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Flight School

nyghtrunner's Avatar

02.18.2014 , 04:41 PM | #1
So after trolling the forums a bit recently in here, and trying to get an idea of some of the issues people are having with GSF, along with my own observations from playing, there's something I'm hoping BioWare will look into that might help mitigate some of the issues that people are having.

The staggered release for GSF made sure that the subscribers that like to play simply have a LOT more experience than the f2p or preferred person going in, and usually better upgrades (I'm all for subs getting perks that others don't, but we already got earlier access and get additional fleet/ship req and the 3rd ship to start). And as a result, the people who have been playing together for a while are starting to just roll through all the newer players coming in in a way that isn't either fair or fun to some eyes. I've always been a "take your lumps and learn" kind of person with games and such, but not all people are like that. If they go into a match and get 0 kills, 2 assists, and 10 deaths, multiple matches in a row, they bail on it, or at the least, we start seeing the "bail on premades" threads pop up.

There are a few people I run with fairly regularly who are wanting to learn more, and trying to, but outside of experience in a match, there's not really too much to teach them, unless they can find streams, watch them, and learn that way. But it's frustrating sometimes, because I can see some of what they're doing during a match, and see why it might be "wrong" or why they're getting lit up from behind or whatever the case may be. But it's in the middle of a match, and I can't "show" them.

So it's got me thinking... In the ground game, in most areas, you can challenge someone to a duel. Friendly or not, it's a way for someone to sharpen PVP skills without having to go into an actual PVP match.

Why not do something like this for GSF? It would be AMAZING if I could take some of the people wanting to learn into a 1v1 PVP environment, not to humiliate them, but to teach them with 0 pressure. You could start doing things like "follow the leader" or have sessions where theoretical player B can try to keep me from getting a missile lock on them without blowing up in a panic, etc. Just to get them experience, and a feel for maneuvers at high speeds with objects around them.

The tutorials are fine for learning how to maneuver in a very basic way, or how to fire your blasters, but if you're in a dogfight, the skillset needed is way beyond basic, especially if you have an "ace" on you. And computer controlled pilots simply won't give you the skills you need to survive in real PVP environment.

So simply from the perspective of being able to help out clan mates or friends who might want to get into GSF but are intimidated by the sharks in the pool, it would be a great way to let them get their feet wet with no real competition, and could certainly serve as a sort of "flight school". I don't want req for this, that's what the actual matches are for, but we'd also have the added benefit of being able to challenge those "aces" to 1v1 deathmatches just to see who the better pilot actually is (Grunty! Where are you?!)!

You could use the tutorial maps, or the TDM or even domination maps. In some ways, the more space to fly in, the better, so I'm certainly not advocating for a series of 1v1 maps, just a way to fire up some kind of instance with the 2 players on opposing teams (maybe make it possible to do 2v2?), and let them use the space how they wanted. Either as a real challenge, or flight school.

There are so many things that the tutorials CAN'T teach you that other pilots could, and so many things that have to be seen because it's hard or impossible to explain. Having a system like this in place could, with an active enough community, give lots of people a much better experience than going in and getting rolled in a solo pug queue when you come up against a set of really good pilots with voice options.

It also seems like the sort of thing that could be done with a minimal code change, since the major systems should already be in place, you'd just need a way to spawn an instance for the 2 or so players. It might even be enough to just have an option clicking on their portrait, like the "Challenge to Duel" we currently have. Beyond that, it's just spawning an instance that's closed to all but the 2 players involved, just split them so they're on opposing "teams".

I'll also note that it would be a GREAT environment for testing things that might be bugs, and being able to get a reliable set of steps to reproduce said bugs (like testing to see if the rail sentries actually do ignore LOS for shooting at a target, as I currently believe they do. At least, once they've started charging the shot.).
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SithAceI's Avatar

02.18.2014 , 04:58 PM | #2
Great post!!!

Maybe the ability to host a match would suffice for this idea. I personally have helped a lot of people get up to speed in this way on another game( won't say which but it has something to do with Tom Clancy and flying hehe). But hosting was an option in said game. I have know idea how this would work or if it is even possible. That being said hey Dev's how about the ability to host like the ability to duel?

Hell it might even get some premades out of general que to fight other groups for a challenge!
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Zharik's Avatar

02.18.2014 , 06:10 PM | #3
This has been mentioned several times (heck a few times by me specifically) already, with ZERO Dev response.
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Applejacxs's Avatar

02.18.2014 , 06:24 PM | #4
How about outlaw den style area were you can spawn in one of your ships. I dont know if you could do same factions pvp but certainly you could do pub vs imp. You could call it the Smugglers path or something.

dancezwithnubz's Avatar

02.18.2014 , 06:32 PM | #5

some kind of multiplayer tutorial would be a boon for helping nubs.

(pst: built-in VOIP would also be a boon)

Jandi's Avatar

02.18.2014 , 06:56 PM | #6
Quote: Originally Posted by dancezwithnubz View Post

some kind of multiplayer tutorial would be a boon for helping nubs.

(pst: built-in VOIP would also be a boon)
Really, let's be honest here, no amount of tutorials will help you grasp how to fight other players, how to counter the usual tricks, how to react in the best way to situations etc.

You just need to learn from getting your teeth kincked in instead of getting angry that you didn't get a medal for participating. Like I said in another thread, I started GSF when the F2P players were included, even though I had the sub early acces and now I'm always in the top 3, more often than not first on the scoreboard with a Pike as it's the only craft I fly and it's nowhere near mastered as I haven't spent CC to convert req.

The best advice I, personally, can give is to try out the ships, don't fly the ones you think are "OP", pick one you actually enjoy flying and stick with it. You'll get good at it eventually.

Ramalina's Avatar

02.18.2014 , 07:46 PM | #7
Quote: Originally Posted by Zharik View Post
This has been mentioned several times (heck a few times by me specifically) already, with ZERO Dev response.

Instanced duel or better tutorials would be tremendously useful from a player community standpoint.

If they're counting pennies on the electric bills for the servers though, they might not want to run starship battles with 2 people instead of 16-24 people.

Cartel credit GSF dueling passes maybe? If they want to find a way to keep the lights on.
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Verain's Avatar

02.18.2014 , 07:53 PM | #8
I think at a minimum the following things need to happen:

1- An ability to enter the existing four maps alone or with a couple friends.
2- Some kind of other stuff at the edges of the existing training maps- if nothing else, an infinite hit point target dummy, a laser that shoots, and a drone that tries to missile lock you (obviously the hazards would be in a marked area).

Onodrain's Avatar

02.19.2014 , 10:13 AM | #9
I think it is a great idea!

I find it funny though when newbie fliers say they did not go thru the tutorial. Then you see them stuck at the capital ship or they run into the capital ship at the start of the match.

It would help tremendously if your HUD included green triangles around your target area, showing your team mates, in addition to the red ones and the A.B C sat indicators. This would help with the "getting used to the 3D space" issue of new pilots. At least they would have an easier time finding their group.

There is a lot to learn about GSF. While there is a lot of data on the internet, there is not an outstanding collection of information in an easy to read and digest format. I have culled thru much of it and found what I need to be a better pilot. That and I pay attention during matches and learn.

Just the basics about the Hanger is a lot of information for a new player. Knowing which load outs are better for your play style and which crew members are best to choose.

Then understanding hot keys.

F1 blaster priority
F2 shield priority
F3 engine priority
F4 normal
C quick check your target. While C is held down, you will look at your target rather than in front of your ship
E target the enemy under your reticle
<tab> target closest enemy within 1500 clicks
R target the last enemy to fire upon you

You can hit a priority key (F1-F4) while coming out of hyperspace in the beginning of the match. You do not have to wait until the hyperspace graphics are complete. Once you are out of hyperspace, you can barrel role forward or use thrusters.

When you hit barrel role or other engine propulsion effect, you have to re engage your thrusters if you are holding down your <space> bar.

Sensor range increase does not help in locating dampened gunships. With or without sensor range increases, you will see them at around 1500 clicks.

Sensor range increase will help you stay in range of satellites for capturing them. Technically, this seems to be the sensor focus range, but it is part of the sensor range increase choice. Just by choosing the crew member who increases your sensor focus range, you will have a noticeable effect on your satellite capture range.

Understanding firing arc, evasion, damage reduction, hull strength, chance to hit, chance to crit, crit multiplier, weapon cool down, weapon reload, Damage per Second versus Damage per Hit, range vs damage vs frequency increases, primary versus secondary weapons, shield recharge delay, shield recharge rate, etc is a lot of numbers and info to try and crunch.

For instance, damage reduction is very helpful against non-upgraded ships and turrets. Many upgraded ships bypass damage reduction, making it ineffective against most veteran pilots.

Chance to hit minus evasion is your chance to land a direct fire weapon. I don't think evasion helps with missile lock. But some missiles are slow and can be outrun.

Chance to hit with a direct fire weapon is based on range, weapon stats, and firing arc degree off center. The closer something is to the center of your firing arc, the greater the chance you have to hit it. So when I take shots at fast moving ships with my rail gun, if they are 5 degrees off center, I get a 20% tracking penalty to my hit chance. So taking the crewmate who gives 6% better chance to hit helps a lot in alleviating the tracking penalty with direct fire weapons.

okiobe's Avatar

02.19.2014 , 12:24 PM | #10
Maybe it's an MMO thing but I don't know why they don't just implement a custom game option. There would be no rewards for playing in one but people could organize their own matches for competition or training purposes. It seems as if every game that has been played competitively (League of Legends, Halo, CS, Starcraft, etc) has had a custom game option. What is so bad about it here that they don't consider implementing it?

EDIT: If it wasn't clear, I'm agreeing with the OP
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