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Toys - we already paid for them. Bought them as they were. We should not pay twice!


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This is not cool. I am not buying anymore of the lies of the kind "We're not going to change the way items are because players are used to them and like them. They might not be happy with the change." Sorry but those items, the toys, were like this 6-7 months. We were free to send them over to alts and enjoy them while leveling or just playing with other characters. Nobody cared. Everyone was happy. Nobody asked for a change. Why do I need to pay for an item which I already paid for (cartel packs) after MONTHS of having it? Why?

 

You're saying that you are not going to change things as they were and players are used to them that way. And suddenly you're pulling out ninja-change nobody suspected.

 

This is just LOW.

 

We already paid hard $ for the toys we had. We should not pay twice enjoy them the way we used to in the past 7 months!

 

This is a quote from Eric Musco regarding an armor set which perfectly applies to this situation and Bioware is not being honest with us:

Hey everyone,

 

What is really interesting is that you folks are having a very similar conversation/debate to what happened internally when making this decision. There are two sides of the coin we had to look at. 1) Be sensitive to those who like the current look of the armor and to not take away what they enjoy. 2) That the current appearance contains a bug (which we of course would not want to leave in place) and isn't entirely canonical.

 

As indicated in my last post, we decided to err on the side of caution and to not change the appearance in the event that some players liked it. However, after continuing to read this thread it is clear that players in general care the most about the armor appearing canonical and not have an appearance bug in place. I do realize the forums are just one component of our entire community but I am inclined to believe a lot of players, even those outside the forums, would like to see the armor be more canonical.

 

After passing that information on to the team we have decided that we will be changing Revan's armor, and more than just the double hood! I will have more specifics later on, but aside from just fixing the double hood, you will see some color adjustments, etc. in the armor overall. Our current target for these changes will be Game Update 2.2.

 

I want to reiterate that when these changes take place, we will not be releasing a classic version of Revan's armor - the new appearance will be the only appearance available.

 

Thanks everyone!

 

-eric

Edited by Alec_Fortescue
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You're saying that you are not going to change things as they were and players are used to them that way. And suddenly you're pulling out ninja-change nobody suspected.

I suspected this would happen. If they didn't change these, than any new toys would be unfairly worse.

 

I continue to see your anger on these vanity issues and it really baffles me. Seriously, you're blowing this way too out of proportion when you can send your alt the same toy that costs probably 50k credits for something they will have permanently in the game.

 

Are you seriously creating 12 alts on a server and leveling them up all the time and need to have all your toys flying around you? I somehow doubt that. If it's really true, then pony up the credz, but, as stated before, it wouldn't be fair for someone to get a toy post 2.1 that's stuck to one character while someone else can transfer their toy, freely.

Edited by Lostpenguins
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lolz expecting me to purchase cartel coins with real money when I have a subscription to get a shi*ty race which I couldn't care less about anyways. 2.1 doesn't exist for me as I don't care about any of the content and BW/EA thinks I'm going to pay additional real money to use it.

 

I'm already on the fence about giving up on SWTOR though, so if 2.2 or 2.3 also expects me to pay again for any additional content on top of my sub I'll probably just not pay for it or my sub etiher.

 

2.1 is a non issue for me content wise, but if this is a shift to where subscribers get nothing except a couple more action bars and getting to infinite wz's instead of the weekly cap then subscriptions don't really return much for the 15 dollar investment

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You might not care but plenty of others who, like me, bought those items as they were do care. We spent real money and they got ninja-changed suddenly and now we are forced to pay if we want to use them the way we used them.

 

This is a legitimate concern.

 

The whole "I subscribe so I deserve to pay for nothing else in the game" is not.

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FOr me. I can see the anger and the people that like/indifferent about the change.

 

Before 2.1 came out I was hoping that the toys would somehow be included in the Collections tab. However I was unsure how exactly they would do it.

 

I was thinking there may be some way to choose to bind it to you and then it is in collections. But this would probably be annoying from a usability issue.

 

So It is annoying that it is now bound. BUt on the other hand, once you pay(yeah, sucks but we did have warning) you now have this item on all of your characters.

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I don't understand what the rage is about here. You want it on more than one toon shouldn't you have to pay for it? If I buy a TV for my living room I don't magically get a duplicate for the bedroom unless I buy one. The fact that we only have to buy twice to get it infinate number of times is awesome. Stop the qq

/rant

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You might not care but plenty of others who, like me, bought those items as they were do care. We spent real money and they got ninja-changed suddenly and now we are forced to pay if we want to use them the way we used them.

You spent real money i.e. you bought cartel coins?

 

1 - Items in game are always subject to change. Even if you pay using cash, it's still a virtual item that I'm pretty sure the EULA acknowledges that it's their property (which is why they have a right to ban you from selling anything for RL cash). So the fact that you spent RL cash on it doesn't give your complaint more weight.

 

2 - The fact that you can buy another toy for super-cheap prices means that you're still blowing this way out of proportion.

 

3 - It's still a vanity item.

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You don't use them toys? Why do you bother posting here. Now I am being charged real money to send them over to my character, despite already paying for them for what they were like. I play PvE with two different characters and I like sending them between my characters I am actively playing with.

 

It's a vanity item but i already bought it as it was. It's not cheap when I need to pay several times because I have few of them already paid for over the last few months. Keep in mind that salaries do vary between countries. Drastically. The cost of unlocking THERAPY PROBE is worth 3 hours of work on the average salary in Poland.

 

Paid hairstyles? Fine. Paid re-customization. Okay. Paid dyes? Okay, i'll go gtn. But why do I have to pay for USING items the way i used them over the last 7 months.

Edited by Alec_Fortescue
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You don't use them toys? Why do you bother posting here. Now I am being charged real money to send them over to my character, despite already paying for them for what they were like. I play PvE with two different characters and I like sending them between my characters I am actively playing with.

1 - I have a few vanity items from the CM like a couple of pets, a mount, the RC spaceship toy to med with, things like that. So clearly you're assumption is wrong. The fact is, though, that I didn't spend a single CC coin on those accept for the Carbonite Chamber when I bought it the first day the CM came out and I used my CC's they had given me for time spent subscribed thus far.

 

2 - You aren't being charged RL money. Go buy a copy of it off the GTN. Stop tunnel-visioning your problem to make it seem more drastic than it actually is.

 

3 - The fact that you play 2 main characters means the cost for those toys should be minimal in terms of credits spent to duplicate.

 

While I understanding that a certain level of irkness with the fact that they changed some items on you in game, the fact that you refuse to take a step back and see how little this really impacts you is just mind boggling. It's vanity stuff. You can probably resolve the issue by spending a small amount of credits. And you seem to overlook the fact that I clearly said it would unfair if new users had theirs bind on use, but you didn't.

 

I see you updated your post after I had responded, but I think I still directly answered these in my above statements:

It's a vanity item but i already bought it as it was. It's not cheap when I need to pay several times because I have few of them already paid for over the last few months. Keep in mind that salaries do vary between countries. Drastically. The cost of unlocking THERAPY PROBE is worth 3 hours of work on the average salary in Poland.

 

Paid hairstyles? Fine. Paid re-customization. Okay. Paid dyes? Okay, i'll go gtn. But why do I have to pay for USING items the way i used them over the last 7 months.

1 - Once again, you can buy them off the GTN, as you admitted so stop equating that you always have to spend RL cash.

2 - Once again, understand that anything in the game is subject to change. Luckily, it's only vanity items that got changed here. Changing gameplay-based items (such as stats on an item or how it functions in combat) would be a far bigger problem.

Edited by Lostpenguins
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I suspected this would happen. If they didn't change these, than any new toys would be unfairly worse.

 

I continue to see your anger on these vanity issues and it really baffles me. Seriously, you're blowing this way too out of proportion when you can send your alt the same toy that costs probably 50k credits for something they will have permanently in the game.

 

Are you seriously creating 12 alts on a server and leveling them up all the time and need to have all your toys flying around you? I somehow doubt that. If it's really true, then pony up the credz, but, as stated before, it wouldn't be fair for someone to get a toy post 2.1 that's stuck to one character while someone else can transfer their toy, freely.

 

Those aren't the Toys he's talking about.

 

The Revan, Satele and Malgus statues are all categorized as Toys.

The Life Day Orb and Carbonite Chamber are also labeled Toys.

 

:cool:

Edited by Blackavaar
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LOL!

 

music probe (rng boxes) 600 for unlock

chamber 360 for unlock

kolto tank (rng boxes ) can't check it now

revan (rng boxes) 240 for unlock

rancor 90

holo-tree 300

life orb 30

ball toss 60 :eek:

red/gold eyes 60 :eek:

malgus 240

holo shrub 240

holoprojector 60

 

rifles 240

emotes 60

Edited by Glower
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Those aren't the Toys he's talking about.

 

The Revan, Satele and Malgus statues are all categorized as Toys.

 

:cool:

Still super-cheap. If you bought the Expansion everyone of your characters now has a statue trainer for free. It may not be the Malgus statue, but, what, were you dropping it on cooldown? Also, you can still buy these off the GTN for a low cost. He has 2 characters, that means he only has to buy them once additionally off the GTN.

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Still super-cheap. If you bought the Expansion everyone of your characters now has a statue trainer for free. It may not be the Malgus statue, but, what, were you dropping it on cooldown? Also, you can still buy these off the GTN for a low cost. He has 2 characters, that means he only has to buy them once additionally off the GTN.

 

150-400k credits is not cheap to many players, though it may be a pittance to you.

And many of us have more than one alt. I myself have 16 characters on Harbinger server alone.

 

:rolleyes:

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I think part of the issue being raised is that they just finished telling us they weren't going to change the look of some items because they didn't want to make a change to existing items that might anger some players who like them that way.

 

Then they changed some items and angered some players anyway.

 

Which seems like a contradiction but only if you accept the first as a legitimate reason for them not changing the previously discussed items and not as an excuse for them being lazy.

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150-400k credits is not cheap to many players, though it may be a pittance to you.

And many of us have more than one alt. I myself have 16 characters on Harbinger server alone.

 

:rolleyes:

For what, the trainer? Are all of your characters in need of leveling? Did you not preorder? So, it's not so much that it's a toy. It's the incovenience of not being able to train, on the fly, wherever you are. I get that. That's your issue. And as I said, I can understand why a user would be a little irked. But Alec is making it sound way worse than it actually is.

 

I think part of the issue being raised is that they just finished telling us they weren't going to change the look of some items because they didn't want to make a change to existing items that might anger some players who like them that way.

 

Then they changed some items and angered some players anyway.

 

Which seems like a contradiction but only if you accept the first as a legitimate reason for them not changing the previously discussed items and not as an excuse for them being lazy.

Look of an item is very different of functionality of an item. Once again, this goes back to fairness. It isn't fair to punish new purchasers of toys.

Edited by Lostpenguins
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I just have spare few million credits to buy myself few gold-quality toys from gtn.

What "toys" did you readily use between your two toons?

 

And, still, this goes back to perspective. You need to gain some because you're making this a bigger deal than it really is. Sorry if you believed they wouldn't change your old toys, but that doesn't mean "everyone" as you originally posted.

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Look of an item is very different of functionality of an item. Once again, this goes back to fairness. It isn't fair to punish new purchasers of toys.

 

I'm not on either side of this debate. Don't really care that they made this change. I was just trying to illustrate in part why some people feel that this was a sudden and unexpected change specifically based on the comments regarding changing the look of items and the desire to not upset some players.

 

But since you quoted and replied to me I'll comment on your remarks. Not changing the items wouldn't be punishing the new purchasers but changing the items is definitely punishing those that have already purchased them. Simply apply the change to future toys that haven't been brought into the game and leave the existing toys as a separate category. That way anyone buying them knows prior to acquiring them what the limitations are.

 

I mean, if you're interested in fairness at all you have to accept that this would be a better solution.

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Next step, they'll make all legacy pers apply only to first character logged in after patch, and then allow you to buy them again on all characters of pay cheap cheap price of 1k CC per perk to unlock it premanently on all chars.
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Not changing the items wouldn't be punishing the new purchasers but changing the items is definitely punishing those that have already purchased them. Simply apply the change to future toys that haven't been brought into the game and leave the existing toys as a separate category. That way anyone buying them knows prior to acquiring them what the limitations are.

Fair enough. I'll take it back. "Punish" is the wrong word. But, still unfair. I could see them doing what you suggested and that would be fine as well, but I have a feeling it's a little bit harder to add in more coding or to go back and database tag all those with a new field. Much easier to globally change all toys. I really believe that the amount of work to make that change > a few people upset because they have a lack of perspective on the matter.

 

Yeah, this whole patch irks me. I would really like fir basic barbershop features (tatoos, earrings, hair, etc.) to cost in-game credz. I would like for them to make dyes not a lottery. I would like for them to have made 2 slots for dyes: primary and secondary so you wouldn't need to create all of these extra dyes with primary and secondary colors that's exponentially more in scope. Yeah I would like if those dyes were crafter only for the rare ones (like white or black) and the more common ones to be purchased via a vendor.

 

But I generally feel that people are getting way too upset about this patch. I really think that things will calm down in a month. Keep calm and carry on.

Edited by Lostpenguins
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