...you probably think this nerf is about you, don't you.

 

Per the devs, the nerfs and buffs are based on balancing average productivity by the classes, not top tier or lowest tier productivity. If you go into the nerfs thinking solely about how it will affect you, rather than the overall impact it has on the game, you are leading yourself to disappointment.

 

For completion:

...you probably think this nerf is about you, don't you.]

Not really no!

It's about how the nerfs impact our ability to play the damn game. Not ONE of these nerfs has helped improve the game for any player, only limit it and make it far less inclusive. NOBODY is better off after this entire summer/fall of nerfs...2 freaking seasons, and counting, of making the games nearly 6 year old content less and less accessible to players.

 

This amount of investment of time by a developer sure as hell should IMPROVE the game, not make it exponentially worse for everyone. What has happened the past few months is utterly inexcusable.

It's about how the nerfs impact our ability to play the damn game. Not ONE of these nerfs has helped improve the game for any player, only limit it and make it far less inclusive. NOBODY is better off after this entire summer/fall of nerfs...2 freaking seasons, and counting, of making the games nearly 6 year old content less and less accessible to players.

 

This amount of investment of time by a developer sure as hell should IMPROVE the game, not make it exponentially worse for everyone. What has happened the past few months is utterly inexcusable.

 

Tux your wrong. Nerf do improve the game balance and thus improve it for all. Making the game easier wasn’t an options, people were 4 man’ing ops because it was becoming too easy. Gearing is terrible, class balance is terrible, story is terrrible they needed to fix everything and it sort of makes sense to attack balance first.

 

Now there is no excuse for it taking 10 months, that’s crazy stupid and they still have yet to really fix anything other than pure damage output and heal output. That’s barely half the story. They need to balance defenses, utilities, stealth, and tanking just to name a few things they have yet to address. They have made this process so much worse than it needed to be, that I will agree with you on. But balance or at least near balance has to be at least attempted and seeing as the classes were by and large vastly over powered for PvE nerfs were the way to go. Healing for one has been OP for far too long. I hate to mention this but there maybe yet more nerfs to come, with the changes to OP and Merc healing Sorc healing might need to get hit again......and there are a few DPS classes that too might need a change or two.

Tux your wrong. Nerf do improve the game balance and thus improve it for all. Making the game easier wasn’t an options, people were 4 man’ing ops because it was becoming too easy. Gearing is terrible, class balance is terrible, story is terrrible they needed to fix everything and it sort of makes sense to attack balance first.

 

Now there is no excuse for it taking 10 months, that’s crazy stupid and they still have yet to really fix anything other than pure damage output and heal output. That’s barely half the story. They need to balance defenses, utilities, stealth, and tanking just to name a few things they have yet to address. They have made this process so much worse than it needed to be, that I will agree with you on. But balance or at least near balance has to be at least attempted and seeing as the classes were by and large vastly over powered for PvE nerfs were the way to go. Healing for one has been OP for far too long. I hate to mention this but there maybe yet more nerfs to come, with the changes to OP and Merc healing Sorc healing might need to get hit again......and there are a few DPS classes that too might need a change or two.

^

 

Although i will say that making changes over time is much safer than changing everything at the same time, and there is/should always be an evaluation period after changes are made to see the impact of the changes and weigh them against what the target impact was, regarding balance. BW has stated this already, so 10 months in the life of a game of this magnitude is nothing if the goal is to improve it.

Tux your wrong. Nerf do improve the game balance and thus improve it for all. Making the game easier wasn’t an options, people were 4 man’ing ops because it was becoming too easy.

Post 5.0, people were 4 manning ops? Even if they were, it was nothing but SM Ops, something that SHOULD be able to be beaten by 4 decent players...or are you talking about the new Op boss??? LOL!!! They made an Op boss, ONE, too easy, so they figured they should nerf everything? These nerfs HURT the game and have done irreparable damage to the playerbase. You can not convince me, because the numbers support my conclusion, that these nerfs have done anything good, only hurt the game.

They gave us stronger gear (up to 248), so we deal more damage or heal more than the mobs were designed for. Unchecked power creep is what would destroy the game. Without nerfs but with gear of rating higher and higher we could some day 3-man an Op, unless stopped by mechanics. I know a game where you can solo a queue which was designed for 20 people. Twenty people. This is was kills the game.

 

And before anyone comes accusing me that I probably don't play any of the nerfed classes or roll my face on keyboard running solo content: I play a few classes extensively, and all of those I play were nerfed, two quite severely (heals Sorc and heals Op on the table now), and I do Ops, MM FPs and what not.

 

Nerfs are not pleasant, especially when they nuke some abilities, but sometimes they're necessary. Accept the challenge and up your game, or switch to another FOTM, if that rocks your boat. But in the long run, power creep checks are good for any game that keeps rolling new content, higher levels, and stronger gear.

They gave us stronger gear (up to 248), so we deal more damage or heal more than the mobs were designed for. Unchecked power creep is what would destroy the game. Without nerfs but with gear of rating higher and higher we could some day 3-man an Op, unless stopped by mechanics. I know a game where you can solo a queue which was designed for 20 people. Twenty people. This is was kills the game.

 

And before anyone comes accusing me that I probably don't play any of the nerfed classes or roll my face on keyboard running solo content: I play a few classes extensively, and all of those I play were nerfed, two quite severely (heals Sorc and heals Op on the table now), and I do Ops, MM FPs and what not.

 

Nerfs are not pleasant, especially when they nuke some abilities, but sometimes they're necessary. Accept the challenge and up your game, or switch to another FOTM, if that rocks your boat. But in the long run, power creep checks are good for any game that keeps rolling new content, higher levels, and stronger gear.

Power creep WHERE? Story content? They didn't nuke a class, they nuked their game.

Post 5.0, people were 4 manning ops? Even if they were, it was nothing but SM Ops, something that SHOULD be able to be beaten by 4 decent players...or are you talking about the new Op boss??? LOL!!! They made an Op boss, ONE, too easy, so they figured they should nerf everything? These nerfs HURT the game and have done irreparable damage to the playerbase. You can not convince me, because the numbers support my conclusion, that these nerfs have done anything good, only hurt the game.

 

 

Many weeks ago I 8 man’d a 16 man hm TFB. We also 8 man’d the newest boss in 16 man mode. Its doable but a serious challenge. Which is nice but to have to create artificial challenge like that seems wrong. I really haven’t do much 4 man style other than HM EV when we don’t have enough people or get board and that hardly counts.

 

Honestly I am playing less and less, barely log on more then twice a week. I crave good stories and decent content and while so far the op is fun enough it is simply taking too long and has been too long since the last new op. The new FP wasn’t much fun for me and I truly despise the story, pathetic. As long as any hint of GC is left in the game that is also a total downer. I might not leave soon but I refuse to spend a dime in the CM anymore. I love the idea and the potential of this game, I just hate the way they are doing things and please hire some people because the speed things are done is just sad.

Post 5.0, people were 4 manning ops? Even if they were, it was nothing but SM Ops, something that SHOULD be able to be beaten by 4 decent players...or are you talking about the new Op boss??? LOL!!! They made an Op boss, ONE, too easy, so they figured they should nerf everything? These nerfs HURT the game and have done irreparable damage to the playerbase. You can not convince me, because the numbers support my conclusion, that these nerfs have done anything good, only hurt the game.

BW has also said its not about those that can 4-man ops. Its not about the top tier players or classes. Its about the average player amd average output, which is apparently too high for some and too low for others, for the current content. So buffs and nerfs were necessary for ALL of the game content to be balanced, and further nerfs and buffs will be on the way for eaxh class utilities as well.

Stupid.

 

OP, you probably think this reply is about you.

After this game closes for good I'd LOVE to see a "confession" post somewhere detailing how many BW staff posted on the forums to do nothing but white knight the developers' actions. If they decided to put 252 gear on the CM, there's definitely a group of people here who'd applaud them and tell us how it's the players fault for forcing the decision.

After this game closes for good I'd LOVE to see a "confession" post somewhere detailing how many BW staff posted on the forums to do nothing but white knight the developers' actions. If they decided to put 252 gear on the CM, there's definitely a group of people here who'd applaud them and tell us how it's the players fault for forcing the decision.

 

Read my posts, I am not a white knight, not even close. But balance was needed and because of the power of the classes it pretty much had to be nerfs.

 

I am not at all saying how it was done or how long it has taken is right, but nerfs were and some still are needed.

Read my posts, I am not a white knight, not even close. But balance was needed and because of the power of the classes it pretty much had to be nerfs.

Where? Where were 8 classes overpowered exactly??? Nothing SM counts because SM isn't meant to be "challenging", it's meant to be completed by every skill level of player, not challenging for the top 1%.

..., with the changes to OP and Merc healing Sorc healing might need to get hit again......and there are a few DPS classes that too might need a change or two.

 

And this downward spiral of nerfing will be beneficial to the game?

After this game closes for good I'd LOVE to see a "confession" post somewhere detailing how many BW staff posted on the forums to do nothing but white knight the developers' actions. If they decided to put 252 gear on the CM, there's definitely a group of people here who'd applaud them and tell us how it's the players fault for forcing the decision.

No kidding...it's mind boggling.

Many weeks ago I 8 man’d a 16 man hm TFB. We also 8 man’d the newest boss in 16 man mode. Its doable but a serious challenge. Which is nice but to have to create artificial challenge like that seems wrong. .

 

Even if you did 8 man 16m HM TFB that doesn't mean things needed nerfing. Nerfs should not be based around the highest tier players. Top tier will always have to create their own challenge, but that doesn't mean the game needs to change to suit them. A team can always reduce their stats, run old gear, take off half their gear, etc.

Where? Where were 8 classes overpowered exactly??? Nothing SM counts because SM isn't meant to be "challenging", it's meant to be completed by every skill level of player, not challenging for the top 1%.

Who says story mode ops arent supposed to be challenging? Are you just making that **** up? I dont recall BW ever saying that.

Where? Where were 8 classes overpowered exactly??? Nothing SM counts because SM isn't meant to be "challenging", it's meant to be completed by every skill level of player, not challenging for the top 1%.

 

Tux you’re loosing control here. You know I never mentioned SM ops. I am not part of the top 1% I am barely part of the top 51% maybe.....

 

But you want to talk SM....ok I tanked SM DF in dps gear without a shield all the way till the end, no deaths because I forgot to gear swap. That’s because healing is very over powered.

 

Part of this is because we’ve been doing the same fights for literally years now, we know every mechanic perfectly. But also part is the high dps and hps that we can get from most classes. I play a SS gunslinger and even with it once having been second worst training dummy dps I never had an issues DPS wise in any HM.

And this downward spiral of nerfing will be beneficial to the game?

 

I know, and partly its because I think they might have gone too far this time or not far enough with sage healing not sure will need to see how it plays out. All I can say is Sorcs have been able to heal anything I have run since their changes so.....

 

Nerfs are nasty bussiness. And balance is never achieved but I still believe it needs to be chased.

Who says story mode ops arent supposed to be challenging? Are you just making that **** up? I dont recall BW ever saying that.

Since you can join them from level 50+ AND have Bolster, I would suggest common sense tells you that they're meant to be completed by nearly everyone.

But you want to talk SM....ok I tanked SM DF in dps gear without a shield all the way till the end, no deaths because I forgot to gear swap. That’s because healing is very over powered.

No lol, this shows you don't know what you're talking about...it's because of Bolster, not healing.

I am not part of the top 1% I am barely part of the top 51% maybe.....

 

I'm sorry, but that does not jive....you say you 8m 16man TFB HM, 8m 16man VoMG, etc. I don't think that puts you in the 51st percentile. I'd be willing to bet that over half the current player base doesn't even have the TFB HM achievement, let alone completing it shorthanded.

Even if you did 8 man 16m HM TFB that doesn't mean things needed nerfing. Nerfs should not be based around the highest tier players. Top tier will always have to create their own challenge, but that doesn't mean the game needs to change to suit them. A team can always reduce their stats, run old gear, take off half their gear, etc.

 

Oh come on. Self nerfing is ridiculous. I get it, nerfs suck and not everyone is on the same skill level, but telling the high end they need to remove gear for the game to be challenging is the stupidest thing I've heard yet on these forums. That's never how it's been done. Ever.

Edited September 28, 2017 by kodrac

Since you can join them from level 50+ AND have Bolster, I would suggest common sense tells you that they're meant to be completed by nearly everyone.

I guess we interpret it differently. I see that level 50+ are able to participate in it, with bolster, but by no means should it be a cake walk. Bolster just allows more players to participate, it doesnt mean things should be easier.