilities at level 59

• Also, what is up with everyone having reflection?

There are a lot of things that classes needed and added mobility, for a great many of them, wasn't it. I'm assuming that a lot of classes got tools, because of changes made to PvE. But, when you do that, you mess up PvP which is where all of the CC, burst, speed, etc. problems creep up.

I love the Operative class and I think that I'm on Op #7, with another two waiting. I think, at the core, what you're wanting is really a fix to bugs and a pull back on all of the abilities that have caused the surge in counter abilities. Truth be told, what is the point of having CC abilities if everyone has the ability to counter said abilities? Where is the unique nature of the classes when everyone is vanilla?

EDIT: As a side note, I find this rather strange:

- lots of CC exists in the game which is why everyone has an anti-CC cool down as a base ability

- additional anti-CC skills get added, which forces all PvP players to take those abilities

- this results in the watering down of the original CC abilities, along with the presence of Resolve

Because of this, the original CC abilities are less powerful but players have additionally neutered their class's power by focusing on anti-CC skills, versus taking something to pump your abilities up. Round and around we go!