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[Class Questions] Let's Start Fresh: 3 Questions to Devs RE: Powertechs

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > Classes > Vanguard / Powertech
[Class Questions] Let's Start Fresh: 3 Questions to Devs RE: Powertechs

af_raptura's Avatar


af_raptura
07.26.2013 , 04:01 PM | #11
FeralPug raises a good point with the way that the questions should be phrased. I'll give it a try.

DPS side: Since powertechs are a short range/melee class, what would you folks say are the strengths/weaknesses of the class in a competitive pvp setting compared to similar classes (marauders, juggernauts, assassins, and operatives)? Do you folks currently believe that those strengths are sufficiently unique and potent to encourage teams to have a dps powertech in a ranked warzone over another melee dps? As for the weaknesses, what are the design decisions behind having these particular shortcommings and do you folks believe that they are not too detrimental to overall gameplay of the class?

I might post a tanking question, but I am much less familiar with PT tanking in endgame warzones. Though I do like Mathemagica's post on question #6 for tanks.
PvE theorycrafting has really loosened their standards.
Quote: Originally Posted by karlwaite View Post
As for the skill changes to benefit pvp likes of the fly by damage reduction they suffered and reducing focused defence by 200% is a joke they are affecting pve to benefit pvp.

Ottoattack's Avatar


Ottoattack
07.26.2013 , 04:11 PM | #12
Congratulations for Jerc on becoming the class representative. I do have more than 3 questions so you pick the ones yous see as most valid.

Question 1, Pyro dps potential PvE wise:
Full pyro dps is generally not the way to go for good PvE dps. For example, all top PT/Vanguad dpsers out here http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=664980 are hybrids. Also, the top dpsers in PT/Vanguard on most boss fights on TOR are hybrids. Full pyro falls around 300 dps behind and PTs in general are behind 200-300 dps on average from top parsers. The question is, considering that pyro adds no utility to group, nor has good defensive capabilities (not that they matter much in raiding), why is full pyro far behind hybrids, AP and most classes considering that damage is all what the tree offers?

Question 2, Pyro dps potential PvP wise:
This builds on the question above. Beside loss on sustained damage, there was a large nerf in burst, that probably moved PT burst damage from top position to 7th or 8th among all classes. Combined with even weaker defensive capabilities than per-expansion, pyro PT performance is one of the worst in dps class trees. A former glass cannon is now a glass bow. Should not the class damage output be balanced with the class ability to mitigate damage and/or utility offered?

Question 3, Pyro IM:
Mentioned so many times. It does quiet reasonable damage, but costs a high amount of resource. Shouldn't this skill be close in resource cost to PT to affliction for sorc considering it does around the damage and for the most part does the same thing.

Question 4, Pyro Resource Management:
While is not an issue in PvP, in PvE you are at the mercy of PPA proc so much, that if you don't get it often you either overheat or lose a lot of damage potential. Are there any plans to make the resource management more consistent?

Question 5, AP Performance in PvP:
AP has reasonable survivablity, but most atks deal below 5K, when they critic. The class can't put much pressure on most targets to pose a threat. Any possibility to make the class have more burst?

Question 6, Shield Tech:
As mentioned before, while reasonable in all aspects, does not excel in any. Are there any plan to create a niche were shield tech can have lead (stronger taunts or guard, etc..).

Question 7, how does BW envision the class:
In the good old days, the class had 30m range on most atks, which later was nerfed to 10m but burst was buffed slightly, which transformed the class into glass cannon. With expansion, the class was granted more mobility (which was not really needed) while damage potential, wither sustained or burst was significantly nerfed. The class currently plays like a melee class, without the defensive capabilities to mitigate damage or the damage output to have an impact. The tank is second rated for the most part. Where does BW see the class excel and what is their vision for the class future?

Aetrus's Avatar


Aetrus
07.26.2013 , 06:15 PM | #13
My question would be to ask BW what role Pyrotech PTs are supposed to serve? If Pyro is a dot-based spec, why nerf our main dot's dmg by 50%? If Pyro is a burst spec, why nerf the burst on Railshot and TD dramatically? And since we're mostly melee, why do we have so few defensive CDs relative to other melee classes?

Zoom_VI's Avatar


Zoom_VI
07.26.2013 , 07:20 PM | #14
For shield tech I would like to know if we could get a OS cd like jugs reflect or shadows resilience, I get a painful reminder of our lack of one when I get killed by HM Xeno's thermal tolerance at 11k a tick and that with reactive shield active, meanwhile the guardian and shadow tanks in my guild just lol at it their respective CDs, it would also be a huge boon in PvP as well.

Some very good ideas where proposed here. http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=653356
Crinn

Sanity is for the weak minded.

Brunner_Venda's Avatar


Brunner_Venda
07.27.2013 , 01:16 AM | #15
This here addressed just about every possible complaint I have about the class.

Damn well done sir!

Quote: Originally Posted by Ottoattack View Post
Congratulations for Jerc on becoming the class representative. I do have more than 3 questions so you pick the ones yous see as most valid.

Question 1, Pyro dps potential PvE wise:
Full pyro dps is generally not the way to go for good PvE dps. For example, all top PT/Vanguad dpsers out here http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=664980 are hybrids. Also, the top dpsers in PT/Vanguard on most boss fights on TOR are hybrids. Full pyro falls around 300 dps behind and PTs in general are behind 200-300 dps on average from top parsers. The question is, considering that pyro adds no utility to group, nor has good defensive capabilities (not that they matter much in raiding), why is full pyro far behind hybrids, AP and most classes considering that damage is all what the tree offers?

Question 2, Pyro dps potential PvP wise:
This builds on the question above. Beside loss on sustained damage, there was a large nerf in burst, that probably moved PT burst damage from top position to 7th or 8th among all classes. Combined with even weaker defensive capabilities than per-expansion, pyro PT performance is one of the worst in dps class trees. A former glass cannon is now a glass bow. Should not the class damage output be balanced with the class ability to mitigate damage and/or utility offered?

Question 3, Pyro IM:
Mentioned so many times. It does quiet reasonable damage, but costs a high amount of resource. Shouldn't this skill be close in resource cost to PT to affliction for sorc considering it does around the damage and for the most part does the same thing.

Question 4, Pyro Resource Management:
While is not an issue in PvP, in PvE you are at the mercy of PPA proc so much, that if you don't get it often you either overheat or lose a lot of damage potential. Are there any plans to make the resource management more consistent?

Question 5, AP Performance in PvP:
AP has reasonable survivablity, but most atks deal below 5K, when they critic. The class can't put much pressure on most targets to pose a threat. Any possibility to make the class have more burst?

Question 6, Shield Tech:
As mentioned before, while reasonable in all aspects, does not excel in any. Are there any plan to create a niche were shield tech can have lead (stronger taunts or guard, etc..).

Question 7, how does BW envision the class:
In the good old days, the class had 30m range on most atks, which later was nerfed to 10m but burst was buffed slightly, which transformed the class into glass cannon. With expansion, the class was granted more mobility (which was not really needed) while damage potential, wither sustained or burst was significantly nerfed. The class currently plays like a melee class, without the defensive capabilities to mitigate damage or the damage output to have an impact. The tank is second rated for the most part. Where does BW see the class excel and what is their vision for the class future?

Melon_Lord's Avatar


Melon_Lord
07.28.2013 , 06:08 AM | #16
I like the first few questions, but I think Pyro's big concern is the end tier talents being unappealing and not worth investment. Why put a point in TD when Retractable Blade costs 9 less than IM and does nearly a thousand more damage in a shorter time frame, in addition to making everything else you do 3% stronger? The bottom half of each DPS tree has more synergy with each other than their respective full tree and they support different cylinders, that alone shows how messed up the dps for PT is.

My simple question is, Are they going to make end tier talents more appealing and synergize properly with the tree so pure builds are able to out perform the 2/22/22 hybrid, or are they going to nerf hybrid without buffing the top end and thus pushing the DPS of pure PT builds even further in the trash?
The Bastion - Baroness Stryvah

iDraxter's Avatar


iDraxter
07.28.2013 , 08:03 AM | #17
Congratz Jerc and good luck, I`m hoping we`ll get some better days again
Quote: Originally Posted by Ottoattack View Post

Question 7, how does BW envision the class:
In the good old days, the class had 30m range on most atks, which later was nerfed to 10m but burst was buffed slightly, which transformed the class into glass cannon. With expansion, the class was granted more mobility (which was not really needed) while damage potential, wither sustained or burst was significantly nerfed. The class currently plays like a melee class, without the defensive capabilities to mitigate damage or the damage output to have an impact. The tank is second rated for the most part. Where does BW see the class excel and what is their vision for the class future?
I think the same way also rework or get ride off , seriously i`m very curious what are their thought process behind the following:
1)Degauss(seriously anybody insane on wasting points in this in any scenario? and its pretty much TOP TIER garbage!! We already got hydrolic overrides
2)Automated defenses is incredibly bad, oh why thank you for keeping me in Execute range of all the real dps classes, great defensive ability, again top tier omg. This is supposed to be our only defensive ability in the tree it still does nothing if i`m not under 30% hp and if am under 30% it does not save me from anything
3)Volatile Igniter seriously why does this even exist what s the synergy with what? dot up to 5 ppl for what? some fluff dmg to see at the end a big dmg number but we didn`t actually kill or presure anybody and I`m already Flame bursting my single target so the CGC is already on the guy i`m trying to burn down

Brunner_Venda's Avatar


Brunner_Venda
07.28.2013 , 11:31 AM | #18
^^^^ I have to agree 100% with this post.

The top tree of pyro is so laughably bad, that taking tier one and two skills from the other two trees gives better DPS and survivability. The guy who designed this should be fired. Seriously, clean out your desk. You are a failure.

Pyro/assault and AP/tactics are so laughably bad, that hardly anyone plays vanguard. That class had problems electing a rep because most of the people nominated declined or dont play anymore. If you read the VG responses to Musco, nearly all of them are hostile.

This is what happens when you jack up a class, and leave it in ruin for over six months. Idiots. Why do we still play? Bioware is lucky that Disney hasn't come out with any new Star Wars games outside of Club Penguin.

Rylorn's Avatar


Rylorn
07.28.2013 , 07:37 PM | #19
(Critical rating)
1. One concern we have is that critical rating, an important stat for classes without auto-crits, is not balanced with other stats. Most end game players seem to be gearing for power and surge. Is there any chance critical rating will receive a formula adjustment? Can you give us an idea of the breakdown of Conqueror enhancements that have been purchased since 2.0 and what secondary stats players are favoring?

(Ranked representation)
2. One concern we have. is how desirable we are to ranked teams. Are Powertechs underrepresented than other advanced classes in ranked pvp, what is the average # of PTs per ranked match compared to other ACs?

(Defensive)
3. Lastly, we are concerned defensive cooldowns we have don't compare to other classes, especially melee. Kolto overload doesn't scale well in situations where we take huge damage. The Pyro shield ability isn't threatening enough to deter players from attacking us. In addition, having high armor doesn't feel like much of an advantage, with so many skills bypassing armor. What do Powertechs have to look forward to in terms of our defensive options?



My strategy is to state our concern, then explain some of the reasons why, and then ask our question. I want to focus specific things, but regarding that specific option, give them enough insight to be able to give us a good answer. I think we need to target underlying issues of why we are broken, and I think these 3 are the most important.

Also, I want to help establish that we are a weak class right now and need help. Is there anyone here that thinks we aren't near the very bottom?
A long time ago in an MMO far,
far away. . .


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Jakev-'s Avatar


Jakev-
07.28.2013 , 11:34 PM | #20
Fix pyro burst

/thread
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