Just like many other things that don't make sense in this game, this one definetely belongs to the top list of most questionable abilities in the game.

 

Let me get this straight: I do not think that being able to interce/guardian leap to stealthed friendlies is by any measure balanced. This thing should not be allowed in the game. No matter what arguments you try to bring to defend this one this is just pure wrong.

 

Juggernauts and Guardians already have it very well on huttball. Forcing the stealthers to decloak would make absolute sense given the fact how they cannot receive balls when stealthed. Want the jug with the ball to intercede to you? Decloak please.

There's bigger core issues with huttball than interceding to stealthed teammates, I think. Edited January 28, 2013 by madtycoon

Warriors do have the best cooldowns in the game already. In fact one of my guildies, who is a jug tank was actually talking about this today. He doesn't want it removed tho and neither do I tbh. :S Esentially their is no difference between leaping to the friendly target or passing to them or heaven forbid a sorc sprints down and pulls them up. Edited January 28, 2013 by JackNader

Really? You think that them unstealthing at the last second is really going to make a difference? Whether the ball is thrown to a stealther (only to decloak at the last second), or a jugg intercedes to them, the end result is the same. A visible guy with the ball at the ledge.

 

Snipers should have to get out of cover for a Jugg to intercede to them. It's not fair that an opponent can't leap to them, but a friendly can. It's so unbalanced.

 

See, I can come up with a nonsense complaint too.

 

Stop wasting forum space.

Edited January 28, 2013 by jibboo

It's not really a significant change. By all means, make the stealthie decloak. The good ones usually do that anyway as Guardian Leap might be on cooldown. And if they're not aware that a teammate who might pass to them is approaching - well that's bad play and bad play should be punished.

 

Huttball would be more interesting if using Rescue, Force Leap, Guardian Leap, Force Speed would all immediately result in resetting the ball, as Stealth does. Then passing would dominate, as opposed to certain classes doing so. Even though those classes would still be better due to the nature of the map.

Jeeez, a bunch of stealthers being lazy to decloak come and defend this crap. That's some nice arguments you brought here.

 

And If it's not a significant change why be so against to remove it?

Edited January 28, 2013 by NoTomorrow

It makes no difference in organized pvp.

 

If you let jugg obtain the ball and do not burn him in a fire - it will be score. You better think how to win position to grab the next ball(s).

 

In pub, who cares.

It should only be a tank spec ability...

 

Edit: And it shouldn't work if your ally is in cover.

Edited January 28, 2013 by PAMuttoni

With all due respect, I had no idea you'd gotten experimental surgery to have your ****s removed.

 

What did you just say to me?

 

What? I said it with all due respect!

 

Just because you say that doesn't mean you get to say whatever you want to say to me!

 

It sure as heck does!

 

No, it doesn't--

 

It's in the Geneva Conventions, look it up!

Really? You think that them unstealthing at the last second is really going to make a difference? Whether the ball is thrown to a stealther (only to decloak at the last second), or a jugg intercedes to them, the end result is the same. A visible guy with the ball at the ledge.

yes it does make a HUGE difference:

1) small window to counter-> if he unstealths even with 2 seconds early or the ballcarrier got rooted/stunned thus delayed 1 of the guys that are trying to burn down the ballcarrier might instant react to pull the stealther down in the pit, I always do that when i see the enemy ball carrier jumping directly into our pit clearly theres a stealth waiting or a sage about to reach our endzone

2)chance to kill him off so ur endzone would get atleast 1:30-2mins of safety from that tactic->after ally leaps to him he goes into hiding till next time only interferes with a flashbang if really needed usually not needed since all jug/guardians spec into unstoppable and are immune to CC and 4 seconds is enough to walk till line no prob, the thing is its almost impossible to find that stealther and even if u do he ll cc u and use combat stealth and u cannot waste time putting multiple ppl to look for him around the spawn because u give too much freedom to the enemy team at mid and they`ll be over u.

 

And another operative/scoundrel exploit that needs to go is take cover in place! this should be removed immediatly, i am perfectly fine with them keeping the rolling into cover if any around but cover in place is retarded

Edited January 28, 2013 by iDraxter

I like these twists in PvP myself. If a stealth class can sap (8 sec) and capture the node in AH(6 sec) it makes for a more interesting match. It is the same with huttball to me with a Jugg/Guardian interceding to a stealth class.

 

They both seem so wrong but it makes those games more interesting, no?

I like these twists in PvP myself. If a stealth class can sap (8 sec) and capture the node in AH(6 sec) it makes for a more interesting match. It is the same with huttball to me with a Jugg/Guardian interceding to a stealth class.

 

They both seem so wrong but it makes those games more interesting, no?

replace interesting with very very hard to counter(huttball), for the sap and cap its super easy to counter as long as the guard is not brain dead(and u know enemies has only 1 stealth if they have 2+ then not keeping 2 guards is a instant u deserve to lose move) always stay at a minimum of 11meters from pylon/node/door and if u are a vulnerable class(not a stealther or have god mode CD`s) that would 100% die in a duel with an operative/sin openning on u simply lure/kite him away from the pylon/node/door thus buying shtloads of time for reinforcements, sadly all noobs stay right on top of the pylon or under 10 meters and that s a free cap for any decent stealther Edited January 28, 2013 by iDraxter

I like these twists in PvP myself. If a stealth class can sap (8 sec) and capture the node in AH(6 sec) it makes for a more interesting match. It is the same with huttball to me with a Jugg/Guardian interceding to a stealth class.

 

They both seem so wrong but it makes those games more interesting, no?

 

You need some skill to pull it off on AH against a decent defender. It can be shutdown with 2 defending players.

 

On huttball it's a matter of 1-2 GCD and the jug is already in position to score.

You need some skill to pull it off on AH against a decent defender. It can be shutdown with 2 defending players.

 

On huttball it's a matter of 1-2 GCD and the jug is already in position to score.

 

I tell you what ...in this case I think you do bring up a valid argument and I'm not against what you propose. I think this mechanic could use some tweaking as well. I have an Operative healer and therefore understand this argument and it's a valid one.

 

I don't withdraw my terminology that it does make for a more interesting game but I will agree that it should be looked at and adjusted to better the PvP system as a whole.

 

P.S. I don't think the AH sap cap takes that much skill tbh, I think it just takes having a dunce guarding

Edited January 28, 2013 by Master_Nate

Jeeez, a bunch of stealthers being lazy to decloak come and defend this crap. That's some nice arguments you brought here.

 

And If it's not a significant change why be so against to remove it?

 

I don't think it's an issue of them being lazy, they want to remain stealthed so they can continue hanging around the end zone in peace.

 

Just throwing it out there, but perhaps a good compromise may be that once they get interceeded to they are automatically decloaked.

My opinion is from two points of view:

 

(1) As a Guardian tank running the Huttball:

 

To Guardian Leap to a friendly stealth class on the ledge in Huttball is often half the battle. 90% of the time, I am immediately pulled back to the pit by an assassin or PT. so, does it really matter? Not really. In any truly competitive pvp, this is almost a non-factor because you're almost assured that this alone will not guarantee a score in Huttball.

 

(2) As a Sage healer, defending against this:

 

I actually don't mind it either. Frankly, a Guardian or Jugg that is being pummeled on in the pit walking to a ledge is essentially telegraphing that there is a stealth class they are looking to intercede/guardian leap to on the goal line. Most will walk in a direct line to the stealthed player, with no deception at all about where they intend to be -- on your ledge where the stealth player is hiding.

 

Great Guardians/Juggs will actually work to a diagonal vantage point to a stealthed player, and then Guardian Leap/Intercede under the center catwalk ramp, etc. instead of telegraphing where they're going.

 

99% of the time on defense, I work the high ground (paying attention to LOS, so that I'm not being leaped at by the ball carrier) and get on my goal line on the side of the catwalk ramp in which they are traveling.

 

I lay in wait & as soon as they either (a) leap up, or (b) pass up, I'm in the perfect position to use a force push on both players, sending them back into the pit where my team can dismantle them.

 

Defense against stealth in the EZ isn't that hard. It just takes situational awareness.

 

In either scenario, I would say taking this out of the game is a total request for a crutch and an unnecessary nerf that would only prolong matches.

 

I'd veto this request.

it adds utility to the stealth classes. taking that away hurts the viability of assassins and, especially, operatives, not the juggs.

 

but I tell you what, let's make your roots observe resolve and we can talk about guardian leaps to a stealth target.

 

in all seriousness, though, this point was already brought up, should he be able to intercede to your sniper under cover? if your answer is yes, then you're just another me me me kid who wants all the toys. if your answer is no, then I'll at least respect you for not being a me me me kid, but I'd rather not give up the one utility scrappers have in that wz. not that my opinion matters to you in either case. but there it is.

it adds utility to the stealth classes. taking that away hurts the viability of assassins and, especially, operatives, not the juggs.

 

This is an excellent point, just wanted to comment about that!

it adds utility to the stealth classes. taking that away hurts the viability of assassins and, especially, operatives, not the juggs.

 

but I tell you what, let's make your roots observe resolve and we can talk about guardian leaps to a stealth target.

 

in all seriousness, though, this point was already brought up, should he be able to intercede to your sniper under cover? if your answer is yes, then you're just another me me me kid who wants all the toys. if your answer is no, then I'll at least respect you for not being a me me me kid, but I'd rather not give up the one utility scrappers have in that wz. not that my opinion matters to you in either case. but there it is.

 

When I am running dps for my sin this is what I do unless my team is lacking on damage and controlling mid. I will always try to place myself ahead of the carrier for passes or intercedes. My guildleader and I do this often where I will get ahead and he will get the jump with myself never leaving stealth, against a bad team we cannot be stopped, against a good team the jig is up after the 2nd score and we adjust tactics.

 

It can be stopped but it amazes me how many teams I see that allow a stealth to stay in their endzone with no effort to deal with it.

My opinion is from two points of view:

 

(1) As a Guardian tank running the Huttball:

 

To Guardian Leap to a friendly stealth class on the ledge in Huttball is often half the battle. 90% of the time, I am immediately pulled back to the pit by an assassin or PT. so, does it really matter? Not really. In any truly competitive pvp, this is almost a non-factor because you're almost assured that this alone will not guarantee a score in Huttball.

 

(2) As a Sage healer, defending against this:

 

I actually don't mind it either. Frankly, a Guardian or Jugg that is being pummeled on in the pit walking to a ledge is essentially telegraphing that there is a stealth class they are looking to intercede/guardian leap to on the goal line. Most will walk in a direct line to the stealthed player, with no deception at all about where they intend to be -- on your ledge where the stealth player is hiding.

 

Great Guardians/Juggs will actually work to a diagonal vantage point to a stealthed player, and then Guardian Leap/Intercede under the center catwalk ramp, etc. instead of telegraphing where they're going.

 

99% of the time on defense, I work the high ground (paying attention to LOS, so that I'm not being leaped at by the ball carrier) and get on my goal line on the side of the catwalk ramp in which they are traveling.

 

I lay in wait & as soon as they either (a) leap up, or (b) pass up, I'm in the perfect position to use a force push on both players, sending them back into the pit where my team can dismantle them.

 

Defense against stealth in the EZ isn't that hard. It just takes situational awareness.

 

In either scenario, I would say taking this out of the game is a total request for a crutch and an unnecessary nerf that would only prolong matches.

 

I'd veto this request.

 

The crutch is the stealther staying in his own comfort on the goal line without having to reveal himself to allow for intercede.by not revealing himself he still has access to all stealth openers, in case of deception he gets to keep his 25% DR for moments he will actually consider engaging somebody.

 

The defending team should be allowed to actually prevent your intercede than to wait for you to jump then react. Force pulling you, still leaves room for stealther to decloak and get the pass, while in the other situation it would allow for defenders to deny this attempt by pulling the decloaked stealther before you intercede to it, which is balanced, and its the way how passing and intercepting the passes works in this game. It makes the overall battle more dynamic instead of having to rely on you having guaranteed jump beacons.

 

Dont lecture me about stealther hide'n'seek. If one is getting busted its his fault most of the time, you will not kick out of stealth anybody by random. Stop BS ppl that staying in stealth is so difficult.

 

No matter how you try to make it sound balanced it is not because there are two contradictig mechanics: a stealther cannot get the ball while stealthed but can be interceded to while stealthed. What makes your own case more special than that? How much more team work does intercede provide compared to a normal ball bass that it requires such an exempt? I understand if this was something that would require extra team work compared to regular pass, and thus need to be rewared with a special case in the game rules. But it is not. It is currently a mechanics that bypasses game rules.

Edited January 28, 2013 by NoTomorrow

it adds utility to the stealth classes. taking that away hurts the viability of assassins and, especially, operatives, not the juggs.

 

but I tell you what, let's make your roots observe resolve and we can talk about guardian leaps to a stealth target.

 

in all seriousness, though, this point was already brought up, should he be able to intercede to your sniper under cover? if your answer is yes, then you're just another me me me kid who wants all the toys. if your answer is no, then I'll at least respect you for not being a me me me kid, but I'd rather not give up the one utility scrappers have in that wz. not that my opinion matters to you in either case. but there it is.

 

The utility is already there for them being able to get to end zone while cloaked nobody challenging them on their way. Being required to decloak 1s before the leap is nothing extra special, and it does not remove the role of the stealther.

Edited January 28, 2013 by NoTomorrow

It can be stopped but it amazes me how many teams I see that allow a stealth to stay in their endzone with no effort to deal with it.

 

Well a lot of times there isn't always a stealther on the other team to counter this with. I certainly wouldn't want a mando/merc hanging around the endzone trying to find them with stealth scan looking for them. In fact I don't want any of my own team hanging around the endzone unless they are stealthed. Otherwise they are just leap bait and kinda defeats the purpose, no?

 

I would think rushing and controlling mid/the ball would be a better counter.

Edited January 28, 2013 by Ridickilis

Just like many other things that don't make sense in this game, this one definetely belongs to the top list of most questionable abilities in the game.

 

Let me get this straight: I do not think that being able to interce/guardian leap to stealthed friendlies is by any measure balanced. This thing should not be allowed in the game. No matter what arguments you try to bring to defend this one this is just pure wrong.

 

Juggernauts and Guardians already have it very well on huttball. Forcing the stealthers to decloak would make absolute sense given the fact how they cannot receive balls when stealthed. Want the jug with the ball to intercede to you? Decloak please.

 

With all due respect get better at the game, or make a stealthy or a jugg and you'll stop QQ'n. There are many things that need to be looked at. This isn't important.

With all due respect get better at the game, or make a stealthy or a jugg and you'll stop QQ'n. There are many things that need to be looked at. This isn't important.

 

Says the stealther.

The utility is already there for them being able to get to end zone while cloaked nobody challenging them on their way. Being required to decloak 1s before the leap is nothing extra special, and it does not remove the role of the stealther.

 

If they change it (would not bother me) nothing would really change, uncloak, hit shroud, get leaped to, force cloak then rinse and repeat.

 

Well a lot of times there isn't always a stealther on the other team to counter this with. I certainly wouldn't want a mando/merc hanging around the endzone trying to find them with stealth scan looking for them. In fact I don't want any of my own team hanging around the endzone unless they are stealthed. Otherwise they are just leap bait and kinda defeats the purpose, no?

 

I would think rushing and controlling mid/the ball would be a better counter.

 

Yes you don't really want to many players hanging in your endzone you will never win the battle at mid. But it doesn't take much to figure out something is happening when a jug on the other team keeps running into the pit with no one to jump to. I come to the conclusion there is a stealth and throw down an aoe and put some dots on him or just simply kill him.

 

But as you said controlling mid is probably the best counter.