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Carnage Mara - PVP

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > PvP
Carnage Mara - PVP

BonnerFett's Avatar


BonnerFett
11.23.2020 , 04:48 PM | #1
Hey all,

Just resubbed. Love the speed and playstyle of Carnage Mara. How does it do in pvp? Any tips on build, utilites, amps, etc...

Thank you!

TrixxieTriss's Avatar


TrixxieTriss
11.23.2020 , 05:28 PM | #2
Quote: Originally Posted by BonnerFett View Post
Hey all,

Just resubbed. Love the speed and playstyle of Carnage Mara. How does it do in pvp? Any tips on build, utilites, amps, etc...

Thank you!
Carnage has become a bit more clunky and took a dps Nerf a while back. If you plan on doing ranked, the meta is Fury. Here is the info from the theory discord. (It maybe out of date cause I got booted from it months ago).

Set bonus - Descend of the Fearless; one piece Amplified Champion

Tactical - Cauterized Conary

Amplifier - Armor Penetration or weapon expertise. There was a bit of a debate about this and I believe weapon expertise came out on top. But I’ve seen no definitive numbers

Stats
• Alacrity:
>= 1213, 1.4 GCD *without* Guild Perk
>= 1895, 1.3 GCD *with* Guild Perk
• Accuracy:
>= 1590 (for pve) You only need 105% for pvp
• Critical: remaining tertiary stats

This might also help with what gear to keep and what to destroy

Quote:
For people needing a shortlist of what to keep and what to sell/delete:

Mods
-
Lethal R-2 = R-3 = R-5

Enhancements
-
Accuracy:
- Uncapped, Initiative R-18/19
- Capped, Proficient R-1

Alacrity:
- Uncapped, Nimble R-12 though R-20 (NOT 17) and Savant R-3
- Capped, Savant R-1
**ALACRITY NOTES:**
-Baseline needs: R-14/18/19/20
-Nimble R-15/16 and Savant R-3 **specific to Carnage and Arsenal**.
-Nimble R-12/13 **specific to Healers**.

Crit:
- Adept 80, R-18/19
- Efficient R-1

Barrage/Discipline/Studious you can just delete outright.
Sav/Prof/Eff are for Capped Content sets.

BonnerFett's Avatar


BonnerFett
11.23.2020 , 05:46 PM | #3
Quote: Originally Posted by TrixxieTriss View Post
Carnage has become a bit more clunky and took a dps Nerf a while back. If you plan on doing ranked, the meta is Fury. Here is the info from the theory discord. (It maybe out of date cause I got booted from it months ago).

Set bonus - Descend of the Fearless; one piece Amplified Champion

Tactical - Cauterized Conary

Amplifier - Armor Penetration or weapon expertise. There was a bit of a debate about this and I believe weapon expertise came out on top. But I’ve seen no definitive numbers

Stats
• Alacrity:
>= 1213, 1.4 GCD *without* Guild Perk
>= 1895, 1.3 GCD *with* Guild Perk
• Accuracy:
>= 1590 (for pve) You only need 105% for pvp
• Critical: remaining tertiary stats

This might also help with what gear to keep and what to destroy
Very helpful post. Thank you. Bummer to hear that Carnage is bad.... Such a bummer because it's by far more fun (at least IMO).

KumbayaGOD's Avatar


KumbayaGOD
11.23.2020 , 09:34 PM | #4
for the carnage only 2 tactical that i can think which is fanged god form or defel splice
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Csjbo's Avatar


Csjbo
11.23.2020 , 09:56 PM | #5
To answer your first question, Carnage is rather underwhelming in PVP as it's burst, while serviceable is not on par with other burst specs like AP PT, MM Sniper or Conc Op which is rather unfortunate since Carnage is all burst, no sustain, no DOTs or AOE cleave that would make the spec more flexible. In solos the lack of CC immunity make it much easier to control than Fury which makes survivability much more difficult as you cannot chain CC immunities of Gravity Vortex and Blood Ward during your Saber Ward like Fury can so your Saber Ward can get hard countered. When it comes to Group Ranked, Carnage is mostly irrelevant because when evaluating comps, even when it's burst vs burst...if the other team is running AP PTs or MM Sniper...ceterus peribus (all other things remain equal including skill)....the Carnage will lose.

That being said, if you take the time to learn the spec, it can still be effective, especially in regular warzones, but just know that there is a ceiling.

In terms of build, most Carnage Maras I know run a high-crit build of at least 3k and try to have an alacrity of around 663, the number may seem low, but keep in mind that Carnage Maras have a lot of passive alacrity buffs so you should be able to maintain a 1.4 GCD timer throughout the match. You can acutually achieve a consistent 1.3 GCD though I forgot the number (around 2.3k I think, don't quote me on that though), however, I would never recommend players who are new to Carnage run high alacrity as they won't be able to stay on target consistent enough to make use of the high alacrity. Some Carnage maras will eschew accuracy completely or go with the 110% mark of 1590, but that is entirely up to you.

Utilities you want to center either around preventing your target from moving around too much so you can stay on them more since you don't have natural CC immunity or a second force leap.....so ravage root utilities or leap slows (1st bracket) or force choke CDR are useful. You can also run root breakers like expunging camouflage or the util that turns mad dash into a root breaker. Otherwise it's the standard, cloak of pain extension, DR, predation buffs and obfuscate buffs.

Since Carnage is almost exclusively white damage, you will want to use Weapon Expertise amps unless you are running the Addendu's Malevolence tactical...then you may want to run Armor Pen.

The best offensive tactical in slot is Fanged God Form as it makes resource management easier (to a lesser extent make you tankier as massacre spam increases defense) and on top of that it drastically increases the chance that your Ferocity window is filled with 2 crits. Prosecution is another choice, it makes Devalasting Blast affected by Furious Power.

Defensively, Defel Splice Genes (force camo refresh on predation use) will always be the top choice, plus if you run the camo cleanse util, you'll be able to cleanse way more often.
Shashara | Espallalda | Alvilan | Zas'arod | Tamzina
Jaltina | Scathach | Gamora | Ridiane

Nickodemous's Avatar


Nickodemous
11.24.2020 , 05:51 AM | #6
Welcome back Bonner!

I agree, carnage is wicked fun. Since it is all I play, I have found the class to be quite effective in both ranked and regs.

I run with both the fanged god form and defel splice genes. Which I choose, before each round, is determined by the classes on opposing team (first round) and whether or not I was the focus (second).

As far as amps, I run with weapon expertise, 2-3 armor pen, and one force sensitivity to boost devastating blast a bit.

As far as talents, the previous poster is correct. Use root talents and root breakers. There is a second leap talent though in third tree....make sure u claim it.....it wicked good against knock backs, op spins, and speed bursts.

Yes fury is the meta....but damn it is something boring to play. Carnage is all about timing, and constant pressure, and knowing when to bail.....that comes with practice.

They are healer and sniper killers and can be very effective against tanks and ops. Assassins/shadows are what you have to watch for, they can wreck you quick.
Tyranticus - Ty'zor - Maullin - Clandestu - Pepe'nero

The Elite Warlord Club - The PVP FAB FIVE

limenutpen's Avatar


limenutpen
11.26.2020 , 10:11 AM | #7
I miss Combat Sentinel. But I must admit Concentration (Fury) has been a surprise and is not so boring as I thought.
Actually energy management is not as easy and straight forward as Carnage IMO (I played Combat from 0 - 75 and only changed to Fury in the last month or so).

Still the way Carnage Combat is, how you build your burst and how rotation falls into place is near perfection.
If only it had the immunity... If only...

TrixxieTriss's Avatar


TrixxieTriss
11.26.2020 , 05:55 PM | #8
Quote: Originally Posted by limenutpen View Post
I miss Combat Sentinel. But I must admit Concentration (Fury) has been a surprise and is not so boring as I thought.
Actually energy management is not as easy and straight forward as Carnage IMO (I played Combat from 0 - 75 and only changed to Fury in the last month or so).

Still the way Carnage Combat is, how you build your burst and how rotation falls into place is near perfection.
If only it had the immunity... If only...
I find the energy management easier on fury. And you have a simpler priority system. It just takes a little bit of practice. I’m sure you’ll ease into quickly and see what I mean.

Nickodemous's Avatar


Nickodemous
11.27.2020 , 05:34 AM | #9
Quote: Originally Posted by limenutpen View Post
I miss Combat Sentinel. But I must admit Concentration (Fury) has been a surprise and is not so boring as I thought.
Actually energy management is not as easy and straight forward as Carnage IMO (I played Combat from 0 - 75 and only changed to Fury in the last month or so).

Still the way Carnage Combat is, how you build your burst and how rotation falls into place is near perfection.
If only it had the immunity... If only...
Carnage reminds me a lot of a dps guardian/jugg.....can pump some serious dmg if allowed. The difference is the ability to stealth out and knowing when it is appropriate to do so. Don't allow yourself to be put in a tunnel situation in which you experience a series of chain locks. Stealth and look for a single target away from the pack. Hit the target hard, then pred out unless no one comes to peal. Always look for straggler or a target with low hps. Playing carnage is similar to a real life predator in the wild, it preys on a target away from group or the weak (low hps).
Tyranticus - Ty'zor - Maullin - Clandestu - Pepe'nero

The Elite Warlord Club - The PVP FAB FIVE

limenutpen's Avatar


limenutpen
11.30.2020 , 03:43 AM | #10
No need for low HPS. I think I have pulled down 60/70% to nill of health with a single rotation in Combat, when the Crit Gods are on my side. Everyone remains surprised sometimes even me that really makes it special.