In SWTOR the Sith Empire uses ship and uniform designs similar to those of the Galactic Empire in Episodes 4-6. But in Episodes 2 & 3 and the animated series we see the new clone-based Republic military using these same designs.

Did Chancellor Palpatine do this deliberately, thinking that nobody in this distant future would recognize these ancient Sith designs? Did Obi-Wan and Yoda look at these ships and think "Hm, interesting, I wonder where these designs came from" as they went about the business of fighting the separatists?

Or did some droid at the start of the Clone Wars just open up Encyclopedia Galactica and randomly pull up "Pattern #1247151 for Starships in the Billion-Ton Range", and "Uniform Pattern #14123114 for Galactic Empires That Used to be Republics"?

I realize that this is probably just the result of SWTOR's later design, leveraging the familiar association with evil (not complaining), but I wondered if there might be a retcon for this.

Thanks!

The Sith Empire of this time will eventually be defeated, and it's millions of citizens will become citizens of the Republic. And since this happens, it's not unlikely the Republic began using technology from the Empire to, perhaps, rebuild their fleet, or at least examine the designs and coming up with improvements on them. The dagger shape of Imperial ships may have been an efficient design.

Why wouldn't they exploit the technology of their defeated enemy? They used ancient Mandalorian designs (Kandosii-type Dreadnaught) to build the Dreadnaught-class Cruiser, in use during the Clone Wars. Another defeated enemy.

Makes sense to me. That's basically where I was going with my suggestion regarding a droid pulling up an old pattern in the Encyclopedia Galactica.

Of course, that doesn't rule out Palpatine doing it deliberately. He seems to be a student of history (e.g. talking to Anakin about Darth Plaguis).

Makes sense to me. That's basically where I was going with my suggestion regarding a droid pulling up an old pattern in the Encyclopedia Galactica.

 

Of course, that doesn't rule out Palpatine doing it deliberately. He seems to be a student of history (e.g. talking to Anakin about Darth Plaguis).

Well, since Plagueis was Palpatine's master it makes sense he'd talk about him.

True.

I'm really hoping for a canonical explanation here, and would appreciate anyone passing it along if it's known.

The Star Wars Extended Universe, despite taking place in an entire galaxy, has always been ludicrously small when it comes to things like this, and this game is no exception. Millions of planets, and where do we visit? Hoth, Tatooine and Taris. Thousands of corporations, and who inevitably designs the ships for each incarnation of the Empire? Sienar Fleet Systems. Billions of people living on Alderaan, and who do run errands for and/or slaughter? House Organa.

Despite the futuristic setting, technological stagnation has also been a long-running hallmark of the EU. We're several thousand years before ANH, and yet nearly every race in the galaxy seems to be at exactly the same point in their technological evolution that they are in the original films. So yes, the ships look the same. So does everything else, if you look closely. It's not this game's fault, so much as a bizarre and silly quirk of the Expanded Universe generally, to which the game is being faithful.

So, basically, blame the people who write officially licensed fiction.

The Galactic Empire is simply the Republic with a different leadership.

In essence:

1. Galactic Republic vs. Sith Empire <- SWTOR timeline

2. Empire is defeated, Darth Bane sees this defeat as the need for the Rule of Two.

3. Galactic Republic absorbs Sith Empire and uses its designs

4. Palpatine rises to power to Supreme Chancellor and declares himself Emperor.

5. Galactic Republic becomes Galactic Empire.

Hi all.

I found the answer on this site

in short :

1,000 BBY

The Battle of Ruusan. The remaining Sith are exterminated on Ruusan, with the exception of Darth Bane, who starts a new Sith Order with only one master and one apprentice at a time (this is known as the Rule of Two). Each subsequent Sith would bear the title Darth, with few exceptions. The Senate passes the Ruusan Reformation, setting the year of the Battle of Ruusan to the year zero.

The Republic Dark Age comes to an end.

In short Gratulor was right.

Interestingly, the Rebel Alliance ships are pretty close to the Republic Era ship designs:

There's at least one hammerhead in there, and the bigger ships resemble the big capital ship you see in SWTOR occassionally.

To a certain degree, I'm sure that's just Bioware trying to establish familiarity. You don't pay that much for a licence and then make it unrecognisable.

Interestingly, the Rebel Alliance ships are pretty close to the Republic Era ship designs:

 

There's at least one hammerhead in there, and the bigger ships resemble the big capital ship you see in SWTOR occassionally.

 

To a certain degree, I'm sure that's just Bioware trying to establish familiarity. You don't pay that much for a licence and then make it unrecognisable.

The reason the old design is in this time frame and in the movies time frame as far as ships go is that when a rebel army decides to over throw a government they take what they can get. Prime example of this is look at Afgan/Iraq/Pakistan/ect all these countries use old AK-47's for small arms. In fact if you spent any time collecting these (god knows I have) you'll find different types from different countries. For example we've confiscated some from China and Russia.

So in short Rebel armies will take any thing they can buy with what little money they have to fight. Also in this time period I'm sure that the republic uses Mon Cal Shipping Yards (or what ever the name of the ship building company is that produced the hammerhead design as well as the frigates in the original movies) as it's primary source of space tech, and in the original movies they where the chief supplier of ships for the Rebels since they did not join the Empire and split off to help the Rebels.

Its a scifi fantasy universe, it doesn't have to make any kind of sense whatsoever. If this was truly hard scifi with a thriving corporate sector and countless competing cultures then this kind of technological stagnation would be impossible.

It´s even stranger when you consider the amount of galaxy wide conflict the SW universe has seen, War is a major factor in advancing the rate of technological progress.

Its a scifi fantasy universe, it doesn't have to make any kind of sense whatsoever. If this was truly hard scifi with a thriving corporate sector and countless competing cultures then this kind of technological stagnation would be impossible.

 

It´s even stranger when you consider the amount of galaxy wide conflict the SW universe has seen, War is a major factor in advancing the rate of technological progress.

It wouldn't be impossible. As someone who makes very well-informed posts, the reason there's technological stagnation is they've hit a sort of technological plateau. There hasn't been any need to make things "better".

They can already travel from one end of the galaxy to another in a reasonable time due to hyperdrive. They already have shields that can withstand a fair amount of punishment (although, I don't think anything ever explains with Sith/Imperial ships have external shield generators, and Republic/Rebel ships use internal), weapons are effective enough, etc. etc.

It's why both sides are making so many "doomsday" weapons. There just wasn't anything else they could really do. Even further into the series nothing changes much. They've simply tapped everything they can think of, and the only advancements they make is changes in design or use of material.

It wouldn't be impossible. As someone who makes very well-informed posts, the reason there's technological stagnation is they've hit a sort of technological plateau. There hasn't been any need to make things "better".

 

They can already travel from one end of the galaxy to another in a reasonable time due to hyperdrive. They already have shields that can withstand a fair amount of punishment (although, I don't think anything ever explains with Sith/Imperial ships have external shield generators, and Republic/Rebel ships use internal), weapons are effective enough, etc. etc.

 

It's why both sides are making so many "doomsday" weapons. There just wasn't anything else they could really do. Even further into the series nothing changes much. They've simply tapped everything they can think of, and the only advancements they make is changes in design or use of material.

If i lived in the SW universe i would make it my life´s mission to produce an accurate hand weapon as well as an anti-ship anti-armor weapon that didn't involve missing the target 90% of the time.

I think the problem we perceive with SW tech is that we inevitably compare it to our current level of technology, and when today we are in the brink of nano-machines, anti-matter, mutiverses and whatnot, as well as practical deadly and highly accurate intelligent weapons systems... SW ends up looking a somewhat backward place.

The reson star wars prequal ships looks like imperials and clone troopers looked like storm troopers was to make it connected to the orginal movie's.

As for ingame lore.

They where build that way by a company.

If you buy lets say a tiger tank of world war two are you gonne complain it belonged to the nazi's or are you gonne drive it over your neighbors(who slept with your wife)car?

And amberham tanks are build on the same idea as the tiger being big thought and deadly.

In response to the original poster: When Chancellor Palpatine formed the Grand Army of the Republic in 21 BBY, the Republic had been without a military for about 1,000 years (with the believed eradication of the Sith) so the choice of what style to go with was purely open to him and the Senate. As far as efficiency, the old Sith ship designs may have been best, while the Republic Army's armor was the best in that category. This principle holds true in real-world today as the US GI M-1 Helmet's design is based off of the German Helmets of WWII. In-Universe, we see the Republican Guard's uniforms slowly evolve to the Stormtrooper format, but the officer's uniforms aren't seen until much later, and even Moff Tarkin's uniform as he's overseeing the initial construction of the Death Star is still slightly different then his 0 BBY version. As for the Rebel Alliance's ships, until the Mon Calamari joined their cause, all of their ships were just "re-purposed" vessels that the "local" Planetary governments had original used for civilian purposes.

But yes, this is an In-Universe plot hole that Bioware created by associating this Empire with the one that would follow 3,000 years later. Even the accents were too far (as the Empire = British, Rebels = American concept was invented by Irvin Kirshner), and in fact causes huge holes for the non-exiled races (SPOILER: Kaliyo comments that my Chiss Imperial Agent wasn't born into the Empire, but still has the accent, when there is no logical explanation for this... nor is their a logical explanation on why the Chiss joined the anti-alien Sith Empire).

And to the guy who brought up "old AK-47's" technically most of them are not old, as they are still being manufactured, nor are they to be solely associated with "the rebels and pirates" across the globe, in fact about 90% of the world's governments use the 47 for their military, the other 10% either use Germany's Hechler & Koch's answer to the 47, and the US, which is the ONLY country to use the M-16 (why? because it's a piece of crap... even the terrorists, gangsters, drug lords and rebels don't want it).

There are many things the Republic ended up with from the Sith Empire in the thousands of years after its eventual defeat. Including capital ship design, uniform style for officers, and most important of all a British accent like the ones used by Obi Wan and Tarkim. What I don't know is what happened to the Sith Purebloods? Did their lineage became muddled enough that they eventually looked like ordinary humans?

Nope! The Answer is Genocide the republic and the Jedi commit good old fashion genocide!

The ships aren't "Sith" in design, per sae. They're just Star Destroyers.

The term originated within the Old Republic and referred to ships capable of destroying entire star systems with their heavy firepower. The dagger-shape was said to facilitate the ease of this by focusing the firepower forward. Any vessel that conformed to this design, could be considered a class of Star Destroyer.

For instance, the Republic Sienar Systems Interdictor-class cruiser circa 3,956 BBY is a Star Destroyer. Incase you didn't know, the Leviathan from KOTOR that bombed Taris was of this make.

The use of wedge-shaped warships seems to be an ancient trend, dating as far back as over four millennia before the rise of the Galactic Empire. The designs were not limited to any one culture, having been observed frequently in both Old Republic and Sith Empire navies

During the Mandalorian Wars 3,963 years before the Battle of Yavin, a Venator-like warship was used by the fleets of the Mandalorian Neo-Crusaders. During the same conflicts, the wedge-shaped Interdictor-class cruiser and the Centurion-class battlecruiser were employed by Galactic Republic and later served in the navy of the Sith Empire established by Darth Revan.

It seems that the Clone Army Star Destroyer was most likely based off of http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Mandalorian_warship_(Venator-style)

I think the problem we perceive with SW tech is that we inevitably compare it to our current level of technology, and when today we are in the brink of nano-machines, anti-matter, mutiverses and whatnot, as well as practical deadly and highly accurate intelligent weapons systems... SW ends up looking a somewhat backward place.

The Sith Empire of this time will eventually be defeated, and it's millions of citizens will become citizens of the Republic. And since this happens, it's not unlikely the Republic began using technology from the Empire to, perhaps, rebuild their fleet, or at least examine the designs and coming up with improvements on them. The dagger shape of Imperial ships may have been an efficient design.

 

Why wouldn't they exploit the technology of their defeated enemy? They used ancient Mandalorian designs (Kandosii-type Dreadnaught) to build the Dreadnaught-class Cruiser, in use during the Clone Wars. Another defeated enemy.

it IS a very efficient design, it has the maximum amount of turrets able to fire at the enemy at all times so long as you keep your enemy in front of you or in worst case off to the side while maintaining a small profile. the only downside is you are completely exposed from the direct backside, not really a problem while on the offensive.

Despite the futuristic setting, technological stagnation has also been a long-running hallmark of the EU. We're several thousand years before ANH, and yet nearly every race in the galaxy seems to be at exactly the same point in their technological evolution that they are in the original films. So yes, the ships look the same. So does everything else, if you look closely. It's not this game's fault, so much as a bizarre and silly quirk of the Expanded Universe generally, to which the game is being faithful.

It makes perfect sense to me. You are stuck in the mindset of the 1800s-2000s. A period where technology has made leaps and bounds. However before hand it was slow and steady.

There are many things the Republic ended up with from the Sith Empire in the thousands of years after its eventual defeat. Including capital ship design, uniform style for officers, and most important of all a British accent like the ones used by Obi Wan and Tarkim. What I don't know is what happened to the Sith Purebloods? Did their lineage became muddled enough that they eventually looked like ordinary humans?

It's not really clear, they just ended up vanishing from the galaxy for the most part. It's possible that the bloodlines of the purebloods have only become a mere trickle... and possibly entirely eradicated with Bane's radical change in philosophy toward the way of the Sith.