Daniel Erickson, Lead Game Designer for Star Wars: The Old Republic, in an interview:

Mallorik: What is your philosophy on cross server LFG tools? Are we getting a same server tool just to hold us over while you work on cross server tech or is this just a test to see if a same server tool will do the job?

 

Daniel: Although we’re certainly willing to entertain the idea of cross-server LFG tools if the need arises, it’s a last resort for us.

How can a multi-million Star Wars online multiplayer game have a lead designer that is this clueless about running a successful MMO service?

Here's a clue, Daniel: I am not looking for some 'last resorts' in your service product. I want the convenience to play with millions of strangers, anonymously over the Internet, with the convenience of pressing a button and the magic happening.

A LFG tool is just that, a tool. It has to work 24/7. It has to work irrespective of US primetime, EU primetime, AUS primetime, Japan primetime, India primetime, Arab-Emirates primetime. It has to work for people working night-shifts, day-shifts, double-shifts, 1 job, 2 jobs, 3 jobs, not working at all or taking care of their baby.

A LFG tool works the better the bigger the population it can draw from. This is something that's obvious to everyone. Making it cross-server as a last resort is too late. This too should be obvious, at least to a Lead Game Designer.

World of Warcraft, a game you might think was at its best during Vanilla/TBC, put in theirs right after their subscription numbers had started to drop. Their subscriptions have since stabilized. Maybe that's a coincidence, or maybe they know a thing or two about running an MMO service and challenging your preconceptions.

Edit:

What really gets under my skin is the hubris. Does this Lead Game Designer never entertain the thought that maybe he could be wrong? Would he say the same thing if he thought there was a chance he had gotten it completely wrong?

If in 2 months, despite everything, X-Server LFG is added and someone wants to make the case that the game is on its last legs, well there's your money-quote, straight from the horse's mouth!

On the other hand, if in 2 months I'm on the outside looking in and see that patch 1.5 is going to add X-Server LFG, is that going to entice me to come back knowing that the Lead Game Designer is going for the game's last resort?

And look what happened to the people playing World Of Warcraft when the LFG cross server was implemented. Instead of actual decent players, they became wordless, mindless idiots who cared for nothing but themselves. People who would need on loot they didnt actually need just to sell, or leave a group if a boss they fought didnt drop the loot they wanted, even when it was only the first boss. Why should they care about other people? It is not like they would ever see them again, and even if they did, they can just leave the group and LFG using the tool again.

Yes THAT is what you are promoting, the lack of moral fortitude, or willingness to be patient. So I vow here and now, the day cross server LFG is added, I am GONE!!!!!

And look what happened to the people playing World Of Warcraft when the LFG cross server was implemented. Instead of actual decent players, they became wordless, mindless idiots who cared for nothing but themselves. People who would need on loot they didnt actually need just to sell, or leave a group if a boss they fought didnt drop the loot they wanted, even when it was only the first boss. Why should they care about other people? It is not like they would ever see them again, and even if they did, they can just leave the group and LFG using the tool again.

 

Yes THAT is what you are promoting, the lack of moral fortitude, or willingness to be patient. So I vow here and now, the day cross server LFG is added, I am GONE!!!!!

Yeah, because people acting like jerks NEVER happens in our trusted communities that we have established on our servers. No sir, every single person is of a strong moral fibre, no jerks here! Every single server is filled with countless of people that no only are happy to group up for anything at any time, but each and every one of these fine upstanding individuals acts in a selfless manner, and only selects 'need' when s/he actually needs said item in question!

For this reason, I refuse to see a cross server implemented! For it shall destroy the community we have all worked hard to establish by bringing in anonymous strangers from those... other servers we dare not mention in these parts.

Why don't they give you two options. LFG (same server only) and LFG (Xserver). Why they have to settle for one or the other is beyond me. More options>less options

Because then no one would use the local one. I don't necessarily agree with the devs on this one, but if they are dead set on creating some sort of server community than they can't give cross server options. I would be more in line with this philosophy if we were to condense servers dramatically so that servers actually could support such a community.

Actually, there is a BIG difference. If you act like a jerk on the same server, you are accountable. People hear about a certain individual on a server who ninja's loot, or leaves a group that has only killed the first boss because it didnt drop the loot he wanted, people will hear about it and not want to join a group with that person ever again.

When it is cross server, there is no accountability. They can ninja loot, leave a group mid battle and not be held accountable because its likely they will never be seen again. But hey, if you want to delude yourself that this is the best thing for an mmo, then so be it. I will not stop you from thinking it is a good idea. All I can do is voice my own opinion, because I have had these experiences myself, and have left countless games when this cross realm server was implemented.

If you group with jerks like this, or are one, then I really feel sorry for you.

I am sorry friend but I disagree with you.

Wow's cross server LFG pulls from your battle cluster. If there's 15 servers in your cluster with an average pop of 1000 players, that gives you 15000 players from which to make a group.

If Bioware can make a server that houses 15000 players by itself, what is the difference?

There is none except server communities will stay intact.

Bioware's soon-to-be system is better.

Actually, there is a BIG difference. If you act like a jerk on the same server, you are accountable. People hear about a certain individual on a server who ninja's loot, or leaves a group that has only killed the first boss because it didnt drop the loot he wanted, people will hear about it and not want to join a group with that person ever again.

 

When it is cross server, there is no accountability. They can ninja loot, leave a group mid battle and not be held accountable because its likely they will never be seen again. But hey, if you want to delude yourself that this is the best thing for an mmo, then so be it. I will not stop you from thinking it is a good idea. All I can do is voice my own opinion, because I have had these experiences myself, and have left countless games when this cross realm server was implemented.

 

If you group with jerks like this, or are one, then I really feel sorry for you.

And, as was the point of my previous comment, the same thing already happens anyway. Can xserver bring in jerks? Sure it can, just like any other form of pugging, but pretending that it will increase the chance of getting a jerk for a partner to exponential levels to the point of it becoming a useless feature is ridiculous. In my limited experience with WoW, I rarely ran into any jerks. Heck, once I grouped with people all from different servers, and we managed to chat and have a grand time. I'd like to think that people act well with other because they are genuinely nice, not because they know they can't get away with acting like ****s.

That, and the game is borderline dead, so I will gladly take an optional tool that will make it easier for me to enjoy game content over never seeing said content.

Because then no one would use the local one. I don't necessarily agree with the devs on this one, but if they are dead set on creating some sort of server community than they can't give cross server options. I would be more in line with this philosophy if we were to condense servers dramatically so that servers actually could support such a community.

If nobody would use the local one, then why is bioware making it same server only? Doesn't make a lick of sense to me. Why are MMO developers always forcing players to play like they want them to play and not allowing players to play the way they want to play. Then they scratch thier heads and wonder why the subs keep falling.

I remember in BC I established myself as one of the best damn pug pally tank in the server (Amoro, Zuiljin Server) to group with. I'd join groups and everyone would be excited to see me and knew with a 100% certainty that I'd complete that run fast and smooth. To tell the truth that made me really proud making friends none stop who would love to group again.

But all that changed with cross server LFG.

At first I thought it be great I mean instead of making a name for myself on 1 server I can do the same on multiple and I can get groups as fast as I can click the button. Then, first couple of runs no one talked or interacted with each other...your basically just a place holder there to do a job then get out. But, that's not even the worst you got holy paladins rolling need on tank gear people quick to /gquit on 1 wipe, or if not done a certain way said person would flip out.

You see mister/miss OP when there is no accountability for your actions in the community it will bring out the worst of people. You character you created just becomes a placeholder someone that is forgotten when used up. The day I started playing wow as a pally I wanted to be the best tank and known for it by all in my community and once I had that feeling during BC I joined groups just for the fun of grouping and meeting new people even if I didn't need any gear pieces, then when cross server LFG came having it all taken away by cross server LFG destroyed most reason for me to play group in WoW instead of grouping for fun and getting to know my community I grouped and got my gear as soon as possible and tried to use LFG as little as possible, because who wants to group with mute nerd raging jerkish players.

One of many reasons i have stopped playing. Cross server LFG is just not worth it it kills the soul of any MMO it is introduced to, please BW don't do this.

Once upon a time there was a PuG of 3 folks and a sorc with about 6 levels higher than the FP they were running.

Having run through the Halls of Doom, our brave heroes, feeling heroic and all, slay the first Boss... at which point the sorc rolls need on "gear for companion, because I am, what? Like 30% of your firepower?"

You can see the moral fiber right there, on a eye-to-eye basis, with the opportunity to boot his sorry *** and get a more polite player.

Multiply by 5000 and add 500.000 ... no thanks... at least I can name and shame the jerk in this current setup, so everybody can boot him and he`s stuck at manual LFG in general.

it is pretty much been proven from experiences in other mmos that cross server groups bring out the worst in people, likely due to lack of accountability and not really knowing these people.. like huge pug groups.. on same servers you can atleast warn your friends not to play with some guy casue hes horible etc... cross servers you kinda cant.

i think preserving the servers in a lfg tool is the best way to go about it for now, in the future who knows, but one thing that is sure, people who abused the cross server lfg tools to be complete jerks have ruined the average players view of cross servers, and this time bioware seems to be following what the majority wants

.... [snip] but one thing that is sure, people who abused the cross server lfg tools to be complete jerks have ruined the average players view of cross servers..... [snip]

They didn`t ruin anything. You either do, or you don`t. They held back, only for fear of reprisal, or consequences.

It is rare to see any morals. in an environment that cannot tax you.

So, no, they didn`t ruin anything. It is what it is : very few consequences for being a douche... and you`d be surprised how many douches there are out there.

This is such good news.

Nothing like reading a post from someone who has only played WoW.

They didn`t ruin anything. You either do, or you don`t. They held back, only for fear of reprisal, or consequences.

 

It is rare to see any morals. in an environment that cannot tax you.

 

So, no, they didn`t ruin anything. It is what it is : very few consequences for being a douche... and you`d be surprised how many douches there are out there.

So true.

They didn`t ruin anything. You either do, or you don`t. They held back, only for fear of reprisal, or consequences.

 

It is rare to see any morals. in an environment that cannot tax you.

 

So, no, they didn`t ruin anything. It is what it is : very few consequences for being a douche... and you`d be surprised how many douches there are out there.

ya my point exactly.. they ruined the average players view of cross servers because if allowed the average person will be a douche.. and abuse and be rude.. etc...that still sours alot of peoples views..

most people, even if they are being a douche dont actually think they are being a douche at all, they make up some excuse as to why their behaviour is ok, or justified... ie.. they did it to me when i was leveling blah blah..

then as soon as it happens to them again they freak out... therefore ruining their view of cross servers and ruining that system..

players every player... has the ability to be a douche and many will take that opportunity if given thechance, they will justify it, or just ignore the insults and complaining. but i have seen perfectly awesome and nice people become asses when cross server playing..

i still fail to see how our points werent the same:P

I didn't mind WoWs same server tool. Like others I met many friends, and even recruited people to my guild after playing with them. Cross server, it is very convienient to get a group asap, but generally I think the cons weigh out the pros. The runs always felt a bit lifeless (yeah yeah kinda like the game is now).

I still think an option for both is best with a priiority grouping for same server. What I mean by this is an option whether you want to search cross server or not. Those who don't will search purely for people on the server. Whereas those searching cross server, the game will look everywhere. But if a tank is needed and several tanks are searching, the tool will prioritise tanks on your server to group first. If none available it'll go down the list to other servers.

In general I think giving the option will yield the best of both worlds, while giving a chance for community to build when the tool chooses those on your server when they're available.

How can a multi-million Star Wars online multiplayer game have a lead designer that is this clueless about running a successful MMO service?

Somewhere there is a thread where someone polled whether players wanted cross-server LFG. The result was about a 4:1 ratio against it. So if listening to the majority of your playerbase is viewed as "clueless", then this may not be the game for you.

This is such good news.

 

Nothing like reading a post from someone who has only played WoW.

But at least he can actually PLAY WoW, and isn't forced to just stand on the fleet for 5-6 hours trying to get 1 PvP match in.

any tool that allows players to enjoy most or all of the content is a win win. Jerks will be jerks in any setting, tools don't create a bad attitude, it already exists.

Yes, however this tool could become a magnifying glass to show the world just how many of those people there are.

An X-server LFG tool won't save the game, if the thing driving people away is something else.

X-sever LFG is very good at keeping a lot of dead servers "alive", but it not something that will magically make the game grow.

[snip]

i still fail to see how our points werent the same:P

have ruined the average players view

The wording, in my view, implies something wrong. The average player is your average Joe, that will look for the path of minimal resistance and see only his/her goals .. will do almost anything to see them achieved, then "forget" of the ones who helped.

So, you see, there isn`t an "average" player to talk about ruined points of view, because it is the said average player that does it the most.

In my humble opinion. I admit it is a personal opinion based on loose statistics and observation. Our points of view are the same, except that I am applying the "And the average player stole his own money and heralded it as a great victory" approach