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Arsenal and Innovative Ordnance Mercenary/Gunnery and Assault Specialist Set Bonus Discussion


EricMusco

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Hey everyone,

 

We wanted to take a moment to reach out to the community to collect ideas on set bonuses. We are looking for opinions on current and previous set bonuses as well as concepts for future. This thread will cover Arsenal and Innovative Ordnance Mercenaries/Gunnery and Assault Specialist Commandos.

 

Note: Our intent is to have set bonuses not increase DPS by more than 5%. Please keep this in mind when posting your suggestions.

 

Current Level 60 Set Bonuses (for reference)

  • 2-Piece: Heatseeker Missile and Serrated Shot or Demolition Round and Serrated Bolt increase damage dealt by 2% for 15 seconds. Cannot occur more than once every 30 of seconds.
  • 4-Piece: Power Surge or Tech Override's cooldown is reduced by 5 seconds.
  • 6-Piece: Activating Unload and Blazing Bolts or Full Auto and Boltstorm will grant Eliminator's Critical Bonus making your next Heatseeker Missile and Mag Shot or Demolition Round and Mag Bolt critically hit. This effect can only occur once a minute.

Cheers, all!

The SWTOR Combat Team

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It is my opinion that the 4-piece bonus (reducing the cool down of Power Surge by 5 seconds) is pretty much worthless for me I never use this ability (for Arsenal or IO) as I have the talent point to use blazing bolts (unload) on the move. Plus heatseeker missile is pretty much an instant cast 50% of the time for me due to priming shot before hand. In my opinion, power surge should be replaced with thermal sensor overide cool down reduction for the 4 piece bonus. Edited by TheWookiee
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Hey everyone,

 

We wanted to take a moment to reach out to the community to collect ideas on set bonuses. We are looking for opinions on current and previous set bonuses as well as concepts for future. This thread will cover Arsenal and Innovative Ordnance Mercenaries/Gunnery and Assault Specialist Commandos.

 

Note: Our intent is to have set bonuses not increase DPS by more than 5%. Please keep this in mind when posting your suggestions.

 

Current Level 60 Set Bonuses (for reference)

  • 2-Piece: Heatseeker Missile and Serrated Shot or Demolition Round and Serrated Bolt increase damage dealt by 2% for 15 seconds. Cannot occur more than once every 30 of seconds.
  • 4-Piece: Power Surge or Tech Override's cooldown is reduced by 5 seconds.
  • 6-Piece: Activating Unload and Blazing Bolts or Full Auto and Boltstorm will grant Eliminator's Critical Bonus making your next Heatseeker Missile and Mag Shot or Demolition Round and Mag Bolt critically hit. This effect can only occur once a minute.

Cheers, all!

The SWTOR Combat Team

 

Just out of curiousity Eric, is this a one size fits all discussion on set bonuses, or can they be variable between PvP and PvE sets?

 

Simply asking, because what I would want for a PvP set bonus wouldn't reflect what I would want for a PvE set bonus.

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It is my opinion that the 4-piece bonus (reducing the cool down of Power Surge by 5 seconds) is pretty much worthless for me I never use this ability (for Arsenal or IO) as I have the talent point to use blazing bolts (unload) on the move. Plus heatseeker missile is pretty much an instant cast 50% of the time for me due to priming shot before hand. In my opinion, power surge should be replaced with thermal sensor overide cool down reduction for the 4 piece bonus.

 

While the 4 piece is kinda lack luster for PvP I use it all the time for PvE. Being able to instant cast Fusion missile followed by an instant TM when Priming Shot is on CD is nice. In arsenal my heat hardly ever gets pushed to the point where an extra 5 seconds off of a power surge CD would really be useful. I can however, see how it would be useful for IO.

 

The easiest route would probably just to increase the 2 set bonus to 3% for 15 seconds and drop the CD for the autocrit to 45 seconds instead of a minute.

 

But, seeing how we're talking about the merc/mando set bonus, is the 4 piece healer bonus working yet?

 

Last time I looked, it wasn't.

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While the 4 piece is kinda lack luster for PvP I use it all the time for PvE. Being able to instant cast Fusion missile followed by an instant TM when Priming Shot is on CD is nice. In arsenal my heat hardly ever gets pushed to the point where an extra 5 seconds off of a power surge CD would really be useful. I can however, see how it would be useful for IO.

 

The easiest route would probably just to increase the 2 set bonus to 3% for 15 seconds and drop the CD for the autocrit to 45 seconds instead of a minute.

 

But, seeing how we're talking about the merc/mando set bonus, is the 4 piece healer bonus working yet?

 

Last time I looked, it wasn't.

 

My deal with power surge is it has a 15 second cool down reduction in talent points. Another 5 off of that is very lackluster compared to a TSO reduciton of say 10 or 15 seconds. In AOE heavy fights on arsenal, I use TSO on cool down (Commanders, Malaphor, Sparky, Torque). Or any AOE heavy instance. I also look at the benefit for IO in getting an extra heat ramping phase in a 5 minute fight.

 

I am talking PvE btw. PvP set bonuses should remain separate from PvE.

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My deal with power surge is it has a 15 second cool down reduction in talent points. Another 5 off of that is very lackluster compared to a TSO reduciton of say 10 or 15 seconds. In AOE heavy fights on arsenal, I use TSO on cool down (Commanders, Malaphor, Sparky, Torque). Or any AOE heavy instance. I also look at the benefit for IO in getting an extra heat ramping phase in a 5 minute fight.

 

I am talking PvE btw. PvP set bonuses should remain separate from PvE.

 

You actually burn the targets down faster is you hit them as a single target and just use your AOE for the trash. If a merc/mando's AOE was as large as a sorc's or sniper's then the cost to benefit would tip the other way. But as it is, using your AOE to overheating, or near over heating, is just a waste on arsenal.

 

With PS having an even shorter CD your going to see much more of a DPS increase from the instance FMs and instant TMs with their procs since most fights end up being single target fights anyway and that is really where you want to see the increase.

 

However, as I said before, I can see the appeal of having a shorter TSO for IO since they have a much harder heat management system than arsenal.

 

Also, I agree, PvE and PvP set bonuses should be different.

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For me it would be to step away from auto crit procs on all the 6 piece bonuses across all disciplines its very boring and bland the same goes for the 2 piece bonus a simple 2% damage modifier is just as boring.

 

QFT. On a more related note is the merc auto crit still broken and giving them infinite auto crit heat seekers while the buff is active? I don't follow the merc threads enough to know if that had been fixed or not.

 

Again though can we not have the "2% more damage" and "auto crit this or that" with every class. It's not something you even pay attention to in pvp. I've never been mezzed or something and been like "aww man now im not going to get to use my 2% damage boost" IMO its a waste of a set bonus and just lazy in general.

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I dunno, some changes to the 2pc, and 4pc... I find them rather lackluster. Would change and re-order as such.

 

2-piece set bonus: Activating Priming Shot and Mag Shot and or Vortex Bolt and Mag Bolt will grant 1 stack of Supercharge. This effect can only occur once every 20 seconds.

 

4-piece set bonus: Activating Unload and Blazing Bolts or Full Auto and Boltstorm will grant Eliminator's Critical Bonus making your next Heatseeker Missile and Mag Shot or Demolition Round and Mag Bolt critically hit. This effect can only occur once a minute.

 

6-piece set bonus: Activating Supercharged Gas finishes the cooldown on Unload and Blazing Bolts and reduces the heat generated by the next Unload and Blazing Bolts by 4. Activating Supercharged Cell finishes the cooldown on Full Auto and Boltstorm and reduces the ammo cost of the next Full Auto and Boltstorm by 4.

Edited by azudelphi
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QFT. On a more related note is the merc auto crit still broken and giving them infinite auto crit heat seekers while the buff is active? I don't follow the merc threads enough to know if that had been fixed or not.

 

Again though can we not have the "2% more damage" and "auto crit this or that" with every class. It's not something you even pay attention to in pvp. I've never been mezzed or something and been like "aww man now im not going to get to use my 2% damage boost" IMO its a waste of a set bonus and just lazy in general.

 

It never gave them infinite autocrits. The 2% damage buff icon looks exactly the same as the autocrit icon. People just thought that the autocrit buff was broken because the other one remained up there longer.

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As dps commando PVE player i think that 4pc bonus is pretty useless tbh. What would i like to see is the 15s lower cd on recharge cells. Assault drains energy like mad and this would help more then 5s lower cd on tech override. 6pc bonus is also quite abusrd, in fight that last for 5 minutes it proc only 4 - 5 times.. How this should increase my dps in visible way? Why not change that to something realy usefull like increased damage from Heatseeker Missile and Mag Shot or Demolition Round and Mag Bolt to do 5 to 8% more damage. (depending on the test and math job). This would be something great that i belive all commando players would make happy

 

Oh and forgot, also i would love to see dot spread on assault plastique instead of 2 skills that sinks your energy.

Edited by Forren-Midosea
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If nothing else I'd like to see the 4 piece also reduce the cooldown of Concussion Missile. Power Surge is often used for instant CC, and it's inconvenient to have the cooldowns of the two abilities desynched by the set bonus. And to be honest the cooldown reduction could be increased further without breaking anything. Edited by diadox
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I m personally happy with 2 and 4 set bonus piece but 6 is a bit useless that is why i use old 2 set bonus( increase crit chance on grav round and charged bolts by 15%) , from this both specs profit , that is why i d recomend 2 and 4 set bonus to stay same and 6th set bonus auto crit be replaced by old 2 set bonus.
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It may sound selfish, but can we get a skill that has some heat reduction utility? I know in Arsenal it's not that bad, but in IO you have to be very smart with your heat management.

 

Maybe make it to where every full channel of Blazing Bolts/Unload makes your next Power Shot cost 1 heat. This effect can occur no more than once every 45 seconds.

 

Also, the 2% damage bonus does feel a bit lazy. If you're going to do cookie-cutter set-bonuses, at least make them slightly unique based on the class. Like make them increase a class-specific cooldown or something.

 

Keep PvE and PvP seperate please

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I think these would be nice changes for both DPS specs. These are PVE only, I don't think PVP and PVE Set Bonuses should be the same, heck give PVP players better DCDs with their set bonus at the cost of some damage

 

2 piece: Supercharged Gas increases all damage dealt by 3% for 20 seconds.

4 piece: Reduces the heat cost of Thermal Detonator or Heatseeker Missile by 3.

6 piece: Autocrit every 60 seconds on HSM or MS is fine. I don't know what else to put here, unless perhaps a straight 15% increased crit chance on unload/blazingbolts.

 

Any thoughts?

Edited by RagnarokViking
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If the autocrit 6pc bonus is kept, I think it would be nice to change how the proc works so that the player can see how much time is left before they can proc the 6pc setbonus again.

This isn't huge for straight dummy parsing or tank 'n spank bosses since in those situations demo round won't be delayed, but in PvP and bosses with significant amounts of forced downtime it becomes very important to not waste valuable 6pc autocrit procs.

 

My idea would be to change the 6pc so that when the 6pc autocrit proc is consumed it places a 1 minute debuff that functions as a lockout. That way we can see how much time is left until we can proc the 6pc setbonus again.

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I think you should make a set bonus that is simple. 2 set = +2% damage/healing/defense, 4 set = +4%damage/healing/defense, 6 Set = +6% damage/healing/defense. How awesome would that be to have a simple armor set like that?!?!? Then you wouldn't have to worry about who likes what skills, and bla bla bla. Well, that's my suggestion for the set bonuses. You are welcome.
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IIRC the set bonuses are identical to prevent cheesing of content either way with PVP and PVE set bonuses.

 

Current 3.0 set bonuses for Merc DPS allow you to get a large damage boost when opening up on a boss.

 

At any point after that in the fight or in PVP in general the long cooldown of the procs are nothing to rely on because they are not on demand. They are nailed to things which are core to doing damage.

 

Oh look it's procced, quick, I must find someone to use this autocrit on....

 

Oh look, I gained 2% damage for the next 30s... yet this is so trivial it's not going to influence my combat decisions.

 

As for the -5s on Power Surge... Irrelevant in PVE and no big deal in PVP either. 5 seconds off 60 seconds is nothing.

 

Unless you're planning on doing something meaningful with Merc survivability in PVP then I'd like to take the opportunity to wedge in some survivability into the set bonus and bring back the lowered cooldowns you dropped from Merc PVP sets when you made the 3.0 ones.

 

-5s on Hydraulic Overrides cooldown specific to Merc to prevent cross dressing by Powertechs.

-5s on Jet Boost

 

And then with the 6PC you can put whatever overcomplicated DPS boost you want but frankly a flat boost to Blazing Bolts or Mag Shot would be much more attractive than juggling or ignoring more procs popping on the buff bar.

 

 

Actually scratch the cooldowns, how about fixing something using the set bonus which has annoyed me for a longass time.

 

You cloned Hydraulic Overrides from the Powertech and glued them onto the Merc.

 

Except Powertech is a melee class festooned with instant attacks. Merc has to sit still to cast or it does nothing but eat damage, do very little damage and even less healing.

 

As a result when someone decides this is a good day to put some grief on the Merc causing them to want to get away it's a self-shutdown for the Merc for as long as they try to use the duration of Hydraulic Overrides to make distance.

 

How did that ever make sense to anyone. Snipers have a 18m teleport plus immunities, Sorcs have a high speed dash which takes about 2s. Both of which allow distance making without shutting down the player using them.

 

Mercs have a moderate jog for 6-10s which stops them casting... despite them being a caster?

 

This is what it should have been all along:

 

Hydraulic Overrides allows casts and channels on the move for its duration.

 

Then DPS Merc doesn't have to be totally useless when breaking away from a fight as they can keep dealing damage or healing as they move.

 

Burn a set bonus on that. It should be baseline or at the very least a mid level utility but when all you're asked for is opinions on set bonuses...

Edited by Gyronamics
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IIRC the set bonuses are identical to prevent cheesing of content either way with PVP and PVE set bonuses.

 

Current 3.0 set bonuses for Merc DPS allow you to get a large damage boost when opening up on a boss.

 

At any point after that in the fight or in PVP in general the long cooldown of the procs are nothing to rely on because they are not on demand. They are nailed to things which are core to doing damage.

 

Oh look it's procced, quick, I must find someone to use this autocrit on....

 

Oh look, I gained 2% damage for the next 30s... yet this is so trivial it's not going to influence my combat decisions.

 

As for the -5s on Power Surge... Irrelevant in PVE and no big deal in PVP either. 5 seconds off 60 seconds is nothing.

 

Unless you're planning on doing something meaningful with Merc survivability in PVP then I'd like to take the opportunity to wedge in some survivability into the set bonus and bring back the lowered cooldowns you dropped from Merc PVP sets when you made the 3.0 ones.

 

-5s on Hydraulic Overrides cooldown specific to Merc to prevent cross dressing by Powertechs.

-5s on Jet Boost

 

And then with the 6PC you can put whatever overcomplicated DPS boost you want but frankly a flat boost to Blazing Bolts or Mag Shot would be much more attractive than juggling or ignoring more procs popping on the buff bar.

 

 

Actually scratch the cooldowns, how about fixing something using the set bonus which has annoyed me for a longass time.

 

You cloned Hydraulic Overrides from the Powertech and glued them onto the Merc.

 

Except Powertech is a melee class festooned with instant attacks. Merc has to sit still to cast or it does nothing but eat damage, do very little damage and even less healing.

 

As a result when someone decides this is a good day to put some grief on the Merc causing them to want to get away it's a self-shutdown for the Merc for as long as they try to use the duration of Hydraulic Overrides to make distance.

 

How did that ever make sense to anyone. Snipers have a 18m teleport plus immunities, Sorcs have a high speed dash which takes about 2s. Both of which allow distance making without shutting down the player using them.

 

Mercs have a moderate jog for 6-10s which stops them casting... despite them being a caster?

 

This is what it should have been all along:

 

Hydraulic Overrides allows casts and channels on the move for its duration.

 

Then DPS Merc doesn't have to be totally useless when breaking away from a fight as they can keep dealing damage or healing as they move.

 

Burn a set bonus on that. It should be baseline or at the very least a mid level utility but when all you're asked for is opinions on set bonuses...

 

yes please fun and not boring 2% and auto crit nonsense

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It may sound selfish, but can we get a skill that has some heat reduction utility? I know in Arsenal it's not that bad, but in IO you have to be very smart with your heat management.

 

Maybe make it to where every full channel of Blazing Bolts/Unload makes your next Power Shot cost 1 heat. This effect can occur no more than once every 45 seconds.

 

Also, the 2% damage bonus does feel a bit lazy. If you're going to do cookie-cutter set-bonuses, at least make them slightly unique based on the class. Like make them increase a class-specific cooldown or something.

 

Keep PvE and PvP seperate please

 

Personally I'd like to see a return of something similar to the old set bonuses of having a free Railshot.

 

Preferably something that makes Priming Shot or Serrated Shot free in the set bonuses, and makes the next Tracer Missile / Power Shot auto crit (can only occur once every 30s), it benefits both Arsenal and IO specs. Where it turns up, I don't really care.

 

As for a PvP set bonus? Lets beat the dead horse about surviving...

 

  • 2-Piece: Heatseeker Missile and Serrated Shot or Demolition Round and Serrated Bolt increase damage dealt by 3% for 15 seconds. Cannot occur more than once every 30 of seconds.
  • 4-Piece: Activating Chaff Flare / Diversion or Kolto Overload /Tenacity increases damage reduction by 30%.
  • 6-Piece: Activating Power Shield / Reactive Shield and Hydraulic Overrides / Hold the Line grants you immunity to stuns and mezzes for the duration of the ability.

^^The sad thing is, although a little tongue in cheek, I'm not even joking that I'd like to see that as a PvP set bonus. It's what the class needs to make it work better.

Edited by Transcendent
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I'd like a set bonus that unlocks more conversation choices and amplifies my story experience. :rolleyes:

 

Now that I got that out of my system, I'd actually like to see a return to the separation of PvE and PvP set bonuses if they can be balanced so a hybrid of the two is not OP. However for this post I will assume they wont be separated. I do like the idea of defensive/ability enhancing set bonuses but then the class is gimped until the player can get 6/7ths of a full set which for some players isn't even a possibility.

 

I don't mind the set bonuses being "lame" since real balancing should happen around the abilities of the spec not the items you get. Set bonuses that are lessened by a certain ability should be avoided too, like the CD reduction on the instacast being in both an ability and set bonus. I think it would be fine to have the two and six piece remain the same, and change the 4 piece to something along the lines of increasing damage of Power shot/Charged burst or Tracer missile/Grav Round by a moderate amount. This would keep the nature of the spec the same regardless of the set bonus you have (rotation wise), not affect any utilities you may or may not want to take, and keep the set bonus damage increase reasonable.

Edited by Mediocre-Nova
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It never gave them infinite autocrits. The 2% damage buff icon looks exactly the same as the autocrit icon. People just thought that the autocrit buff was broken because the other one remained up there longer.

 

Then explain why my test on a dummy of Boltstorm -> Demo Round gave the auto-crit and didn't consume it (done last saturday-ish)

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You should redesign all of the dps 6pc setbonuses. They are a minimal dps increase at best in PvE, but they are ridiculous in PvP. If someone before 3.0 said that he wants an auto crit HSM I would've laughed him out of the thread and told him to get real.
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2p and 6p are a bit boring, but ok and decent buffs

 

4p is useless in most occasions. As an IO merc, I would appreciate an energy management help (cd reduce on TSO or heat vent), I know arsenal isn't really hard on that department so not sure. That hydraulics override/channel while moving that gyro mentionned would be awesome too. Or CD reduce on shield? I don't know, but please change the current one.

 

Adding the same comment I made on my comment in scoundrel healing post:

Also, maybe consider balancing set bonuses so general increase is a bit more than 5% (like... 7%?), and that is not only for heals, is for everything. Set bonuses feel rewarding now, but they could be a bit more, so everyone would know that sacrificing 6 gear rating (192 set bonus vs 198 comms gear) is the thing to do.

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