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Missing Hutta NPCs | Explain Yourself Developers

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Missing Hutta NPCs | Explain Yourself Developers

DarkTergon's Avatar


DarkTergon
06.06.2020 , 07:10 AM | #11
Quote: Originally Posted by Tofu_Shark View Post
In the name of the Force, edit your damn posts if you have more to say. Don't double post 3 minutes later because you want to respond to someone else in the thread. Just edit your post and add their quote to it.
I'll post all I damn well want to, you're not the forum police. And if I want them seperated, so that the post isn't too long, I'll do that to, don't like it, put me on ignore , I really don't care.

And yes, it is YOUR fault, you made it personal. You took what I said out of context to suit your propaganda.
As I said, when on FLEET I use it, but when on planet, I used to use the givers. And for someone so outraged that his immersion is broken by them not being there, where was your outrage 5 years ago when they were first removed, or your outrage since then???
You know you can't fix an idiot, turns out you can't quarantine them either!!!
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Tofu_Shark's Avatar


Tofu_Shark
06.06.2020 , 11:41 AM | #12
Quote: Originally Posted by Phazonfreak View Post
And what kind of a mindset do you demonstrate by using me as an example to claim with absolute certainty that the change happened more recently for no reason and SteveTheCynic proving you wrong and you not even acknowledging your mistake? Just curious...
So I made an inaccurate recollection, big deal. That doesn't change that the playstyle exemplified by you and Tergon shared by a lot of others most likely got that content removed in the first place.

Quote: Originally Posted by DarkTergon View Post
I'll post all I damn well want to, you're not the forum police. And if I want them seperated, so that the post isn't too long, I'll do that to, don't like it, put me on ignore , I really don't care.

And yes, it is YOUR fault, you made it personal. You took what I said out of context to suit your propaganda.
As I said, when on FLEET I use it, but when on planet, I used to use the givers. And for someone so outraged that his immersion is broken by them not being there, where was your outrage 5 years ago when they were first removed, or your outrage since then???
I can't take someone seriously that double-posts like that. They obviously don't know how internet forums work. Even though we actually agree on something, you're still on the offensive. I'm not going to put you on ignore, because that's exactly what you'd want. Go to hell.

My outrage about this removed content was displayed when I found out about it years ago.
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DarkTergon's Avatar


DarkTergon
06.06.2020 , 02:16 PM | #13
Quote: Originally Posted by Tofu_Shark View Post
I can't take someone seriously that double-posts like that. They obviously don't know how internet forums work. Even though we actually agree on something, you're still on the offensive. I'm not going to put you on ignore, because that's exactly what you'd want. Go to hell..

How internet forums work? Are you 12? Seriously. I don't care, I don't want anything from you, the fact you feel like I do, shows us everything we need to know about you.

I'll edit this, just for you. Are you ready? There are plenty of people in here who don't take you serious, for many reasons, all we have to do is peruse your posts. I don't think I've been ignored by as many people as you, or had as much negativity as you. Don't get me wrong, I've disagreed with people in the past, only ever had to put two people on ignore, but that was to save my sanity. I've had issues with mods, so I can't really say what I mean, but you have a chip on your shoulder, it has shown in many posts. You need to look at that.
You know you can't fix an idiot, turns out you can't quarantine them either!!!
Feel free to click the link and get all the usual goodies
http://www.swtor.com/r/jFXFFQ

DarkTergon's Avatar


DarkTergon
06.06.2020 , 04:56 PM | #14
Quote: Originally Posted by Tofu_Shark View Post
Just for me? Aw, you shouldn't had!
I had to, you really needed it, you've such a longing for ...well something, I just had to help a poor soul out.
you're welcome
You know you can't fix an idiot, turns out you can't quarantine them either!!!
Feel free to click the link and get all the usual goodies
http://www.swtor.com/r/jFXFFQ

ceryxp's Avatar


ceryxp
06.06.2020 , 06:21 PM | #15
The very same update that removed those NPCs was the same update that put the heroic missions terminal on the fleet. So, player mindset couldn't have anything to do with those NPCs being removed. Now, if the terminals had been added to the fleet and everyone stopped using the NPCs to get the missions so BW decided, "well, no one uses them so no one will miss them," you might have an argument. But since it didn't happen that way...
--------------------------------------------------
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Tofu_Shark's Avatar


Tofu_Shark
06.07.2020 , 12:14 AM | #16
Quote: Originally Posted by ceryxp View Post
The very same update that removed those NPCs was the same update that put the heroic missions terminal on the fleet. So, player mindset couldn't have anything to do with those NPCs being removed. Now, if the terminals had been added to the fleet and everyone stopped using the NPCs to get the missions so BW decided, "well, no one uses them so no one will miss them," you might have an argument. But since it didn't happen that way...
Witness testimony is highly unreliable. One of us is wrong, or both of us are wrong. I'm going to examine the patch notes regarding this, and if it turns out what you say is true, that doesn't explain the "what they don't notice won't hurt them" policy when it comes to content removal.

Alright, so far I've found the Bonus Series NPCs were removed in update 4.1: Anarchy in Paradise:
Quote:
  • Removed the Nar Shaddaa Bonus Series Mission NPCs from the Fleets. The Mission chain can now be accepted directly from Colonel Harok (Imperial) or Deera Ulyette (Republic) on Nar Shaddaa upon reaching level 60.

  • Removed the Hoth Bonus Series Mission Terminals found on Voss. The Mission chain can now be accepted directly from Captain Graich (Imperial) or General Ilic Nadab (Republic) on Hoth once they reach level 60.

  • Removed the Alderaan Bonus Series NPCs from the Fleets. The Mission chain can now be accepted directly from Lord Serjay Thul (Imperial) or Major Brom (Republic) on Alderaan upon reaching level 60
I have gone through every patch notes from KotFE to Onslaught. The only thing I found is in 4.0: Knights of the Fallen Empire Early Access:

Quote:
Heroic Missions
Nearly all Heroic Missions have been adjusted to be completed by groups of 2+. This means that most former [Heroic 4] missions have had their difficulties reduced. Barring a few exceptions, Heroic Missions no longer need to be turned in at an NPC or Mission Dropbox. On completion of the final step of a Heroic Mission, the completion dialog will appear immediately.

...

While Heroic Missions may still be acquired from NPCs in the field, you will also find a new Weekly Heroic Mission Terminal just outside of the spaceports of all planets up through Makeb. Accessing this terminal will allow you to easily acquire all the Heroic Missions for that planet. In addition, both the Republic and Imperial Fleets have a Weekly Heroic Mission Terminal that offers Heroic Missions for all planets.

...
This is almost certainly when the heroic misison turn-in conversations were removed, but they never outright say they were removed. There is nothing that mentions the removal of the heroic mission NPCs mentioned in this thread. It is either undocumented or that is one hell of a bug.
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Phazonfreak's Avatar


Phazonfreak
06.07.2020 , 06:16 AM | #17
Quote: Originally Posted by Tofu_Shark View Post
So I made an inaccurate recollection, big deal. That doesn't change that the playstyle exemplified by you and Tergon shared by a lot of others most likely got that content removed in the first place.
That is exactly my point. You are the one making it a big deal by coming on strong blaming certain player types for the removal while you don't have your facts straight. I am also baffled by your strategy to lump me together with the players who don't care about it when I was the first one confirming it in the thread discussion. I knew about it right when it happened back in 2015, but it was not such a big deal for me to harass the devs about it. I wouldn't mind having them back though.

I think your frustration is misplaced here. You seem to be entirely convinced that the removal of the npcs happened out of malice or carelessness, but all the evidence points to a mechanical reason. They did not remove all the npcs, but only very specific ones. We all know that the engine is very error-prone and it is entirely possible that when they changed the Heroics and max level progression with 4.0 and implemented the Activity Finder, level scaling and the Heroics terminal on the fleet, they stumbled upon bugs with the npcs and to clear it up they decided to remove them instead of working around them.

Tofu_Shark's Avatar


Tofu_Shark
06.07.2020 , 11:27 AM | #18
Something like that should be documented, not hidden. If it's not documented, there's no reason to believe it was due to a bug. It's not out of malice or carelessness. Look at all the other content that's been removed over time for no good reason. Look at some of the other changes that were made due to a particular group's playstyle (particularly PvPers).
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SteveTheCynic's Avatar


SteveTheCynic
06.07.2020 , 11:51 AM | #19
Quote: Originally Posted by Tofu_Shark View Post
This is almost certainly when the heroic misison turn-in conversations were removed, but they never outright say they were removed. There is nothing that mentions the removal of the heroic mission NPCs mentioned in this thread. It is either undocumented or that is one hell of a bug.
:facepalm: There's no "almost certainly" about it.(1) They removed the "return to giver" thing in 4.0, along with some-but-not-all of the givers themselves. They also removed the Bonus Series breadcrumbs.

(1) No, I don't need to provide [citation] for that, and even if I did, it's not going to happen. I was *there*, and it's really hard to say which braincell contains that information.
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Phazonfreak's Avatar


Phazonfreak
06.07.2020 , 12:38 PM | #20
Quote: Originally Posted by Tofu_Shark View Post
Something like that should be documented, not hidden. If it's not documented, there's no reason to believe it was due to a bug. It's not out of malice or carelessness. Look at all the other content that's been removed over time for no good reason. Look at some of the other changes that were made due to a particular group's playstyle (particularly PvPers).
If there is one point I agree with you it is that they should have documented why they removed certain Heroic npcs just to make it clear to us and avoid speculation. But your claim that they did it only to suit a specific player type still does not make a lot of sense. If that was the case they would have removed all the Heroic npcs and not just seemingly random ones. You have planets, like Hutta or Ord Mantell, where you can still find some of the quest givers while others have vanished into thin air.

Hutta is probably the best indication that it has more to do with an engine hickup that they solved with a sledgehammer rather than suiting specific player types. If you go to the terminal at the spaceport you will see all 4 Heroics listed. If you try to pick up "Hostage Situation Cleanup" you'll get an error message and it disappears from the list, because it is a follow-up Heroic that only becomes availabe after you finished "Hostage Situation" and talked to Foreman Rahmm. However, this is not the case when you pick up the Heroics from the terminal on the fleet and everything works fine. This tells me that the way they implemented the new system with pick-ups from terminals on the fleet, at the spaceports and through the Activity Finder caused problems with the way Heroics are handled in terms of npcs as quest givers and receivers.