Before patch 6.0.2 I spent 300 million credits trying to learn the gold item level 306 relic. I got up to item level 286 before it got too expensive to continue. Today is the first day of 6.0.2 and I spent another 200 million to get that 10% chance to learn the item level 292. It now costs 12 solid resource matrix and 30 processed isotope stabilizers plus other mats to make a 292 item level relic which gives a 10% chance to learn a better version.

 

So it took me 1 week to grind 306 gear from flashpoints / operations. Crafting is for people who either don't want to do that content, or want to get gear faster than that content provides. If someone can grind 306 gear in a week, then at the bare minimum a crafter should be able to craft gear faster than that.

 

Right now it takes 8 solid resource matrix to craft an item level 286 relic for a 10% chance to learn that 292 relic. Once you learn the 292 relic, you then need 12 solid resource matrix, which is another 10% chance to learn the next level. That means that even if you are really lucky, and only have to craft one of each to learn the next level recipe, that is 20 solid resource matrix plus however many you need for the next level.

 

I suggest that you don't need to be in a guild to get gear. Large yield guilds can get 6 solid resource matrix a week from conquest (per toon, but since you need a relic per toon, that is beside the point). But since you shouldn't have to be in a guild to craft your own gear, that means you only get 2 solid resource matrix a week.

 

This means even if you are really lucky and learn the next level recipe every time, it would still take you 10 weeks to learn the recipes to get to item level 292 relic (and this is only one relic, and each toon needs two).

 

At this rate of 10+ weeks to craft vs 1 week to grind, there is no point in crafting relics.

 

My suggestion is this, drastically lower the cost of solid resource matrix, and when you "crit" on a crafted item, and you get an augment slot in that gear, reverse engineering that piece of gear has a double chance of learning the recipe. So 20% instead of 10%. When you crit on an augment, you get two augments, so a double chance when reverse engineering those augments. Why not do the same with crafted gear. When you crit on a piece of gear, you get an augment slot. So gear that crits (and has an augment slot) has a double chance of learning a recipe when you reverse engineer it.

Crafting anything but augments (and kits) and biochem consumables is pointless this expansion (and those are not all that big of an improvement in most content, as well as they still have ridiculous materials requirements after the 6.0.2 changes compared to the past).

 

The lack of anything useful to craft beyond those two items is probably the biggest fail of the whole fiasco called Onslaught crafting.

Edited December 12, 2019 by DawnAskham

20 stabilisators for one blue piece of ...?

 

Please, remove this nightmare from the game.

You guys turn crafting in nuclear physics and now you can't fix this mess.

Face it: Crafting 6.0 is a disaster.

Remove the crafting, rebuild it and implement it again.

no change to cybertech ear schematics they are still requiring 20 green and 20 blue Fibrolite where armortech and others only need 1 of this or 2 of that.

 

Implants still require 20 slicing mats.

 

Synthweaving cloth need sliceing mats???

 

Most of the other schematics still have too high of a mat cost.

 

Purple prototype schematics still need legendary Embers and 5 of them to boot.

 

Reverse engineering has not even been touched.

 

No item should cost 200 plus mats to make just to trash it for the next level up. RE 14 augments at 10% each and got nothing.

 

None of the Schematics are balanced with other crafts of similar items. Mat rewards are still all over the place from giving ones or twos to give out thirty of something.

 

Needing data spikes for nearly half of everything and always taking up the highest cost.

 

No I gave you enough of my money over the last eight years.

 

You ruined the gearing

You refuse to balance the games flash points, uprisings or operations.

Ruining the need for proper gear.

Ruined crafting an cant even balance the numbers or do what you say you will do.

Everything cost 10 times more than it did before and you ear 10 times less.

Renown does not scale to give you your bonuses.

The chapters are broken as special events or vehicles do not have the health to survive or do enough damage to kill a single group before dying.

All that is left is one flash point that is barely worth playing and one operation that you have to push people in front of a train to win???

 

You might as well have removed 99% of the content.

 

Goodbye sub because I don't need to pay for getting nothing worth playing.

Goodbye Forum because I cant complain if I am not sub.

Not that I care.

Yea just remove the endgame and let everyone get gear by doing macros. Problem solved. Macro player problems continue to amaze me. You don't think of the economy you don't think the endgame, population of the game, the health of the game, you just want to get BiS doing macro's and gain billions in the process.

 

Not Gonna Happen.

Yea just remove the endgame and let everyone get gear by doing macros. Problem solved. Macro player problems continue to amaze me. You don't think of the economy you don't think the endgame, population of the game, the health of the game, you just want to get BiS doing macro's and gain billions in the process.

 

Not Gonna Happen.

 

Very interesting way to tell the world you have no clue what you are posting about. First none of the items crafted are any better than what you can get in game. In fact its actually easier to just grind out flashpoints to get the gear. Second they are talking about the requirements to make single items that are no where near end game. As far as the "gear by doing macro's" statement you just sound sophomoric and clearly do not understand the topic.

 

The fact is that there are people that just like to craft items and this expansion has destroyed that community. How would people react if you had to do 15+ NiM raids to get a single 306 Armoring? Well that's kind of like what a crafter has to go through to get a gold schematic. The reason augments cost so much is because of the cost and materials it takes to make one. So really by punishing the crafters and making them go through hundreds of mats to get a single upgrade they are punishing the whole community that needs those augments, stims etc.

 

Here is an example to make a single MK-11 kit you have to use 358 mats in addition to the time spent REing level 11 Assembly components to get everything I need to make a single MK-11 augmentation kit. This is what you call excessive.

 

The new crafting setup is just 100% asinine and one of the most poorly thought out processes I have ever seen in a game. For people that do not craft and want to have the best gear they can for endgame content this means paying way over 150 million to get the augments and other things they need to get their toon up to where they need it do do that content successfully. Just to make 14 of those Kits takes over 5000 individual mats. What that translates to is players that do not craft will end up paying around 14 million credits just for the kits, and then another 140 million credits for the augments to put into that armor. So round about 150 million credits to get a single toon fully augmented, and that is just fracking ridiculous.

 

So go ahead and criticize crafters for wanting a better system that does not cost them so much to make a single item because you are the one that will be paying that premium in the long run. Perhaps when you have spent 300 million credits augmenting 2 toons you might stop and reflect a bit on your comment. As it is in a market economy that excess cost is always passed on, and you and others are the ones that will be paying it.

Its a crafter's nightmare. You've heard what people are saying so change it. I've subbed for 8 years and I'm about ready to quit!!

The crafting "fix" is a complete joke. I can't believe the devs are shoving this down our throats. I really don't blame people for bailing on the game. First, we told them that crafting was broken in PTS. They went live with it anyway, basically saying like it or lump it. Then they said they were going to fix crafting, but it would take several months to do. Then we get this drivel? Seriously? Do you people have a problem with understanding our disgust with this pile of steaming bantha excrement you handed us?

I rarely post and complain even less, but this crafting "Fix" was disappointing and aggravating. I spent way too much time of my life running missions and gathering materials with the naive expectations that I would be able to craft my first 75th level character into the higher gear ratings to help its progression. I was not expecting crafting to get me into the 300+, but I was expecting to get into the higher 280s -for the enjoyment of crafting itself-. But with the heavy processed isotope stabilizers requirements, and "Playing my way", I was only able to make a few items my character could actually use due to the low RE % on some items and the high processed isotope stabilizers requirement. I am sorta thankful that the processed isotope stabilizers are not one of the returned components from RE because I likely would have continued chasing this false hope.

 

I would have been farther ahead by spending that time playing and acquiring BtL equipment.

Edited December 13, 2019 by Kurvah

Before patch 6.0.2 I spent 300 million credits trying to learn the gold item level 306 relic.

 

What for? Why do you need to craft a relic in 6.0? I am sorry, but it seems you trying to follow the old pre 6.0 way of doing things which is pointless now.

 

If you want a 306 relic now, all you have to do is to get to 306 IR and then farm FP for relic you want. That's it, zero crafting needed. I have a whole section of my Legacy Cargo filled with 306 relics, none of which came from my crafter.

 

The only things worth crafting now are augments, stims, adrenalins and medpacks.

Edited December 13, 2019 by Gelious

The only things worth crafting now are augments, stims, adrenalins and medpacks.

 

Isn't that the sad truth. Grats Bioware managed to kill half the crafting classes in one expansion.

The only things worth crafting now are augments, stims, adrenalins and medpacks.

 

And even that is debatable. The upgrade stat difference is barely out of the single digits. It's a difference of something like 24 mastery on a 15,000 mastery stat pool, for the stim.

 

It's statistically insignificant.

Edited December 14, 2019 by Monterone

Before patch 6.0.2 I spent 300 million credits trying to learn the gold item level 306 relic. I got up to item level 286 before it got too expensive to continue. Today is the first day of 6.0.2 and I spent another 200 million to get that 10% chance to learn the item level 292. It now costs 12 solid resource matrix and 30 processed isotope stabilizers plus other mats to make a 292 item level relic which gives a 10% chance to learn a better version.

 

So it took me 1 week to grind 306 gear from flashpoints / operations. Crafting is for people who either don't want to do that content, or want to get gear faster than that content provides. If someone can grind 306 gear in a week, then at the bare minimum a crafter should be able to craft gear faster than that.

 

Right now it takes 8 solid resource matrix to craft an item level 286 relic for a 10% chance to learn that 292 relic. Once you learn the 292 relic, you then need 12 solid resource matrix, which is another 10% chance to learn the next level. That means that even if you are really lucky, and only have to craft one of each to learn the next level recipe, that is 20 solid resource matrix plus however many you need for the next level.

You have to realize, that quite some people worked for weeks or months on this useless piece of crafting system. The only sane way to explain such a pointless system (pointless, because it is totally lacking any bit of fun or reason inside of a GAME) is, that the devs totally hate crafting and try to get the focus from their customers to different parts of the game. The new gearing system, which offers a way quicker way to get equipment than crafting does supports this theorie.

 

Face it: Bioware hates crafting. No trolling, I really don't see another reason for the current system. Not many people will spend hundreds of millions on this pointless system. It will be totally ignored eventually. The very most players wont ever be able to even afford this nonsense up to the end. It is dead on arrival and they know it. They simply hate crafting.

Crafting anything but augments (and kits) and biochem consumables is pointless this expansion (and those are not all that big of an improvement in most content, as well as they still have ridiculous materials requirements after the 6.0.2 changes compared to the past).

 

The lack of anything useful to craft beyond those two items is probably the biggest fail of the whole fiasco called Onslaught crafting.

I'd go a step farther and say that the only reason to craft the new stuff is to bait suckers that insist on having the newest stuff..... and only the previous generation stuff is really worthwhile, with the possible exception of biochem reusables

 

the changes made in this update were half-assed even by the standard of their own patch notes which they do not even fulfill.... I'm seriously mad at myself for having paid out a 6mo sub before 6.0 dropped, because otherwise I'd be unsubbed right now.

 

 

crafting should have been one of the easiest to accomplish things to update for this expansion.... instead we've had rollbacks of multiple positive changes to crafting,repetition of previously acknowledged mistakes, degraded performance which we can only buy back a portion of the original, and despite all the needles added complexity, the lack of any real effort or basic checks shows through all of it.

 

from the copy pasta mission names, to the miscopied drop formulas, to the completely useless development names on objects, completely nonfuntional items, and absolutely no attention to balance or reasonable scale of time or effort required..... everything about crafting in onslaught says "screw you" to crafters.

You have to realize, that quite some people worked for weeks or months on this useless piece of crafting system. The only sane way to explain such a pointless system (pointless, because it is totally lacking any bit of fun or reason inside of a GAME) is, that the devs totally hate crafting and try to get the focus from their customers to different parts of the game. The new gearing system, which offers a way quicker way to get equipment than crafting does supports this theorie.

 

Face it: Bioware hates crafting. No trolling, I really don't see another reason for the current system. Not many people will spend hundreds of millions on this pointless system. It will be totally ignored eventually. The very most players wont ever be able to even afford this nonsense up to the end. It is dead on arrival and they know it. They simply hate crafting.

 

The blunt, unadulterated truth:

 

Crafting will never be what it used to be. Cash stores have replaced what crafting used to do for a lot of games. You used to craft all kinds of different armors, many that were used for cosmetics, look changes and so on.

 

All of this cosmetic stuff has now been moved over to the cash stores for most games. Crafting now only has one thing to compete with and that is loot drops. And you can't make crafting drop any better loot than top tier content does or all the hard work creating top tier content is lost.

 

Which means crafting is in a limbo it may never recover from, unless the concept of crafting is completely redesigned. But whatever you re-design it to, you're taking away from the cash store.

Edited December 14, 2019 by Monterone

Face it: Bioware hates crafting. No trolling, I really don't see another reason for the current system. Not many people will spend hundreds of millions on this pointless system. It will be totally ignored eventually. The very most players wont ever be able to even afford this nonsense up to the end. It is dead on arrival and they know it. They simply hate crafting.

 

 

"These stupid customers are supposed to continue playing this crap."

 

That is, what they really think about us.

Very interesting way to tell the world you have no clue what you are posting about. First none of the items crafted are any better than what you can get in game. In fact its actually easier to just grind out flashpoints to get the gear. Second they are talking about the requirements to make single items that are no where near end game. As far as the "gear by doing macro's" statement you just sound sophomoric and clearly do not understand the topic.

 

The fact is that there are people that just like to craft items and this expansion has destroyed that community. How would people react if you had to do 15+ NiM raids to get a single 306 Armoring? Well that's kind of like what a crafter has to go through to get a gold schematic. The reason augments cost so much is because of the cost and materials it takes to make one. So really by punishing the crafters and making them go through hundreds of mats to get a single upgrade they are punishing the whole community that needs those augments, stims etc.

 

Here is an example to make a single MK-11 kit you have to use 358 mats in addition to the time spent REing level 11 Assembly components to get everything I need to make a single MK-11 augmentation kit. This is what you call excessive.

 

The new crafting setup is just 100% asinine and one of the most poorly thought out processes I have ever seen in a game. For people that do not craft and want to have the best gear they can for endgame content this means paying way over 150 million to get the augments and other things they need to get their toon up to where they need it do do that content successfully. Just to make 14 of those Kits takes over 5000 individual mats. What that translates to is players that do not craft will end up paying around 14 million credits just for the kits, and then another 140 million credits for the augments to put into that armor. So round about 150 million credits to get a single toon fully augmented, and that is just fracking ridiculous.

 

So go ahead and criticize crafters for wanting a better system that does not cost them so much to make a single item because you are the one that will be paying that premium in the long run. Perhaps when you have spent 300 million credits augmenting 2 toons you might stop and reflect a bit on your comment. As it is in a market economy that excess cost is always passed on, and you and others are the ones that will be paying it.

 

You are the one who doesn't understand. This game has no macro detection whatsoever. Do you know what crafter does? Writes a simple click macro, for multiple toons, logging in and out, making millions overnight via mats, craftable gear, cq rewards etc. Many economies breaking bugs + this macro issue, left this game economy in desperate need of credit sink. Now a cost for any item in the game is being calculated by macro time, not by playtime.

 

Is it hurting the poor? Yes. Is if unfair whom not cheating? Yes. Is it the reality that we live in? That is also yes. Is some crafting skills useless and needs a rework? Yes

 

Honestly, no one should be able to create and mods, armor. Do you want gear? Do the content. But you guys insisted that crafter (a.k.a people who macro / bots/cheat) to able to craft the BiS gear in the game. (you can't btw except armoring). So this is the price, and removing cq mats to craft blue gear was the right choice. Now it's balanced and fine. You want to craft BiS and make millions? You need to grind, I mean sorry macro longer.

Edited December 16, 2019 by lord-angelus

My experience:

Im was able to learn the Legendary versatile armoring 77 after 30 attemps (requirements are absolutely retarded for that 10% of chance). But now, in order to learn the last schematic, I spent 63!!!! Legendary versatile armorings 77 and got nothing. So, I think the 10% is not working at all, its seriously a joke.

 

I really believe devs are doing a *********** bad job (I meant, dev).

Also, I agree with the guy who previously reply on this topic, macro detection is a MUST, but we have no devs here

You are the one who doesn't understand. This game has no macro detection whatsoever. Do you know what crafter does? Writes a simple click macro, for multiple toons, logging in and out, making millions overnight via mats, craftable gear, cq rewards etc. Many economies breaking bugs + this macro issue, left this game economy in desperate need of credit sink. Now a cost for any item in the game is being calculated by macro time, not by playtime.

 

Is it hurting the poor? Yes. Is if unfair whom not cheating? Yes. Is it the reality that we live in? That is also yes. Is some crafting skills useless and needs a rework? Yes

 

Honestly, no one should be able to create and mods, armor. Do you want gear? Do the content. But you guys insisted that crafter (a.k.a people who macro / bots/cheat) to able to craft the BiS gear in the game. (you can't btw except armoring). So this is the price, and removing cq mats to craft blue gear was the right choice. Now it's balanced and fine. You want to craft BiS and make millions? You need to grind, I mean sorry macro longer.

 

What you are describing is automation - a.k.a. botting, not using a simple macro.

 

No simple macro is going to cycle through characters, logging them on and off, all the while running mission and crafting items - that is going to take a bit more sophistication using some sort of automation software and custom scripting.

 

Even then, using such automation running missions or crafting items is not going to create credits as running missions and crafting items are a net credit loss (before selling to other players which DOES NOT create credits).

 

That isn't to say there are no players using automation / bots, I'm sure there are, especially given how poorly Bioware has done in the past in detecting and banning bots, but at this point I'm not sure what they would bot in order to generate any significant amounts of credits.

 

Now in the past (even within the last expansion or two) there have many easy to bot things in game that did generate significant credits, such as slicing nodes on Yavin 4, slicing missions (when they were credit positive), TH missions (when they were credit positive), etc.

 

But most if not all of this has been nerfed or adjusted such that automation does not generate significant credits.

 

Anyways, crafters are not using any kind of automation, bot, or macro any more than the average player participating in any other aspect of the game is using automation, bots, or macros.

 

Besides, most of the inflation is due to the sheer ineptitude of Bioware - including allowing massive exploits to persist for months, failure to remove exploited credits, and even non exploitative things like the excessive heroic payouts post 4.0 - especially the bonuses when they were paying out daily and multiplicative based on the number of members in a group.

Edited December 16, 2019 by DawnAskham

You are the one who doesn't understand. This game has no macro detection whatsoever. Do you know what crafter does? Writes a simple click macro, for multiple toons, logging in and out, making millions overnight via mats, craftable gear, cq rewards etc. Many economies breaking bugs + this macro issue, left this game economy in desperate need of credit sink. [...]

If this were true GTN prices would be barely above cost of materials... and completely flooded. the fact that they aren't demostrates that this is nothing but a boogeyman arguments that has nothing to do with anything.

Lets not forget how they nicely added a cartel market item to get companions to level 50 after making crafting super tedious. In my opinion that is pay to win was well. My sub feels very pointless as this game always finds a way for me to shell out more money to it like that. I am so ready to give up on this studio man. 90% of my friends now don't even play to stay relevant and geared they just buy credits or cartel market items to sell. Because why would you craft armorings when you can just sell a master datacron for 50mil. Or get 200 mil for the cost of 2 months of sub. This studio really doesn't care about us as a community. They pretend to tout transparency but don't even have CM comment on anything that has heavy criticism. But i will admit its hard for me to let go of a game I am emotionally invested in. I have made my life long friends on here that i know in person. I met GF on this game as well. But all that emotion and love for the game since launch as a sub means nothing to these people working here. They just look for the next way to make their next buck and thats it. Nothing more nothing less. We are a dollar sign to the people not just in the office up top but the ones on the ground who pretend to be like us. This crafting update was my hope to make armorings with amp i actually need as I have had rng **** me royally over and over and over and over again. And now you have just beat me down, again. I have been a loyal supporter and fan for this game even basically running my own ad campaigns for it on any community i could only to be shoveled this.

 

Bioware and all of you working on this game. You are cold, heartless people. You are in business because of us. When everyone bailed in 2012 alot of stayed with you because we believed you can give us a fun experience we believed in your game. And as all my friends have now started to play other games and move on from tor, I feel like I am left holding a bag. I am done promoting this game in friend circles, I am done pretending like everything is alright with this game, I am done pretending like competent people are behind the development cycle. And since they are cold and heartless corporate hacks who run this, they won't even read this.

 

For those on this forum, I am sorry for the rant. But you guys all deserve better then this. I love this community and the people in it. And I love star wars. I am just so frustrated with this studio and their changes. I am not sure where my sub will land in the coming month but you guys are the ones who made this ride worthwhile. And for that I thank you. But I clearly have alot of emotional investment here as many do in mmo's they spent nearly a decade playing.

You are the one who doesn't understand. This game has no macro detection whatsoever. Do you know what crafter does? Writes a simple click macro, for multiple toons, logging in and out, making millions overnight via mats, craftable gear, cq rewards etc. Many economies breaking bugs + this macro issue, left this game economy in desperate need of credit sink. Now a cost for any item in the game is being calculated by macro time, not by playtime.

 

Is it hurting the poor? Yes. Is if unfair whom not cheating? Yes. Is it the reality that we live in? That is also yes. Is some crafting skills useless and needs a rework? Yes

 

Honestly, no one should be able to create and mods, armor. Do you want gear? Do the content. But you guys insisted that crafter (a.k.a people who macro / bots/cheat) to able to craft the BiS gear in the game. (you can't btw except armoring). So this is the price, and removing cq mats to craft blue gear was the right choice. Now it's balanced and fine. You want to craft BiS and make millions? You need to grind, I mean sorry macro longer.

 

Nice little bit of useless information, but it does not change the fact that you sound sophomoric. The vast majority of crafters do not use macro's (what you really mean is bots, but not knowing what you are talking about is par for the course at this point) for many reasons, but you only want to focus on your one irrelevant point instead of understanding the bigger issue, but lets use your little example to establish just how poorly formed your position really is.

 

The most viable use for a bot in SWTOR is running crew skill missions. You can set them up to do more I'm sure, but there is no point because of how things are setup for crafting. Now you complain about macro players, so who do you think will profit most from the amount of mats required to make a single item? Selling mats is one of the most profitable uses of a bot so the changes only encourge them. So your argument should be that the changes in crafting will only make the use of bots more prevalent as the amount of mats required to make something have gone through the roof.

 

The fact that you don't understand this only further proves my point about how poorly informed you are on this topic.

Edited December 19, 2019 by laiboch