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The biggest Issue I have with playing non force users is.

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > General Discussion
The biggest Issue I have with playing non force users is.

brendhanbb's Avatar


brendhanbb
07.14.2019 , 10:38 PM | #1
Force users sith or jedi should easily be able to well defeat them. It seriously bugs me how troopers and bh and agents and smuggler seem just as merry sue as well jedis/sith( i do not mind jedis/sith being marry sue they are pretty op) its just the other 4 non sith/jedi classes seem just as op as jedis/sith. Like honestly it makes very little sense to me how they can well beat force users. I mean even during one of the flashpoints the non force users just become force users who cant use the force?

Celise's Avatar


Celise
07.14.2019 , 11:55 PM | #2
Mary and Marty stu characters are typically teenagers, and they have very unrealistic skill sets and goals, they know all the most powerful people around and are their friends, so when it comes time to figure out how to crack an ancient door lock and stay above a fire pit, they have full fitness skills with excellent lockpicking skills and know everything about acheology as well.

But i do agree, that non force users aren't really in the same weight league as a moderately powerful force user, but then there are exceptions to the rule on occasion, bounty hunters could easily handle one or two jedi with the right skills and tools for the job. most of the tools involve stun nets and incapacitation devices, using rocket boosters to get out of range. but the fitness and awareness needed to overcome a force user, one would need to be really on top of their game and have a plan in the event of success or failure accordingly.

Any really good smuggler with experience in tricky situations can use dirty tricks to pull it off by using brains over the blaster. for example using a megnetic device to pull the lightsaber out of the Sith's hand and from there it is also about stun nets and other devices.

Soldiers are generally too ridged thinking to overcome force users, unless they are creative on how they overcome their more dangerous counterparts, but how often do you find a soldier that has the mine for creativity? the Trooper should find dealing with force users a lot more dififcult than the BH, smuggler or IA.

The Agent could easily overcome a force user, remember that the agent has to use their brains on a regular basis to out think their enemies and take them down. so planting a room full of traps to lead force users into. it wouldn't be especially difficult to get the right tools for shock devices to put a jedi or sith out and then a simple shot to the head.

AlaricSevGirl's Avatar


AlaricSevGirl
07.15.2019 , 12:31 AM | #3
Completely disagree. Remember Order 66 where clones took out most of the jedi order? Also, everyone has the force in some capacity even if they don't believe it or use a light saber.
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DarthCasus's Avatar


DarthCasus
07.15.2019 , 01:02 AM | #4
Spoiler
.. Now that the Agent has been disposed of
Spoiler
, we can talk freely to the Bounty Hunter who totally
Spoiler
or didn't have half of their plans and ideas given to them by their walking talking smartphone best friend/lover. Let me ask the Trooper if they've gone toe-to-toe with any Sith 1 on 1 yet, after all, Havoc rolls together as a squad of the elite (look at the Hope trailer again if you need a reminder of Havoc vs Sith though). The Smuggler is dumb ol' luck though, certainly got boring with that plot armor but the plot was great.
Spoiler


It also depends on the quality of the Force user, though, no? Flashpoint groups are done under the purposefully unspecific tag of 'strike teams' rather than specific characters in most cases, even with the conversations with Malgus/Satele prior to and after. It was never a 1 on 1 with a matching adversary.

If that's bugging you though, Chapter 8 of Kotfe could have been the end with you know, your spine somehow getting rekt by space Hitler but his evil daddeh magic keeping you alive no mater which class you played. It's plot armor, a game and a narrative driven one, yeah but it's not too unbelievable considering Calo Nord, Jango, the Mandalore Crusaders, Cad Bane, the Old Sith Empire, Battle Droids(...) and so on have proven to be challenges for Force users.
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Rolodome's Avatar


Rolodome
07.15.2019 , 01:18 AM | #5
The class content was done pretty well in this way, I think. Limiting your contact with force users if you aren't one, putting other factors into play if you do to make it more believable.

One of the byproducts of merging the stories was making this impossible to do while also making force users enemies in some significant capacity. So instead we just get "eh, you're super powerful somehow, who knows why."

Not that "you happen to be really strong in the force" is much better, but at least it's an in-world excuse for how powerful you are.
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SteveTheCynic
07.15.2019 , 05:41 AM | #6
Quote: Originally Posted by DarthCasus View Post
Spoiler
.. Now that the Agent has been disposed of
Tsk.
Spoiler
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Celise's Avatar


Celise
07.15.2019 , 05:41 AM | #7
Quote: Originally Posted by AlaricSevGirl View Post
Completely disagree. Remember Order 66 where clones took out most of the jedi order? Also, everyone has the force in some capacity even if they don't believe it or use a light saber.
Not that has anything to do with the old republic era, but the jedi were blinded for all their last years all the way upto order 66 by the darkside, the jedi were ill prepared for what they were facing and quite honestly in their stubborness or arrogance, they maintained the status quo. Much like a regular soldier. Those who don't know how to bend end up breaking. Of course it matters no one bit how massively outnumbered each jedi was, the clones received a similar fate when they all ended up going to the meatgrinder and what was left are dullard, braindead soldiers in white armour when the clone numbers thinned out.

You also forget Pong Krell if you are going to make a point of it, and you'll realise only one soldier had the brains and creativity to overcome Pong Krell and stun him.

FlameYOL's Avatar


FlameYOL
07.15.2019 , 07:14 AM | #8
As others have explained its not that senseless. If a non-force sensitive can have the proper tools and brains for the job it can happen.
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Cawyden's Avatar


Cawyden
07.15.2019 , 09:10 AM | #9
Quote: Originally Posted by AlaricSevGirl View Post
Completely disagree. Remember Order 66 where clones took out most of the jedi order? Also, everyone has the force in some capacity even if they don't believe it or use a light saber.
Well this was hardly a fair 1 vs 1 fight - the clones were for months and years fighting loyal at the side of the jedis and when order 66 came the jedis got literally shot in the back by several clones at the same time.

JediQuaker's Avatar


JediQuaker
07.15.2019 , 10:45 AM | #10
Quote: Originally Posted by brendhanbb View Post
Force users sith or jedi should easily be able to well defeat them.
You seem to be making a lot of unsubstantiated claims here.
Who says force users should be easily able to defeat NFUs? You are assuming that FUs are more powerful than NFUs, but there's no data to back that up (mostly because it's all fictional ).
"The Force" may be "strong in that one", but that doesn't mean the force is ultimately stronger than a good blaster with "force infused" armor on the "other one".
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