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Expansion size


IanArgent's Avatar


IanArgent
05.12.2016 , 03:45 PM | #11
Actually, I need to do some math on the alliance rep grind vs classic rep grind. It might not end up being so bad.

As for repeating content, I noted that there really hadn't been much factional difference post Ilum. The names and the quest givers change, is all. And KotFE has much more "story" content if measured by cut scene length, it's just visible on one play through instead of requiring two.
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Knorlac's Avatar


Knorlac
05.12.2016 , 03:54 PM | #12
Quote: Originally Posted by IanArgent View Post

As for repeating content, I noted that there really hadn't been much factional difference post Ilum. The names and the quest givers change, is all. And KotFE has much more "story" content if measured by cut scene length, it's just visible on one play through instead of requiring two.
I thought Makeb still did very well on that front. I loved the interwoven story arcs where one side tries to keep the other in the dark and such.
Back then I already thought Makeb to be too short, but now I think it was actually a very nice compromise inbetween classic expansions and episodic ones.

JennyFlynn's Avatar


JennyFlynn
05.12.2016 , 05:03 PM | #13
It's tricky I think. Yes each chapter can be completed within an hour and then you have to wait a month for something new yet if you add it up, KotFE (once S1 finishes) will have offered about 16 hours (estimate for new/casual players who haven't done the content yet) of game play through chapters. Add in the time it takes for Alliance Alerts, if you choose to do them, and you'll near 20'ish hours of game play. Though people aren't thrilled with it, they did add in new PvP content too. KotFE did come with a level and gear increase and the Star Fortresses which again may not be the content you seek but it is content. And don't forget the EC. In all fairness all that's missing is a new Operation but when you add up everything else it's a pretty decent expansion package and it's about a years worth of 'new stuff'.

Now look at WoW. 60 bucks for the expansion which will last about 2 years before the new one comes out. It offers new PVP, new raids, a flexible questing system so you're not on a loop per say (Legion will allow you to choose where you wanna start and travel next rather than force you into zone A or B depending on your level), new zones, raised level cap etc. Throughout those 2 years though there's no new expansion, they do continue to update the content and add to it via patches (ie; adding new raids and end-game zones) so new things continue appearing into the game.

Both approaches have their appeal and I'd enjoy both. Heck I have and do enjoy both.

Now for me personally.. for RotHC/SoR vs. KotFE.. my first run through RotHC took me 2'ish hours. SoR including preludes & Ziost took about 4-5 hours on my first run through just taking it easy, figuring out what's what, where everything was etc. Total of 7'ish hours combined.. nowadays that's more like 4-5 for those 2 xpacs, story wise only. KotFE chapter 1-9 takes me about 2 hours on average and each following chapter about 45 mins/an hour at first though easily 20-30 mins once I'm used to it. I'd say once Chapter 16 has been released, it would take about 5 hours to go through all 16 chapters which ends up being the same value at RotHC and SoR combined. I actually feel like we're getting MORE out of KotFE than we did with those two, story wise.
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Knorlac's Avatar


Knorlac
05.13.2016 , 01:07 AM | #14
Quote: Originally Posted by JennyFlynn View Post
It's tricky I think. Yes each chapter can be completed within an hour and then you have to wait a month for something new yet if you add it up, KotFE (once S1 finishes) will have offered about 16 hours (estimate for new/casual players who haven't done the content yet) of game play through chapters. Add in the time it takes for Alliance Alerts, if you choose to do them, and you'll near 20'ish hours of game play. Though people aren't thrilled with it, they did add in new PvP content too. KotFE did come with a level and gear increase and the Star Fortresses which again may not be the content you seek but it is content. And don't forget the EC. In all fairness all that's missing is a new Operation but when you add up everything else it's a pretty decent expansion package and it's about a years worth of 'new stuff'.

Now look at WoW. 60 bucks for the expansion which will last about 2 years before the new one comes out. It offers new PVP, new raids, a flexible questing system so you're not on a loop per say (Legion will allow you to choose where you wanna start and travel next rather than force you into zone A or B depending on your level), new zones, raised level cap etc. Throughout those 2 years though there's no new expansion, they do continue to update the content and add to it via patches (ie; adding new raids and end-game zones) so new things continue appearing into the game.

Both approaches have their appeal and I'd enjoy both. Heck I have and do enjoy both.

Now for me personally.. for RotHC/SoR vs. KotFE.. my first run through RotHC took me 2'ish hours. SoR including preludes & Ziost took about 4-5 hours on my first run through just taking it easy, figuring out what's what, where everything was etc. Total of 7'ish hours combined.. nowadays that's more like 4-5 for those 2 xpacs, story wise only. KotFE chapter 1-9 takes me about 2 hours on average and each following chapter about 45 mins/an hour at first though easily 20-30 mins once I'm used to it. I'd say once Chapter 16 has been released, it would take about 5 hours to go through all 16 chapters which ends up being the same value at RotHC and SoR combined. I actually feel like we're getting MORE out of KotFE than we did with those two, story wise.
You might want to double your value for Makeb though as it has two destinct story arcs. Also 2 hours for a first play seems a bit short to me. Did you do the heroics, Toborro's Coutyard and what about the macrobinocular and seeker droid questlines?

Storm-Cutter's Avatar


Storm-Cutter
05.13.2016 , 03:18 AM | #15
And the original Makeb had quite tough mobs on every street corner, path and shortcut yelling "Engaging the Enemy!" at you and fighting you, which made every mesa take 5-10 times as long in travel times.

And there were 2 datacrons - and one was pretty challenging when you were on your own trying to figure out how to get to it.

The staged weekly was about 1 - 1.5 hours depending on the missions you chose. - and the gear was worth having if you didn't have BiS by that point.

Thing is that there is probably more per month time-wise than there was, but there was still a lot to keep you occupied outside the story. - now that a lot of people have completed a lot more of the game, there's not so much to fill the in-between time without repeating yourself over and over.
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squirrelballz's Avatar


squirrelballz
05.13.2016 , 04:30 AM | #16
I'm sorry Ian I can't show you the beef because I ate it.

I agree though I might not like everything about KOTFE but I've certainly enjoyed several chapters, the new warzones, star fortress,and to some extent I like the EC I just think the rewards are trash. When I look at all things considered I saw someone say that if they released new HM flashpoints and one OPS this would arguably be the best expansion since vanilla and I'd agree. KOTFE isn't perfect but if it's generating the money then I'd say the chapter release is safe bet going forward.
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Knorlac's Avatar


Knorlac
05.13.2016 , 05:07 AM | #17
Quote: Originally Posted by squirrelballz View Post
I'm sorry Ian I can't show you the beef because I ate it.

I agree though I might not like everything about KOTFE but I've certainly enjoyed several chapters, the new warzones, star fortress,and to some extent I like the EC I just think the rewards are trash. When I look at all things considered I saw someone say that if they released new HM flashpoints and one OPS this would arguably be the best expansion since vanilla and I'd agree. KOTFE isn't perfect but if it's generating the money then I'd say the chapter release is safe bet going forward.
I'd agree with one exeption, the unified story. If there only were two story arcs or at the very very least a few quests that are class specific...I'm so sick of being the outlander! I want to be a valiant Jedi again, an (in)famous bounty hunter or smuggler, a cunning agent, striking from the shadows, a loyal soldier of the republic or a slave turned sith lord...etc.

IanArgent's Avatar


IanArgent
05.13.2016 , 06:13 AM | #18
Quote: Originally Posted by Storm-Cutter View Post
And the original Makeb had quite tough mobs on every street corner, path and shortcut yelling "Engaging the Enemy!" at you and fighting you, which made every mesa take 5-10 times as long in travel times.

And there were 2 datacrons - and one was pretty challenging when you were on your own trying to figure out how to get to it.

The staged weekly was about 1 - 1.5 hours depending on the missions you chose. - and the gear was worth having if you didn't have BiS by that point.

Thing is that there is probably more per month time-wise than there was, but there was still a lot to keep you occupied outside the story. - now that a lot of people have completed a lot more of the game, there's not so much to fill the in-between time without repeating yourself over and over.
I ground the staged weeklies to get the gazebo when they announced the retirement of that mode. It had a little more variety than 6 different Star Fortresses. Once. The second time around, it was just inconvenient. Also, see below. I don't count gear stat rewards because they're always at risk of being obsoleted. Cosmetic rewards are good - and HSF/Heroics reward plenty of them. Plus they award mods and comm crystals.

Quote: Originally Posted by Knorlac View Post
You might want to double your value for Makeb though as it has two destinct story arcs. Also 2 hours for a first play seems a bit short to me. Did you do the heroics, Toborro's Coutyard and what about the macrobinocular and seeker droid questlines?
They didn't do new heroics, but by making the rewards for the old ones worthwhile to your level, it opened up the entire menu of them. I'm curious how many people regularly played heroics they'd overleveled prior to 4.0; and, at any rate, the old heroics are "new" content to start-at-60s

Torborro's courtyard is the Op, whose lack I mentioned. For everyone but the Ops community, there's TEC. Good point about the bonus questlines - while the HSF "storyline" checks that box, it's a good deal less varied that those two. OTOH, they appear to have been a failed experiment; one not repeated in SoR, and one that most people have difficulty finding the requisite groups to do.
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Knorlac's Avatar


Knorlac
05.13.2016 , 06:26 AM | #19
Quote: Originally Posted by IanArgent View Post
They didn't do new heroics, but by making the rewards for the old ones worthwhile to your level, it opened up the entire menu of them. I'm curious how many people regularly played heroics they'd overleveled prior to 4.0; and, at any rate, the old heroics are "new" content to start-at-60s
I did them on all of my chars while leveling them up, so quite a lot. Now I don't do them any more often than before, they're reduced to a pretty boring grind IMO.

4.0 is great for new players in general I think, not so much if racing to max level is not your thing, but there sure is a lot for them to do.

IanArgent's Avatar


IanArgent
05.13.2016 , 06:38 AM | #20
Quote: Originally Posted by Knorlac View Post
I did them on all of my chars while leveling them up, so quite a lot. Now I don't do them any more often than before, they're reduced to a pretty boring grind IMO.

4.0 is great for new players in general I think, not so much if racing to max level is not your thing, but there sure is a lot for them to do.
Everything gets reduced to a pretty boring grind. It took me a lot longer than it could have to max my Section X rep because I got to the point where I literally could not bring myself to do the weekly more than once a week, maybe twice, and I was already at Champ when that happened. I still haven't maxed my Voss, Yavin, or Oricon reps. At least with the heroic grind I don't have to do the same 4 missions over and over and ... - I can pick different heroics off the menu, and the heroics themselves are factionally different, and easier to get to and do.

The entire paradigm of the rep grind changed - we didn't get new content, but we got a lot more variety of content that can be used to grind "rep." And while the rep meters are per character instead of per legacy, the "tokens" are still per-legacy. It's like they moved from using a weekly rep cap to contribute to your rep to a character rep cap to contribute. Which reminds me, I still need to do that analysis of old-style rep vs alliance influence grind.
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Quote: Originally Posted by TUXs View Post
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