how is it bad design? explain to me how every single ability needs to always be useful in PvP

It is very bad design for a CLOSE-RANGE MELEE class to have an 4 range melee ability that channels over 3 seconds, is interruptable, cancels on movement, and also cancels once the enemy moves slightly away. It is bad design when also the TOP TIER 3/3 talents are focused around such a craptastic ability for a melee class.

There.

Lacking? I'm Vigilance specced and never finish outside of the top 3 dps in both PvE and PvP, I think this might have more to do with you than the actual tree itself.

Then you havent played against WELL played BH's, sorcerers, gunslingers etc.

And yes, its lacking when the top tier 3/3 talents in the tree are useless. Wasnt you the one who even said that yourself?...

Talents not worth getting = lacking.

When these talents are far at the top = even more lacking.

You even wrote yourself that Master Strike is useless, so the fact that the top tier 3/3 talents are focused around this ability just proves my statement. They should redo these talents into something useful, for both PvP and PvE.

It is very bad design for a CLOSE-RANGE MELEE class to have an 4 range melee ability that channels over 3 seconds, is interruptable, cancels on movement, and also cancels once the enemy moves slightly away. It is bad design when also the TOP TIER 3/3 talents are focused around such a craptastic ability for a melee class.

 

There.

Wow...Zen strike is the only ability focused around it and even then it's not focused around master strike itself, it's focused around Plasma brand and Overhead slash adding a % proc chance to them to instantly refresh the cooldown on master strike which I could see some people actually using if they are PvE focused.

It's not badly designed, you don't need to take it and you can easily completely omit using master strike in PvP, remember....It IS a Padawan learned ability thus it will generally find itself phased out against the likes of overhead slash and saber throw when it comes to PvP.

Yes there are times in PvP when you can get off master strike without a hitch, hard CC'ed targets and people that stand still for instance, but for the most...stick to your mobile attacks and stop relying on a mostly PvE centric ability!

Master strike is actually the next ability to drop from my hotbar once I get my hands on plasma brand.... shows how much I use it in PvP (rare to never) I've also dropped Shi-Cho and Slash since they have been phased out by Shien/Soresu and Saber throw/Blade storm.

Force Leap 2 second root + 1 second additional root + Getting Immunity against ALL CC and interrupts from players after a Leap = WIN.

However, I doubt that Master Strike will be prioritized 1v1 due to the other talents being super awesome. Better save it for when someone else stuns the target IMO.

Wow...Zen strike is the only ability focused around it and even then it's not focused around master strike itself, it's focused around Plasma brand and Overhead slash adding a % proc chance to them to instantly refresh the cooldown on master strike which I could see some people actually using if they are PvE focused.

 

For being the top tier 3/3 talent, zen strike is really weak. Its not anything special in PvE (for a top tier) and its completely useless for pvp. Top tier talents should be good and worth taking and moving up the tree for.

Then you havent played against WELL played BH's, sorcerers, gunslingers etc.

 

And yes, its lacking when the top tier 3/3 talents in the tree are useless. Wasnt you the one who even said that yourself?...

 

Talents not worth getting = lacking.

When these talents are far at the top = even more lacking.

 

You even wrote yourself that Master Strike is useless, so the fact that the top tier 3/3 talents are focused around this ability just proves my statement. They should redo these talents into something useful, for both PvP and PvE.

Yes it's lacking but it isnt neccessary and how many times must it be said....IT's A PVE FOCUSED ABILITY!

And I find your statement that I haven't played against good players frankly a little insulting to my intelligence.

I can decimate any of those classes one on one easily, the only class that I have to be weary of really is the Sith Assassin since they ignore most of my armor.

BH: Easier than people make out, Sunder armor to shread his defence, interupt flamethrower, not much else they can do that I cannot mitigate or counter.

Sorc: Leap, Kick, GG....absolutely nothing they can do other than spam lightning which is so easy to counter it isn't even funny.

Gunslinger: You should have rolled sniper, thanks for making it easy for me to kill you by picking a more close ranged class.

Marauder: Oh look a Juggernaught minus the armor (inc meme) u jelly?

Juggernaught: 50/50 coin flip fight against a well played one, totally one sided against one that doesn't use sunder armor and keeps trying to master strike only to get kicked.

Sniper: I hate you, one of the two Guardian hard-counters, can still be beat if you catch them out of cover.

Assassin: Guardian hard counter, but can still be beat if you play your cards right.

Again, the problem is all on you here, common mistakes and misconceptions, etc.

Assassin: Guardian hard counter, but can still be beat if you play your cards right.

I'm glad I'm not the only one that has no end of trouble with them.

You just described the problem yourself.

 

PvE = you can stand more still and smack the boss.

PvP = you move all the time.

And this is where several of the guardian abilities fails, because the devs have forgotten to take "they need to be able to do some dmg while moving as well in pvp" into consideration. They forgot to balance the abilities around PvP as well. Master Strike for Guardians is very weak in PvP, but good in PvE, and the top tier DPS talents in the Vigilance talent tree is focused around Master Strike, an ability that is useless in pvp. See the problem now?

 

They need to fix these top tier talents, and also fix Master Strike, so they are not a complete waste for a PvP'er. Because if the talents are focused around an ability that is crap in pvp, and only good in pve, then its easy to do the math and see that the talent tree isnt very good for pvp...

My point is that there are classes that are priority a dps class or a tank class but then they have there trees that are tank or dps trees... and each tree is also a pve or PVP class..

Also balancing PvP is always an impossible task cause you are trying to balance 1 skill with an infinite amount of variables.

Every single board i look at there are post that says this class needs balancing cause of this one skill. i dont think there is a single board on here that doesn't have people complaining

And gl getting a raid slot when you have absolutely no clue at all :/

 

There's a difference between "Spec" and "Class". See?

Guardians and Sentinels even SHARE a whole dps spec, did you know that?

 

And Guardians have 2 dps specs, and 1 tanking spec. In other words, its actually MORE of a dps class then a tank class if you use your type of "thinking".

Im level 48 jedi guard on anchor there dps is **** compared to my friends sent...but keep thinking the way you do your prolly lvl 14...

Yes it's lacking but it isnt neccessary and how many times must it be said....IT's A PVE FOCUSED ABILITY!

 

And I find your statement that I haven't played against good players frankly a little insulting to my intelligence.

 

I can decimate any of those classes one on one easily, the only class that I have to be weary of really is the Sith Assassin since they ignore most of my armor.

 

BH: Easier than people make out, Sunder armor to shread his defence, interupt flamethrower, not much else they can do that I cannot mitigate or counter.

 

Sorc: Leap, Kick, GG....absolutely nothing they can do other than spam lightning which is so easy to counter it isn't even funny.

 

Gunslinger: You should have rolled sniper, thanks for making it easy for me to kill you by picking a more close ranged class.

 

Marauder: Oh look a Juggernaught minus the armor (inc meme) u jelly?

 

Juggernaught: 50/50 coin flip fight against a well played one, totally one sided against one that doesn't use sunder armor and keeps trying to master strike only to get kicked.

 

Sniper: I hate you, one of the two Guardian hard-counters, can still be beat if you catch them out of cover.

 

Assassin: Guardian hard counter, but can still be beat if you play your cards right.

 

 

Again, the problem is all on you here, common mistakes and misconceptions, etc.

Have you played at lvl 50 yet?..... ><

Have you played at lvl 50 yet?..... ><

Yep (beta) the only problem at 50 is the broken and soon to be addressed BH/Trooper heals which many have noted.

The problem is BH/Troopers are only supposed to be "supportive" in there healing but they main heal better than Sorc/Sage and Smug/Agents, the problem starts to appear late 20s when they start being able to heal themselves nigh on indefinatley, hopefully Bioware took what many told them about the BH/Trooper and will rectify the mistake.

Nothing wrong with main healing, plenty wrong when that main healer is also heavily armored and hard to interupt, ofc now you know why several beta testers are playing Bounty Hunters and Troopers, and it's not for asthetics.

Pssst, it's because there healing is broken.

It is very bad design for a CLOSE-RANGE MELEE class to have an 4 range melee ability that channels over 3 seconds, is interruptable, cancels on movement, and also cancels once the enemy moves slightly away. It is bad design when also the TOP TIER 3/3 talents are focused around such a craptastic ability for a melee class.

 

There.

If we don't have to rely on it, then I don't see the problem tbh. The bug associated with it needs to be looked at no doubt, but if it's just added bonus to the Vigilance tree then I don't have a problem with it. I fully agree that it's bad design if we really have to rely on it in PvP, but right now I don't see the necessity of the attack while going Vigilance. When I imagine that up-time on a target can be low, then I see little to no use for Master Strike 1v1, and is very happy about getting Overhead Slash and Plasma brand along with Gathering Strength.