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Sin PVP - need some help.


BonnerFett

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Hey All,

 

Just started to make my Assassin my main for pvp. I watched Krea's guide on youtube. It's really great, but does the recent nerfs to the Death Knell set effect anything in this guide?

 

What talents do you guys recommend for PVP - specifically solo ranked?

 

Any tips or tricks are much appreciated!

 

Thanks all!

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Hey All,

 

Just started to make my Assassin my main for pvp. I watched Krea's guide on youtube. It's really great, but does the recent nerfs to the Death Knell set effect anything in this guide?

 

What talents do you guys recommend for PVP - specifically solo ranked?

 

Any tips or tricks are much appreciated!

 

Thanks all!

 

Yes, the Nerfs do change things from the guide. First, you don’t want to doing maul spam.

 

Maybe Kre’a can do an update or post some info here to help explain the differences better than me.

Edited by TrixxieTriss
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Here are the two best utility builds which you can experiment with and see which you like more:

 

https://imgur.com/a/nHUwOaT

 

You either want the phantom stride rootbreaker + 25% force speed DR (dont rely on this to survive), or an instant lift which is very useful for peeling, stunlocking in a pinch or setting up swaps. I tend to favor the rootbreaker personally but you should experiment and see which you have most success with.

 

General tips: Don't underestimate how powerful your knockback root is for kiting and peeling, you can set up some great knocks by paying attention to level differences or using LoS to force them to come closer to the edge on some maps.

 

Take advantage of your cc immunity dcds in the opener to at least get your duplicity buff up before they have a chance to do any meaningful damage and stun you. If you know you're gonna be focused then try to cc someone before your CC immunity runs out and hide behind an object (you can use a knock before if you want to gauge their focus or save it for when they attempt to close the distance) so you guaranteed wont be eating full burst from more than one or two people for the first stun. You can consider vanishing immediately after your CC immunity runs out in 4dps games if the enemy team have a particularly good composition for killing assassins and you have little faith in your team to help you survive. Just engage again after the first whitebar runs out on your first target so you dont force your team into a 3v4 for too long.

 

Focus target modifier is ridiculously useful for CCing and interrupting off-targets, whether it be an arsenal merc or enemy healer.

 

Use your aoe taunt as soon as someone in your team eats a hardstun in the opener.

Edited by Sharkii_boy
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Great guide. I have been playing with a shadow on SS and my assassin on SF. I have been running with two cloaks but had no clue that u could swap tacticals while in stealth. A quick swap to life warden, as u suggested, could be a game changer for me.

 

Also, a question...….when I stealth during combat, so save my butt, I always seem to pop out. Is there a trick to prevent this from happening?

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Great guide. I have been playing with a shadow on SS and my assassin on SF. I have been running with two cloaks but had no clue that u could swap tacticals while in stealth. A quick swap to life warden, as u suggested, could be a game changer for me.

 

Also, a question...….when I stealth during combat, so save my butt, I always seem to pop out. Is there a trick to prevent this from happening?

 

Make sure you're taking the utility that gives you Shroud/Resilience upon Vanishing out. If you have that utility, that means that you are being pulled out by either:

 

1) Still having your guard on a friendly player

 

2) Getting hit with an AoE white damage effect (melee/ranged damage)

 

That's the only way to get popped out of stealth as a sin, so we're talking things like Sniper's AoE, Merc's AoE, Marauder and Juggernaut's Mad Dash or AoE melee ability, Assassin's Lacerate, stuff like that.

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Make sure you're taking the utility that gives you Shroud/Resilience upon Vanishing out. If you have that utility, that means that you are being pulled out by either:

 

1) Still having your guard on a friendly player

 

2) Getting hit with an AoE white damage effect (melee/ranged damage)

 

That's the only way to get popped out of stealth as a sin, so we're talking things like Sniper's AoE, Merc's AoE, Marauder and Juggernaut's Mad Dash or AoE melee ability, Assassin's Lacerate, stuff like that.

 

Thanks you!

 

I will make sure I have that utility and will watch for the AOE. I was unaware of that.

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Make sure you're taking the utility that gives you Shroud/Resilience upon Vanishing out. If you have that utility, that means that you are being pulled out by either:

 

1) Still having your guard on a friendly player

 

2) Getting hit with an AoE white damage effect (melee/ranged damage)

 

That's the only way to get popped out of stealth as a sin, so we're talking things like Sniper's AoE, Merc's AoE, Marauder and Juggernaut's Mad Dash or AoE melee ability, Assassin's Lacerate, stuff like that.

 

 

thermal detenator will take a sin out of stealth when it explodes..storm watch tactical will take sin out of stealth..

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thermal detenator will take a sin out of stealth when it explodes..storm watch tactical will take sin out of stealth..

 

If you have both shroud on vanish and extended shroud duration by 2 seconds, thermal det will not take you out upon explosion, just put you in combat.

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Can you expand. I have not gotten into ranked yet, but I do just fine in regular WZ/Arena.

 

I'm certainly not a great player, but from what I've seen Hatred has very little pressure in ranked when compared to deception. In regs you can dot everything up and do some decent damage, but you just don't have the pressure to score a kill in ranked. Just my opinion.... Take it for what it's worth.

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Can you expand. I have not gotten into ranked yet, but I do just fine in regular WZ/Arena.

 

Survivability - Hatred has considerably lower DR than Deception. This means that you will take much more damage in the same time frame than someone under similar conditions who are playing Deception. Hatred's selling point is supposed to be that you can heal for damage you deal, but currently, you can't heal for a high enough value to mitigate enough of the damage you're taking.

 

Damage - Hatred's damage is similar to Deception's now that Death Knell has been nerfed, however the survivability is worse, so you'll spend more time running away and kiting to survive, which means less time is spent doing damage.

 

Control - Hatred lacks the control aspect that Deception has. Because you can't control players as often (every 15 seconds as deception) they can do more damage to you, once again, hurting your damage output.

 

Overall, its just a flimsy spec.

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I'm certainly not a great player, but from what I've seen Hatred has very little pressure in ranked when compared to deception. In regs you can dot everything up and do some decent damage, but you just don't have the pressure to score a kill in ranked. Just my opinion.... Take it for what it's worth.

 

Guess I will have to see for myself.

 

In regs I can burst really hard as hatred with 30% Deth Knell, quick escalation, overcharged saber. 3+ consecutive Leeching strikes and assassinate with ticking overcharged DoTs hurts.

 

The challenge I can see is getting Death knell and DoTs up before you get stun locked or peeled. Why I spec for mobility not CC as hatred. Resolve kicks in with 4 people CCing anyway. Why waste utilities on abilities that build resolve quicker.

 

Again. Haven't done ranked yet so we will see.

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Survivability - Hatred has considerably lower DR than Deception. This means that you will take much more damage in the same time frame than someone under similar conditions who are playing Deception. Hatred's selling point is supposed to be that you can heal for damage you deal, but currently, you can't heal for a high enough value to mitigate enough of the damage you're taking.

 

Damage - Hatred's damage is similar to Deception's now that Death Knell has been nerfed, however the survivability is worse, so you'll spend more time running away and kiting to survive, which means less time is spent doing damage.

 

Control - Hatred lacks the control aspect that Deception has. Because you can't control players as often (every 15 seconds as deception) they can do more damage to you, once again, hurting your damage output.

 

Overall, its just a flimsy spec.

 

Must have been posting at the same time. Thanks for your insight.

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Guess I will have to see for myself.

 

In regs I can burst really hard as hatred with 30% Deth Knell, quick escalation, overcharged saber. 3+ consecutive Leeching strikes and assassinate with ticking overcharged DoTs hurts.

 

The challenge I can see is getting Death knell and DoTs up before you get stun locked or peeled. Why I spec for mobility not CC as hatred. Resolve kicks in with 4 people CCing anyway. Why waste utilities on abilities that build resolve quicker.

 

Again. Haven't done ranked yet so we will see.

 

How has hatred been working for you? Have you tried it in ranked yet?

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If you guys really wana see how bad hatred is, go ahead and queue up now in the preaseason, since there's no drawbacks to doing so.

 

The moment that people find out you are hatred, you will immediately be the target of the entire enemy team and will be squished flat, almost immediately. The spec takes a bit more than 25% more damage than it's Deception counter part due to a lack of certain DR passives, as it is. It's just a terrible mess of a spec defensively and only excels when you aren't being focused.

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If you guys really wana see how bad hatred is, go ahead and queue up now in the preaseason, since there's no drawbacks to doing so.

 

The moment that people find out you are hatred, you will immediately be the target of the entire enemy team and will be squished flat, almost immediately. The spec takes a bit more than 25% more damage than it's Deception counter part due to a lack of certain DR passives, as it is. It's just a terrible mess of a spec defensively and only excels when you aren't being focused.

 

I will never understand why they balance so poorly... Like what does hatred have over deception that it has to take 25% more damage ? It's nothing compared to how it was in it's glory days.

 

If a player can see this, why doesn't a dev see it and do something about it ? Makes no sense.

 

If hatred was some super killer spec that melts the enemy team easily, I would say that the 25% extra damage taken is justified, but it's not the case.. far from it in fact.

 

I play Hatred since I read your guide by the way. ;)

Edited by DavidAtkinson
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I will never understand why they balance so poorly... Like what does hatred have over deception that it has to take 25% more damage ? It's nothing compared to how it was in it's glory days.

 

If a player can see this, why doesn't a dev see it and do something about it ? Makes no sense.

 

If hatred was some super killer spec that melts the enemy team easily, I would say that the 25% extra damage taken is justified, but it's not the case.. far from it in fact.

 

I play Hatred since I read your guide by the way. ;)

 

You can say the exact same thing about lightning vs madness. It is quite strange that in both cases the burst spec is more durable and can reliably output more damage. Prior to 6.0, madness at least did more sustained damage than lightning, but that is no longer the case.

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If you guys really wana see how bad hatred is, go ahead and queue up now in the preaseason, since there's no drawbacks to doing so.

 

The moment that people find out you are hatred, you will immediately be the target of the entire enemy team and will be squished flat, almost immediately. The spec takes a bit more than 25% more damage than it's Deception counter part due to a lack of certain DR passives, as it is. It's just a terrible mess of a spec defensively and only excels when you aren't being focused.

 

I've tried but I guess my server is dead. They really haven't set up cross server pvp yet? ***.

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If you guys really wana see how bad hatred is, go ahead and queue up now in the preaseason, since there's no drawbacks to doing so.

 

The moment that people find out you are hatred, you will immediately be the target of the entire enemy team and will be squished flat, almost immediately. The spec takes a bit more than 25% more damage than it's Deception counter part due to a lack of certain DR passives, as it is. It's just a terrible mess of a spec defensively and only excels when you aren't being focused.

 

Ouch, that sounds painful.

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