Find a way to drastically and OFTEN change crew skills mats drop rate. Every 3 ish maintenance would be great.

Why?

Because 90 out of a 100 crew skill missions we run yield ONLY THE SAME OLD MATS.

Because it would force people not to sell out killing off a near dead GTN market because they need to clear off their banks full of the same old crap.

Your crap is my chance.

Yesterday I bought a bunch of really needed "prism crystals" (nice reference to Pink Floyd, by the way ) for my Sage.

Now I'm finally able to craft the colour modules I was planning to use !

That freak luck is great when it happens. But I'm looking at the market on the long term, not at the great one off.

I know many players would much rather discuss the coolest sentinel name, and bw the most profitable cartel market next cash cow...

But there's a whole really cool aspect of the game completely numb dead because of a blatant lack of vision...

nevermind misunderstood

I read your post as an email since I sub to this one. You put some effort in it, shame it was off topic.

I read your post as an email since I sub to this one. You put some effort in it, shame it was off topic.

Well it does exist in another thread

You can read the original at: http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=717610

The situation of an app to run missions and an increase in crit rate run parallel

My favorite GTN moments are when I check on the price of Bio-Mechanical Interface Chips and wind up buying dozens of stacks of them listed for 100 credits per unit.

That aside, the one thing I would ask of the developers is to just give us all the freaking missions in the list every time. I'm just going to relog until I get the missions I want anyway.

My favorite GTN moments are when I check on the price of Bio-Mechanical Interface Chips and wind up buying dozens of stacks of them listed for 100 credits per unit.

 

That aside, the one thing I would ask of the developers is to just give us all the freaking missions in the list every time. I'm just going to relog until I get the missions I want anyway.

You had the same misunderstanding I did ...(my "nevermind misunderstood" post was along the same lines as what you've posted). Read the OP again. He's asking for a total change it what materials are available not an increase in crit rate for purples. He seems to think that always getting the same materials is a bad thing.

That aside, the one thing I would ask of the developers is to just give us all the freaking missions in the list every time. I'm just going to relog until I get the missions I want anyway.

Might be a little OT - but this...a thousand times, this. Usually it only takes 2-3 logouts to get the missions I want, but damn it, it's still irritating. Absolutely no need for it. It's not like there are, say, 50 different missions for 51-55 slicing. That would be cumbersome to sift through every time. But there are, what, 9 missions total? And we get to see 5 or 6 each time? Just show the whole freaking list and stop wasting my time.

/rant

That aside, the one thing I would ask of the developers is to just give us all the freaking missions in the list every time. I'm just going to relog until I get the missions I want anyway.

*Shrug* Or maybe the devs could put in some code to detect relogins and "save" you mission list for you Anyway, just run one quick level 1 mission and it resets the list.

TBH, I like the randomized mission lists. You should have at least two skills with missions, and (at level 450) 7 tiers for each of those skills, and you can only run 5 missions at a time. That's plenty, and it [helps] keep people from killing the market by only running the most profitable missions.

*Shrug* Or maybe the devs could put in some code to detect relogins and "save" you mission list for you Anyway, just run one quick level 1 mission and it resets the list.

 

TBH, I like the randomized mission lists. You should have at least two skills with missions, and (at level 450) 7 tiers for each of those skills, and you can only run 5 missions at a time. That's plenty, and it [helps] keep people from killing the market by only running the most profitable missions.

We do it anyway. Run only the most profitable missions, that is. We do it by selecting missions we don't want, relogging, and one by one cancelling the missions we didn't want and taking those we did.

It's not killing the market, unless you think the market is killed.

We do it anyway. Run only the most profitable missions, that is. We do it by selecting missions we don't want, relogging, and one by one cancelling the missions we didn't want and taking those we did.

 

It's not killing the market, unless you think the market is killed.

I know there are a lot of individuals on the forums who claim they do this, but how many in the player population do it?

Even if a thousand forum-goers do it and a hundred times that (who don't post) does it as well, that's only 10% of the active account population (of approximately one million). And I do not think the numbers are that high.

I know there are a lot of individuals on the forums who claim they do this, but how many in the player population do it?

 

Even if a thousand forum-goers do it and a hundred times that (who don't post) does it as well, that's only 10% of the active account population (of approximately one million). And I do not think the numbers are that high.

I think this is probably correct. I'm pretty sure those of us that do the "logout dance" are very much in the minority. I'll bet the majority of the player population doesn't even know that works, and others either don't want to bother, or don't know why they even should bother.

Personally - I've been playing this game regularly for about 15 months, and I only learned how/why to do the missions I want within the past couple of weeks (and incidentally, thanks to DarthTHC and psandak, respectively, for enlightening me on the how and why). I've passed some of this on to a couple of interested guildies, but it was all new to them, and they've been playing considerably longer than I have.

I'm not sure displaying all the available missions at once would make any real impact on the economy, largely because of exactly this kind of widespread ignorance. I'm certain a lot of people would be perfectly happy to run only the cheapest missions they see (moderate yield), thinking it's a better strategy than "wasting" credits on rich/bountiful missions.

I think this is probably correct. I'm pretty sure those of us that do the "logout dance" are very much in the minority. I'll bet the majority of the player population doesn't even know that works, and others either don't want to bother, or don't know why they even should bother.

 

Personally - I've been playing this game regularly for about 15 months, and I only learned how/why to do the missions I want within the past couple of weeks (and incidentally, thanks to DarthTHC and psandak, respectively, for enlightening me on the how and why). I've passed some of this on to a couple of interested guildies, but it was all new to them, and they've been playing considerably longer than I have.

 

I'm not sure displaying all the available missions at once would make any real impact on the economy, largely because of exactly this kind of widespread ignorance. I'm certain a lot of people would be perfectly happy to run only the cheapest missions they see (moderate yield), thinking it's a better strategy than "wasting" credits on rich/bountiful missions.

I am one of those who does not bother (99% of the time) even though I know it's possible.

My reason is simple: each character has two crew skills worth of missions in addition to crafting, and 99% of the time there are five things worth doing...even gift missions (I am always leveling an alt, so gifts are always used eventually). That remaining 1% is the result of serendipitous occasions when the random mission set is lacking, but I am going to change areas anyway, so I take advantage of the area change to refresh the mission lists.

IMO listing all missions would impact the economy, albeit mildly. You're right that too many don't do the math, see 2000 credits for abundant and 3210 for rich and think, "I'll do the cheaper one." But I think they are in the minority too. The majority have done the math and know what's the best cacophony for the credit ("bang for the buck" ). So, the expeditious thing to do would be to phase out lesser missions as better missions become available. Eventually for gathering skills one would always have the moderate mission for vendor materials, two bountiful, and two rich missions per gathering skill; and two abundant, two bountiful, and one rich for mission skills. There's still choices to be made: with five companions and only three rich missions (assuming one crafting, one gathering, one mission skill); not to mention what materials to focus on.

I am one of those who does not bother (99% of the time) even though I know it's possible.

 

My reason is simple: each character has two crew skills worth of missions in addition to crafting, and 99% of the time there are five things worth doing...even gift missions (I am always leveling an alt, so gifts are always used eventually). That remaining 1% is the result of serendipitous occasions when the random mission set is lacking, but I am going to change areas anyway, so I take advantage of the area change to refresh the mission lists

Just responding to the portion of your post quoted above: I understand, and upon reflection, I actually do the same in some situations. I have eight alts right now, but I'm only actively playing/leveling two of them. Those two are both scavengers (and UT; one armormech, one cybertech, all 450). I don't do the logout dance when I'm playing those characters, because as you said, in short order I'll change areas and the list will reset anyway. Or I'll simply run what's presented to me, knowing that I'll get what I want later.

However, with the other alts, I just want to get them working on the most potentially profitable missions ASAP - so I can get back to actually playing the other guys. My two slicing 450's fall into this category. I do the logout dance with them constantly. I'm sure I'll get back to playing the other alts regularly at some point, at which point the dancing will likely cease for them, but for now, I feel like any other strategy would just be a waste of my time. I mean, I'm not going to have them run a mission just for the sake of running a mission...and if they're not actively out there working on, say, Unsliceable? - then they aren't doing anything for me at all.

We do it anyway. Run only the most profitable missions, that is. We do it by selecting missions we don't want, relogging, and one by one cancelling the missions we didn't want and taking those we did.

 

It's not killing the market, unless you think the market is killed.

"Killing" is probably a bit strong, but I think having all missions available would cause more harm than good. There are seven mission tiers and we can only have five companions out running missions. One crafting skill leaves room for two mission skills, so that's 14 craft-tiers available. If all missions were always available, I think people (being lazy) would try to figure out which were the most profitable and only run them. While that would work for a little while, I think we'd quickly get to the point where the "most profitable" mission goods oversaturated the market, and the 9-11 of 14 craft-tiers not being run would become scarce.

Technically, that would make the market more player-driven, as players would have to adapt their mission selections to reflect the change in which materials were in low supply (and thus should sell at higher prices, causing the five most-profitable mission-tiers to change over time). So, if I'm still going to end up potentially running all craft-tiers, I'll take the "lazy way" and just see which missions the RNG gods have given me today.

Also, it's more of which mission skills I run, not the tier of the mission itself, that (to me) determines my profits. E.g., I only run investigation missions to level up my alt's investigation skill or if I need a specific mat. I don't run them to sell for profit. I've never had a time when I couldn't find five profitable scavenging missions. IMO, you have to try not to make money with swtor's crafting system. As long as I keep making credits every time I log in, I have no real motivation to waste time logging out and back in.

This has been an interesting thought process to follow.

On the one hand, I do the logout dance all the time, across several crafting toons, cherry-picking the optimal missions and relogging as needed. So I would be happy to have the convenience of a full mission list and NOT having to relog.

On the other hand, I think it's a fair bet that many other players don't relog, or don't relog as often. Therefore, my efforts give me an edge in the marketplace. I work hard to get a stack of 99 Thermal Regulators to sell on the GTN. And they're a) relatively rare and b) in demand so I can be assured of selling them at a decent price.

Basically, I'm rewarded for taking the extra effort to relog to get the best missions at all times.

It's a funny dilemma. Would I be willing to forego long term profits in exchange for a more convenient method of running crafting missions?

It's a funny dilemma. Would I be willing to forego long term profits in exchange for a more convenient method of running crafting missions?

The real question is how would you react if BW was able to close the re-login exploit (which, no matter victimless it may appear, it is) and didn't change the mission RNG?

FYI, I don't think it's a big deal, but it is an exploit. I don't think whatever damage being done by the current exploiters justifies spending any effort to address it, but if effort does get spent, I would rather it be to keep the system and close the loop hole, not make the loop hole unnecessary by changing the system for what IMO would be the worse.

The real question is how would you react if BW was able to close the re-login exploit (which, no matter victimless it may appear, it is) and didn't change the mission RNG?

 

FYI, I don't think it's a big deal, but it is an exploit. I don't think whatever damage being done by the current exploiters justifies spending any effort to address it, but if effort does get spent, I would rather it be to keep the system and close the loop hole, not make the loop hole unnecessary by changing the system for what IMO would be the worse.

Is that really an exploit? Seems like a stretch to call it that. Changing areas has the same effect as logging out. So if, instead of logging out, I stood in front of the elevator on fleet and clicked the button repeatedly, going from, say, the cartel bazaar to main level and back over and over - would that still be an exploit? Where do you draw the line between "exploit" and "working as intended"?

I'm not even sure I'd call it a loophole. It's just a different method of refreshing the mission list. If BW didn't want us refreshing the list, they wouldn't give us multiple options to do so, would they?

Might be a little OT - but this...a thousand times, this. Usually it only takes 2-3 logouts to get the missions I want, but damn it, it's still irritating. Absolutely no need for it. It's not like there are, say, 50 different missions for 51-55 slicing. That would be cumbersome to sift through every time. But there are, what, 9 missions total? And we get to see 5 or 6 each time? Just show the whole freaking list and stop wasting my time.

 

/rant

There is a simple way to do this if you are on the fleef. All it takes to get the mission you want is to go to a loading screen. Send a random companion on a mission and then head to your ship. Once you are on your ship your new missions will appear. I do this with my slicers.

Just responding to the portion of your post quoted above: I understand, and upon reflection, I actually do the same in some situations. I have eight alts right now, but I'm only actively playing/leveling two of them. Those two are both scavengers (and UT; one armormech, one cybertech, all 450). I don't do the logout dance when I'm playing those characters, because as you said, in short order I'll change areas and the list will reset anyway. Or I'll simply run what's presented to me, knowing that I'll get what I want later.

 

However, with the other alts, I just want to get them working on the most potentially profitable missions ASAP - so I can get back to actually playing the other guys. My two slicing 450's fall into this category. I do the logout dance with them constantly. I'm sure I'll get back to playing the other alts regularly at some point, at which point the dancing will likely cease for them, but for now, I feel like any other strategy would just be a waste of my time. I mean, I'm not going to have them run a mission just for the sake of running a mission...and if they're not actively out there working on, say, Unsliceable? - then they aren't doing anything for me at all.

That's where you and I differ: I never do the relog dance...it is simply not worth it to me. The process of going through all six of my characters takes me about 15 minutes:

1. login
   
2. collect sales and expired item from mail
   
3. post (new and expired) crafted items to GTN
   
4. check my listings to see what I am missing
   
5. check GTN for deals on materials
   
6. start crafting to back fill
   
7. send remaining companions on missions
   
8. logout
   
9. rinse and repeat
   

And the last thing I want to do is spend another 15 minutes doing the relog dance (for me each logout and back on takes 30 seconds to a minute; 5 year old computer will do that).

In addition, because I am actively crafting items in all six crafting skills (one on each character), I rarely need five "good" missions per character. Add to that, that I need all materials anyway and I am never looking for one mission in particular. In fact, on my slicers (I have two at 450) I am more likely to run Credit Drain over Unsliceable, because I want the discovered missions more than TRs (I have 2.5 stacks of TRs sitting because I only use them for myself and friends/guildies [and I don't charge them]).

Lastly, when I am calculating my cost to craft, I invariably round up, because I am assuming a worst case scenario: all gathering materials cost 500/unit (running missions), and all blue mission materials cost 250/unit (buying off the GTN). Purple materials vary by skill and I don't use them often for selling anyway.

Is this less than ideal? Yes. Am I losing out on credits by not fully optimizing the missions I run? Probably. Do I care? No. Why? Because I would rather spend 15 more minutes actually playing the game than relog dancing. Another example of the interchangeable nature of time and money in MMOs; it is costing me credits to be able to play longer.

The real question is how would you react if BW was able to close the re-login exploit (which, no matter victimless it may appear, it is) and didn't change the mission RNG?

 

FYI, I don't think it's a big deal, but it is an exploit. I don't think whatever damage being done by the current exploiters justifies spending any effort to address it, but if effort does get spent, I would rather it be to keep the system and close the loop hole, not make the loop hole unnecessary by changing the system for what IMO would be the worse.

Is that really an exploit? Seems like a stretch to call it that. Changing areas has the same effect as logging out. So if, instead of logging out, I stood in front of the elevator on fleet and clicked the button repeatedly, going from, say, the cartel bazaar to main level and back over and over - would that still be an exploit? Where do you draw the line between "exploit" and "working as intended"?

 

I'm not even sure I'd call it a loophole. It's just a different method of refreshing the mission list. If BW didn't want us refreshing the list, they wouldn't give us multiple options to do so, would they?

I classify the "relog/change area dance" as something BW probably did not intend to work as it does, but the effect is so minor that it would be a waste of resources to "fix" what is probably a very complex "problem."

Is that really an exploit? Seems like a stretch to call it that. Changing areas has the same effect as logging out. So if, instead of logging out, I stood in front of the elevator on fleet and clicked the button repeatedly, going from, say, the cartel bazaar to main level and back over and over - would that still be an exploit? Where do you draw the line between "exploit" and "working as intended"?

 

I'm not even sure I'd call it a loophole. It's just a different method of refreshing the mission list. If BW didn't want us refreshing the list, they wouldn't give us multiple options to do so, would they?

Yes, it's really an exploit (as is changing zones just to reset the list). If BW wanted people to always have access to all missions, that's what they would have coded. They wouldn't have bothered spending time using RNG to generate a subset of those missions if it was intended for you just to "manually" refresh the list when you didn't get what you wanted.

Also, if you read Khevar's post, he clearly identifies that [part of] his profits come from his spending extra time to log out and back in. Unless you think that the devs consider "repeatedly logging out and back in" as part of the intended crafting experience, you *know* it's an exploit.

...

 

Also, if you read Khevar's post, he clearly identifies that [part of] his profits come from his spending extra time to log out and back in. Unless you think that the devs consider "repeatedly logging out and back in" as part of the intended crafting experience, you *know* it's an exploit.

Interesting. I've never particularly thought of it as an exploit, though I can see why one could argue that it is, but you'd have to guess at the developers intentions to make your case.

If the system were changed so that:

a) The list were still abbreviated, and

b) The list couldn't be changed without actually running a mission

I'd adapt, for sure. It'd be a bummer, but not the end of the world.

Yes, it's really an exploit (as is changing zones just to reset the list). If BW wanted people to always have access to all missions, that's what they would have coded. They wouldn't have bothered spending time using RNG to generate a subset of those missions if it was intended for you just to "manually" refresh the list when you didn't get what you wanted.

 

Also, if you read Khevar's post, he clearly identifies that [part of] his profits come from his spending extra time to log out and back in. Unless you think that the devs consider "repeatedly logging out and back in" as part of the intended crafting experience, you *know* it's an exploit.

I think BW's intention was to present a randomized list of available crafting missions, which changes at each new area. I don't think that's in question. I don't understand why intentionally changing zones in order to reset the list would be considered an exploit, while "unintentionally" resetting said list is entirely kosher. Same exact experience, identical results, motivated by different goals.

Seems to me this is more of a semantic issue than anything else. Out of curiosity, can you think of any other comparable exploits in the game? That is, a mechanic working as intended, but leveraged in a way that wasn't intended by the developers. I'm wondering if I would agree with that terminology in those other cases.