While it is true that some Legacy weapons are craved for their appearance and sounds, the change in no way prevents continuing to use them across characters. And let's be honest, the most common use of Legacy weapons was to mule items from character to character and bypass the Collections system completely. Made sense for very expensive items like Tunings that were not collectable, but it never really made sense in terms of crystals.

....

I highly doubt the most common use of Legacy weapons was to bypass the collections system, but even if it was the intended use is shared stat-ed gear among alts. This "fix" does prevent the most common abuse, but it penalizes those of us who use legacy weapons as intended by adding cost and inconvenience or preventing the use cartel market crystals and any tunings.

It's loopholes like this existing for 2 years and 11 months that has allowed Darth Cynic's powers to flourish over the Sith Sphere of Social Media.

Even now I'm feeling more convinced the entire QA department really is one overworked intern.

If you were able to claim a duplicate tuning item on one character and then put that item into a weapon to transfer it another while bypassing the need to unlock it for the account; then that was certainly not the intent.

That is not a feature that is an exploit of the system. I dislike the whole paying to unlock for legacy in general, but that is the system in place and fixing the loop hole is not really a cash grab it's just fixing an exploit

anyone saying its a "loophole" or exploit

http://www.swtor.com/community/showpost.php?p=6346255&postcount=381

what are you saying now? i call this blatant cash grab.

anyone saying its a "loophole" or exploit

http://www.swtor.com/community/showpost.php?p=6346255&postcount=381

what are you saying now? i call this blatant cash grab.

Well done to grab this post. I wouldn't call what Bioware are doing a cash grab, but it is an imposition of inconvenience on the player.

Well done to grab this post. I wouldn't call what Bioware are doing a cash grab, but it is an imposition of inconvenience on the player.

well, they *did* do it to make people buy the unlocks. which means cartel coins. which means money. mostly.

First - This is a BAD idea and the fact we had zero communication until patch notes just shows communication is not as forth coming as it should be. They knew this was going to be a very BIG complaint from the consumer. Much like zero response in any of the class balancing threads for weeks.

Second - Temp workaround until BW fixes it in 6 months (Which we have been told is not an exploit): Grab all the "Legacy" Main/Off hands you have today. Insert and Silver quality and above CM crystals you have that you LOVE on your characters. The lower end ones are very cheap to account unlock with CC's. Mail/Legacy bank the weapons to each character today (Before reset). On ALT PULL out (add to collection on that toon) and rinse/repeat for next character. Go to third line. NOTE: $7k cost per crystal remove - so if you have 10 crystals and 10 toons you will burn $700k

Third - As it was mentioned already it's worth a repeat since I never agree with Andryah. Going forward you just stock pile like 10+ generic crystals on your most used toons. Like Andryah mentioned you just overwrite your CM crystal with lower one. (No cost to remove). Mail/Legacy bank over. Have extra crystals pulled from other character (Since you added to character collections above). Again overwrite the crystal with a CM collection one now on top of the cheap one. BOOM you have favorite.

Now I'm not sure about TUNING as I don't think we have any lower options to insert on top and nobody wants to pull out unless they are FREE to remove. (Unlikely, but if it's the case then repeat step 2 & 3 for them).

Well done to grab this post. I wouldn't call what Bioware are doing a cash grab, but it is an imposition of inconvenience on the player.

The real cash grab is still the cartel packs. This is nothing compared to the overpriced gamble packs that are offered as a surrogate for real content in the game.

These unlocks are peanuts by comparison.

Or be a rational consumer and stand against the change because you do not agree with it.

Hehe.. I was wondering when someone would go full Don Quixote on this.

I've played MMOs for many years and I have yet to see an MMO that did not change something that did not upset players. It's the nature of the beast we call MMOs.

Sure.. you can protest all you like, but clearly it's going live and it's not an unreasonable closing of a loophole. Does it create a bit more inconvenience for players that have been using Legacy weapons heavily to move weapons across their characters? Perhaps..... like for those that have 10 gunslingers and use it to easily bypass lockouts (which is not intended by the studio I'm sure). But so what? The work arounds are clear to any thoughtful player, and it's not a huge issue to adapt to this, unless you simply refuse to "because".

At the end of the day... you either adapt to the change or you don't. The change is not negotiable with the studio, much as you would like it to be. So.. that leaves you with either a protest unsubbing, or not using Legacy weapons anymore, or adapt and overcome the effects of the change.

Some posters here get it and can actually see why they did this. Some want to dig in their heels, pretend there was never any loopholing with Legacy weapons, and play victim. Each is entitled to make their own choice in the face of change, any change. But what none of us is empowered to do is to force the studio to walk back the change.

Personally, I would suggest you consider saving Don Quixote roll playing for something much more significant and important.

The real cash grab is still the cartel packs. This is nothing compared to the overpriced gamble packs that are offered as a surrogate for real content in the game.

 

These unlocks are peanuts by comparison.

for a crystal collector who's making collection of all crystals in the game, it is a massive cash grab. (like me)

The real cash grab is still the cartel packs. This is nothing compared to the overpriced gamble packs that are offered as a surrogate for real content in the game.

 

These unlocks are peanuts by comparison.

^^ I agree.

And even in the case of cartel packs.. since they, and their contents are freely tradable between players, you can literally avoid playing the cartel market pack opening RNG wars completely. Credits and the free trade of CM items gives players averse to cartel packs all the access they could every want or need.

Not that the "cash grab" meme has any real weight on something like this. Why? They cannot grab your cash, you must willingly give it to them.

for a crystal collector who's making collection of all crystals in the game, it is a massive cash grab. (like me)

Play smarter. You need not spend any real life cash to get every CM crystal in this game. If you choose to go that route, that is on you. So again.. they cannot grab your cash, you must decide to willingly hand it over to them. And even then.. it ignores the fact that about 30% of all CCs in circulation were never actually purchases with real money. All you have to do is use your subscriber CCs wisely, and if you cannot.. then you can peddle your referral link like some players do to pay for all their CM needs and wants.

Play smarter. You do not need to rip out the crystal. Just slap any non CM crystal in over top of it (a low level one that costs virtually nothing to insert) and then move the weapon.

 

For players using Tunings (which have been a minority of players until they were collectable) .. which have always been expensive to acquire, it looks like you would have to remove it, and since you could buy them to begin with.. clearly the cost to pull one is not a hurdle. Don't want to take that extra step.. then don't put Tunings in Legacy weapons. Yes.. it's now a trade-off.. but you the player are in complete control of making your choice in the trade-offs.

that is not how legacy weapons were intended to work.

Hehe.. I was wondering when someone would go full Don Quixote on this.

 

I've played MMOs for many years and I have yet to see an MMO that did not change something that did not upset players. It's the nature of the beast we call MMOs.

 

Sure.. you can protest all you like, but clearly it's going live and it's not an unreasonable closing of a loophole. Does it create a bit more inconvenience for players that have been using Legacy weapons heavily to move weapons across their characters? Perhaps..... like for those that have 10 gunslingers and use it to easily bypass lockouts (which is not intended by the studio I'm sure). But so what? The work arounds are clear to any thoughtful player, and it's not a huge issue to adapt to this, unless you simply refuse to "because".

 

At the end of the day... you either adapt to the change or you don't. The change is not negotiable with the studio, much as you would like it to be. So.. that leaves you with either a protest unsubbing, or not using Legacy weapons anymore, or adapt and overcome the effects of the change.

 

Some posters here get it and can actually see why they did this. Some want to dig in their heels, pretend there was never any loopholing with Legacy weapons, and play victim. Each is entitled to make their own choice in the face of change, any change. But what none of us is empowered to do is to force the studio to walk back the change.

 

Personally, I would suggest you consider saving Don Quixote roll playing for something much more significant and important.

thing is, they didnt even announce that they're gonna fix it, it just popped. some people woulda spend the CC they had on the crystals instead of other stuff, but of course, like this, they will have to buy more CC. which is likely why they didnt say a word.

not to mention eric himself said its not an exploit

Dont get me wrong. i am adapting. ill stop using CM crystals completely. but that does not mean i cannot protest.

I never moved a legacy weapon with a crystal but as I have heard as of now you can move the crystal through legacy and to another character and you can bound that crystal to that other character as well to unlock through collections for that character correct? that make sense that they do this. but I suggest these ideas, would be better alternative, for people who just use CM crystal for gear

1. so my solution is this your able to move the crystal through legacy weapons still but on other characters that do not have the crystal unlock cannot take the crystal out of the weapon and it will not show that color of the crystal it would show the default of that lightsaber, just the stats will be useable.

2. those that have that particular crystal unlock though the entire account can transfer the crystal in the legacy weapons to any character.

3. remove the cost of crystal removable.

1. It was confirmed to be working as intended (not an exploit.)

2. It worked this way for FIVE years and is only change now as an obvious cash grab. This is the biggest issue - change something that players enjoy and take advantage of for YEARS and in order for them to continue enjoying legacy-wide crystals, they now have to pay very expensive fees. This is not cool on BW's part.

Worst patch change in since galactic command. DELET DIS EAWARE

that is not how legacy weapons were intended to work.

Like all things in an MMO.. how things work is controlled and defined by the studio, not the players.

Players of course, being clever, will find every conceivable way to use something beyond the intentions of the studio, and the studio is free to close loopholes too.

Back when Legacy weapons were released into the game, there were no weapon tunings at all.. so I can see them adjusting legacy weapons after the fact to account for it. They wisely waited until they made Tunings collectable.

As for crystals.. again.. crystals are so easily available and many are very low cost to unlock in collections that there is simply no real merit to objecting over the change with how CM crystals are handled in legacy weapons beginning tomorrow.

1. It was confirmed to be working as intended (not an exploit.)

2. It worked this way for FIVE years and is only change now as an obvious cash grab. This is the biggest issue - change something that players enjoy and take advantage of for YEARS and in order for them to continue enjoying legacy-wide crystals, they now have to pay very expensive fees. This is not cool on BW's part.

 

Worst patch change in since galactic command. DELET DIS EAWARE

i dont think they're gonna delete it unfortunately. apparently we are supposed to delete all our alts or stop paying them money, either of the 2. galactic command was good start in that direction /sarcasm heck the player numbers, because "RNG is EXCITING!!!!"

i dont think they're gonna delete it unfortunately. apparently we are supposed to delete all our alts or stop paying them money, either of the 2. galactic command was good start in that direction heck the player numbers, because "RNG is EXCITING!!!!"

I am playing daily and I have only one character that's relatively viable for ranked pvp because of how gearing works now. -_-

The real cash grab is still the cartel packs. This is nothing compared to the overpriced gamble packs that are offered as a surrogate for real content in the game.

 

These unlocks are peanuts by comparison.

Of course we don't have financial data, but I get the feeling that the cartel market is what's keeping the game profitable and thus alive. I accept this way of operation so that we can keep playing, enjoying stories, strongholds, etc. Money for the game has to come from somewhere. Personally I see it as far preferable to make money via cosmetic items than a "pay to win" situation. I just doubt that this imposition of inconvenience on players re legacy weapons is going to end up helping Bioware overall.

As for crystals.. again.. crystals are so easily available and many are very low cost to unlock in collections that there is simply no real merit to objecting over the change with how CM crystals are handled in legacy weapons beginning tomorrow.

I agree - but this has some significant fallout. Maybe some clarity will happen today, but I doubt it. Why do they keep trying to sink this game?

Biggest issue: Even if I have an account wide unlock of my favorite White CM crystal... I still can't mail or legacy bank my weapon with CM crystal to my other character that have the same crystal unlocked. They went overboard on this one and will likely have to course correct again (Taking 6+ months of course).

Second Biggest issue: Again bad news and communication seem very "hands off" by both Musco and Keith. If Eric is the "Litmus" test for Players then why didn't he see this? Both of them didn't touch the Class Balance threads until it was well into the final week. Sure things might not change, but two way communications they are trying to have seem to have stalled. Good will flushed down toilet. Takes 10+ Great Job to wipe out one "Ah Crap" and we just had TWO of them happen. (CM Legacy Gate and Class Feedback)

Do you seriously think that people with ~20 characters are jumping on all toons to unlock stuff? unlocking things by using legacy gear is a margin. imo all this collection unlock is bs. That should be totally free for us.

I agree. Just because people are used to the ridiculous idea that you have to pay for gear twice to use it on all your characters, doesn't make it right.

There should be no legacy unlock cost for anything. You already paid for the item once, paying twice to play it on the same game? No. Not okay. Just because they are making it "match" with other items (crystals and tunings) doesn't mean it was right. Instead, all items unlocked should be accessible by all players. How about you make that change.

http://www.swtor.com/community/showpost.php?p=6346255&postcount=381

There's a difference between "not an exploit" and "we want it to work that way."

Doesn't mean I think this change is a good idea, mind.