Perhaps. But I thought it was a great effort for Din to even appear on the space station.

 

Oh, and the planet stopped Kira from being able to call on the force as much, she said so herself, so it still happened.

 

Absolutely, just like i said thoughts, I still find it likely he was weakened but The emperor was weakened from something or another before the fight and The Hero of Tython did have help in the form of T7, so just some thoughts on that matter .

Vitiate: "My life spans millennia. Legions have risen to test me. My ascendance is inevitable. A day, a year, a millennium—it matters not. I hold the patience of stone and the will of stars. Your striving is insignificant. Let your death be the same."

 

Nihilus: "................"

 

Vitiate: *Gulp*

 

*Nihilus drains him to death*

 

Dark Council: How did he manage to destroy our all-powerful Emperor?

 

*Visas walks slowly into the Council Chamber*

 

"Did you think you would be safe, here, on Dromund Kaas? my master sees beyond our realm, you are dust motes in a storm… a grain upon the beach… and as insignificant as a body that orbits the graveyard of Malachor and now you will die with your Empire."

 

*Nihilus' figure envelopes the entrance and the Council trembles in terror at his presence, slowly dying.*

 

----------

 

Yeh that's what would happen to Vitiate and his Empire if Nihilus had gone on un-checked.

 

Okay I decided to go full on, bwahaha.

 

That would be so epic!

Isn't that kinda speculation? Because...I find it rather hard to believe, that Orgus Din was able to protect the HoT from the effects of Kass, breaking out of the SE control sure...I suppose I could go with that. Whereas Yoda, ya know the most powerful Jedi up until Luke was unable to stand on Kass for long. That just...doesn't seem to add up.

 

again it was speculation to start and its also speculation to believe the same level of corruption was on the planet when the HoT landed on the planet as their was when Yoda Landed on the Planet 3000 years later. It could potentially be 2 different planets a lot happens in a span of 3000 years so the taint could have been worse. Orgus did Protect the HoT in other parts, all-in-all it is speculation, but sometimes thats all we have. Its what i like to call Reasonable Doubt, making measurements difficult.

again it was speculation to start and its also speculation to believe the same level of corruption was on the planet when the HoT landed on the planet as their was when Yoda Landed on the Planet 3000 years later. It could potentially be 2 different planets a lot happens in a span of 3000 years so the taint could have been worse. Orgus did Protect the HoT in other parts, all-in-all it is speculation, but sometimes thats all we have. Its what i like to call Reasonable Doubt, making measurements difficult.

 

I guess so.../shrug

 

Anyway...so what's the verdict here now?

I guess so.../shrug

 

Anyway...so what's the verdict here now?

 

To be honest, I would rather see Plagueis above the Emperor, but the argument itself was a stall tactic until I got my copy of the Obsession series. Of course I haven't received it yet.

You have misunderstood, what I was saying here is that personal biased - of which we are all guilty of - has no place as an argument in reasoned debate. I don't care for accusing people of being biased and having particular "mindsets" and I don't care for people accusing me of the same. As long as their arguments are logical and reasoned, I will take them at face value, which is what I have done in regards to your arguments, and I'd appreciate it if you continue to do the same.

Noted.

 

Personal attacks/critiques leveled at reasoned argument are, in this way, unnecessary and crass.

I don't think that I engaged in this activity in this thread. If any of my responses gave such a vibe, I apologize for it. This was not intended. I do not use emoticons in my responses much so sometimes tone of my statements may give vibe of expression that they are not intended to.

 

Regardless this is the current state of the debate as you left it, and I see no material in your analysis that could be used as evidence to dispute those particular points. And I am troubled to find that you mislead your readers into thinking the Sith Emperor is capable of tearing down the Sith Citadel, a point which I have demonstrated to be fraudulent.

Looks like point by point addressing of arguments is the only choice left for me then. I will resume that debate after some days.

 

I think that you misunderstood that point. Two Citadels had been build in Kaas city, the first one was destroyed by two Dark Council members in their personal fight (awesome display of power from those two by the way). This first Citadel was then replaced by another one whose structure was also different (the one described in Star Wars: The Old Republic: Revan). Intended point is that some servants of the Emperor were so powerful that they could destroy or collapse buildings if they wanted to, even Emperor's own apprentice was this much capable. In the end, these revelations positively reflect on the capabilities of Sith Emperor himself, he is even BETTER then such powerhouses.

 

That said your assessment does bring to light interesting and new information, again I do not see anything that explicitly refutes my conclusion, but I'd be happy to alter my analysis to incorporate them, though I doubt a different outcome will be reached. Don't assume I am simply ignoring your points, and don't assume that an argument with gaps in is a credible one. If there are gaps in your argument, it is inadequate, and I will exploit them.

Thanks for acknowledgement.

 

My assessment reveals that Emperor have considerable capabilities in all spectrums of the Force, his Nathema feat alone is testament to this fact.

 

Canonical premise is that an individual cannot be exceptional in ALTER spectrum without being exceptional in the CONTROL and SENSE spectrums beforehand. Fortunately or unfortunately, much of the capabilities of Sith Emperor have been explained in the context of ALTER spectrum or in greyish fashion but common sense comes in handy. This source Jedi Path: A Manual for Students of the Force confirms that power progression takes place in this manner: CONTROL --> SENSE --> ALTER

 

Alter feats represent the most complex forms of Force manipulation and they require respectable command over matters of CONTROL and SENSE beforehand.

 

You have incorrectly assumed that Sith Emperor is lacking in the spectrums of CONTROL and SENSE, he is not. Many of his actions are simply not possible without mastery over spectrums of CONTROL and SENSE. My analysis highlights this matter in most adequate fashion.

 

Also it is generally poor form to tell people to "do your homework", much better to make your arguments explicit.While true this does not change the reality that the Sith Emperor has yet to do anything, I feel, that surpasses Sidious in ability. And given he recent "demise" I doubt we will be seeing a great deal more from him.Hype is a term filled with hot air, I await your more substantial response. Furthemore the term "theory" does not suggest fabricated, my theories are either well-based in fact and evidence, or explanations of facts.Which is why it is best to exclude them altogether, as opposed make ill-favoured assumptions concerning their abilities. This is a list compiling characters of which enough information is present on them to make a comparison.

I never doubted your debating skills, you make good assessment of things. However, nobody is perfect and anybody can make mistakes or error in judgments. It is like this; two minds are better then one. Purpose of my input is correct representation of lore that I am familiar with. My intention is to highlight things in manner that they make most sense in that way.

 

I am not sure if Sith Emperor have been officially declared dead at this point of the story, until his essence is vanquished, Sith Emperor will remain alive. Also, he has lasted centuries in his span of existence so this leaves lot of room for exploring him.

 

But as I have said before if you think this "ranking criteria" to be flawed and pointless, I am confused as to why you insist on continuing to participate. Nobody said you have to accept this list, and you are free to ignore it.

I didn't meant that in the sense to ridicule your decision, it is just a point that I wanted to convey. People should know that your rankings are not necessarily reflective of actual positions of characters with respect to their power in the mythos. Of-course, this doesn't means that you have been illogical or something.

 

As I said "with maybe the exception of Darth Nox" - unfortunately his abilities are based almost purely on game mechanics and anything else is far to vague to say anything specific.

Nox's abilities have been canonized in Star Wars: The Old Republic: Encyclopedia. Trust me, I am not making stuff about any character here.

 

Darth Nox is spectacularly powerful Force-user by mythos standards. He singlehandedly packs punch like a Strike Team of powerful individuals. He is the NEXT BIG THING, his story is representative of ultimate power progression among the Sith. He is likely to punk majority of Sith in the mythos in single combat, he has become unnatural.

 

Remembering that "I think" =/= fact.Firstly I applaud that logic, all duels have circumstance affiliated with them and should never be taken at face value.

Thanks

 

Secondly, the sum of all the exceptional circumstances is that Caedus was unable to bring his Force powers or his lightsaber abilities to bear in that 'duel' at all. Therefore we cannot use it as material for judging him in those fields, to do so is illogical. Instead I'd draw your attention to Caedus' other duels in which he did have full use of his abilities.

Actually I recall it as a very brutal battle in which Mara also sustained heavy injuries but was still able to fight and she eventually got the upperhand in the end but Caedus pulled off a trick to eliminate her.

 

Caedus did use his powers in this duel and so did Mara. I don't see why we should ignore revelations of this duel.

 

Namely his confrontation with Kyle Katarn, and four other Jedi Knights. Kyle Katarn being a Jedi Battlemaster and one of the most renowned members of the New Jedi Order, which I'm sure others will confirm. In that duel Caedus effectively schooled them, Katarn was only able to have his attacks connect once, let alone actually bypass his defenses. Caedus was simply far to fast for them, micromanaging them easily, and in the end defeated them effortlessly. He also managed to fight on par and injure his grandfather, Grand Master Luke Skywalker himself.

I know about these duels.

 

Among those 4 Jedi knights whom Caedus defeated, only Katarn is worth noting. In comparison, Sith Emperor have canonically "easily" subdued Strike Teams of legendary warriors and powerful Force-users (superior display of power then Caedus).

 

As far as battle with Luke is concerned, Luke made a miscalculation of dueling Caedus in the latter's strong aspect. If Luke had just resorted to using his Force powers, he would have punked Caedus. Think of this matter in this manner; Luke was Jacen's uncle and he had some soft spot for him and then he also had to consider Ben's state of mind during this event, he didn't wanted to lure Ben to the dark side by being absolutely ruthless in-front of him, this would have given Ben wrong signals.

 

Given that, and given that Kyle Katarn and Luke Skywalker are Mara's betters. I have no doubt that in a confrontation where Caedus could have brought his full abilities to bear, Mara Jade would have been utterly destroyed.

My perception is that Mara have been underestimated and Caedus have been overestimated.

Edited February 11, 2014 by S_W_LeGenD

Well, I suppose I should go post Vader's match. That should be fun...

Caedus have been overestimated.

 

I'm shocked, truly.

Edited February 11, 2014 by LadyKulvax

Ok as a response to Legend about mastery of Control and Sense. While yes a certain level of mastery is needed in both Control and Sense for Alter to be usable as you need to understand yourself and your enviroment before you can alter it, you can have a Mastery of these 2 and still have a greater mastery of Alter then you do of those 2 as you only need a certain level of Mastery of the first 2 before the third is able to be pushed. So while The Sith emperor has a Mastery of Control and Sense he may not have it as high as the mastery of others Control and Sense who have potentially lesser Alter Skills. It just means he Maxed out his Alter as far as the Minimum mastery of Control and Sense he achieved while the other Continued to push Control and Sense instead of Pushing Alter. If what i am saying makes any sense at all. I know my rambles can be hard to understand so if any one understood that and can translate into plainer language i would be appreciative to them.

Ok as a response to Legend about mastery of Control and Sense. While yes a certain level of mastery is needed in both Control and Sense for Alter to be usable as you need to understand yourself and your enviroment before you can alter it, you can have a Mastery of these 2 and still have a greater mastery of Alter then you do of those 2 as you only need a certain level of Mastery of the first 2 before the third is able to be pushed. So while The Sith emperor has a Mastery of Control and Sense he may not have it as high as the mastery of others Control and Sense who have potentially lesser Alter Skills. It just means he Maxed out his Alter as far as the Minimum mastery of Control and Sense he achieved while the other Continued to push Control and Sense instead of Pushing Alter. If what i am saying makes any sense at all. I know my rambles can be hard to understand so if any one understood that and can translate into plainer language i would be appreciative to them.

Actually no, some of the feats he performed require absolute mastery of both SENSE and CONTROL spectrums. You can recheck this analysis for more information in this respect.

Edited February 11, 2014 by S_W_LeGenD

Actually no, some of the feats he performed require "HEROIC" mastery of both SENSE and CONTROL spectrums.

 

Despite my reputation on these forums (the good reputation, not the bad one) I honestly do not know what that means. In what source is that level of mastery outlined in?

Despite my reputation on these forums (the good reputation, not the bad one) I honestly do not know what that means. In what source is that level of mastery outlined in?

DE sourcebook. It contains lot of detail about these matters.

 

Haven't you read my most recent analysis about Sith Emperor properly?

 

Some forms of Force manipulation require combination of mastery in all spectrums of the Force, such forms of manipulation cannot be pulled off otherwise.

Edited February 11, 2014 by S_W_LeGenD

Actually no, some of the feats he performed require absolute mastery of both SENSE and CONTROL spectrums.

 

Yes I get that, actually the post above did not dispute that.

 

let me see if I can give a relative number thing as an example of what i am trying to say. Say for the sake of arguement the SE is a Level 6 Master of Control and a Level 6 Master of Sense, this minimum allows him to have a maximum Level of 10 in Alter and he is a Lvl 9 Alter master. Now say random person I dont know numbers relative to illustrate the thought, is a Level 8 Control Master a Level 6 Sense Master this would also alow the Minimum level of 10 for alter (the Sense not being high enough to push alter any higher even though the control mastery is higher) and said person is a Lvl 7 Alter Master. This hypothetical person would tie the SE in Sense but beat him in control while still losing in Alter. The SE is still a master of Control but Hypothetical person is still a GREATER master of Control.

DE sourcebook. It contains lot of detail about these matters.

 

Haven't you read my most recent analysis about Sith Emperor properly?

 

Some forms of Force manipulation require combination of mastery in all spectrums of the Force, such forms of manipulation cannot be pulled off otherwise.

 

The term 'heroic' is specifically mentioned there? Interesting...

Yes I get that, actually the post above did not dispute that.

 

let me see if I can give a relative number thing as an example of what i am trying to say. Say for the sake of arguement the SE is a Level 6 Master of Control and a Level 6 Master of Sense, this minimum allows him to have a maximum Level of 10 in Alter and he is a Lvl 9 Alter master. Now say random person I dont know numbers relative to illustrate the thought, is a Level 8 Control Master a Level 6 Sense Master this would also alow the Minimum level of 10 for alter (the Sense not being high enough to push alter any higher even though the control mastery is higher) and said person is a Lvl 7 Alter Master. This hypothetical person would tie the SE in Sense but beat him in control while still losing in Alter. The SE is still a master of Control but Hypothetical person is still a GREATER master of Control.

I have noted your explanation but the issue is that some forms of Force Manipulation are not possible without being lets say 9 in both SENSE and CONTROL spectrums. Sith Emperor have performed such feats.

The term 'heroic' is specifically mentioned there? Interesting...

Yes; this is the ranking criteria:-

 

1. Heroic

2. Very difficult

3. Difficult

 

and so on...

 

For example, Emperor's feat of pulling off dopplegangers during his second confrontation with Hero of Tython required this level of proficiency in all spectrums of the Force:

 

Control: Very Difficult

Sense: Very Difficult

Alter: Heroic

Edited February 11, 2014 by S_W_LeGenD

I have noted your explanation but the issue is that some forms of Force Manipulation are not possible without being lets say 9 in both SENSE and CONTROL spectrums. Sith Emperor have performed such feats.

 

Fair enough, the thought though of course it is still POSSIBLE that some one could have greater Sense and Control while having less Alter and as such I dont think we can ever forgo Sense and Control arguements nor should we assume some one is capable of Control or Sense feats that they havent preformed simply because of their skills with Alter, or at least with in reason. Thats my only real point .

Yes; this is the ranking criteria:-

 

1. Heroic

2. Very difficult

3. Difficult

 

and so on...

 

For example, Emperor's feat of pulling off dopplegangers during his second confrontation with Hero of Tython required this level of proficiency in all spectrums of the Force:

 

Control: Very Difficult

Sense: Very Difficult

Alter: Heroic

 

 

I see where you are going with this, I will note that a lot of the people on this list would require Heroic skills in almost all aspects of the Force to preform some of the stuff they do, depending on the scale your using.

Edited February 11, 2014 by tunewalker

Yes; this is the ranking criteria:-

 

1. Heroic

2. Very difficult

3. Difficult

 

and so on...

 

For example, Emperor's feat of pulling off dopplegangers during his second confrontation with Hero of Tython required this level of proficiency in all spectrums of the Force:

 

Control: Very Difficult

Sense: Very Difficult

Alter: Heroic

 

Alrighty then.

I see where you are going with this, I will note that a lot of the people on this list would require Heroic skills in almost all aspects of the Force to preform some of the stuff they do.

Not necessarily, you will be surprised that lot of actions do not require that level of skill.

 

According to DE sourcebook, most taxing Force feats are:

 

1. Force Storm (Wormhole)

2. Dopplegangers

3. Essence Transfer (successful)

 

I think that Emperor's Nathema feat is the most taxing one in the mythos.

Edited February 11, 2014 by S_W_LeGenD

Not necessarily, you will be surprised that lot of actions do not require that level of skill.

 

According to DE sourcebook, most taxing Force feats are:

 

1. Force Storm (Wormhole)

2. Dopplegangers

 

I am not meaning Singular feats. I am meaning they have shown heroic Level mastery in all 3 aspects by feats they have shown at different times.

 

For Example Saba has shown Heroic level Sense and Control Feats at different times. Not all at once, but if we were to judge every ones feats one at a time we might just find half the list is full of heroic level feats in all three aspects.

Edited February 11, 2014 by tunewalker

I am not meaning Singular feats. I am meaning they have shown heroic Level mastery in all 3 aspects by feats they have shown at different times.

 

For Example Saba has shown Heroic level Sense and Control Feats at different times. Not all at once, but if we were to judge every ones feats one at a time we might just find half the list is full of heroic level feats.

We don't get to decide this personally, you have to be precise about what particular feats you are referring to.

 

My revelations are entirely based on canon information, no personal assumption involved.

 

Many feats of ALTER do not require massive command over CONTROL and SENSE spectrums even though they may occur complex to us. However, some feats of ALTER require extraordinary mastery in all spectrums of the Force and Sith Emperor fits the bill based on some of his feats.

Edited February 11, 2014 by S_W_LeGenD

I think that you misunderstood that point. Two Citadels had been build in Kaas city, the first one was destroyed by two Dark Council members in their personal fight (awesome display of power from those two by the way). This first Citadel was then replaced by another one whose structure was also different (the one described in Star Wars: The Old Republic: Revan). Intended point is that some servants of the Emperor were so powerful that they could destroy or collapse buildings if they wanted to, even Emperor's own apprentice was this much capable. In the end, these revelations positively reflect on the capabilities of Sith Emperor himself, he is even BETTER then such powerhouses.

 

My assessment reveals that Emperor have considerable capabilities in all spectrums of the Force, his Nathema feat alone is testament to this fact.

 

Canonical premise is that an individual cannot be exceptional in ALTER spectrum without being exceptional in the CONTROL and SENSE spectrums beforehand. Fortunately or unfortunately, much of the capabilities of Sith Emperor have been explained in the context of ALTER spectrum or in greyish fashion but common sense comes in handy. This source Jedi Path: A Manual for Students of the Force confirms that power progression takes place in this manner: CONTROL --> SENSE --> ALTER

 

Alter feats represent the most complex forms of Force manipulation and they require respectable command over matters of CONTROL and SENSE beforehand.

 

You have incorrectly assumed that Sith Emperor is lacking in the spectrums of CONTROL and SENSE, he is not. Many of his actions are simply not possible without mastery over spectrums of CONTROL and SENSE. My analysis highlights this matter in most adequate fashion.

 

I am not sure if Sith Emperor have been officially declared dead at this point of the story, until his essence is vanquished, Sith Emperor will remain alive. Also, he has lasted centuries in his span of existence so this leaves lot of room for exploring him.

 

Nox's abilities have been canonized in Star Wars: The Old Republic: Encyclopedia. Trust me, I am not making stuff about any character here.

 

Darth Nox is spectacularly powerful Force-user by mythos standards. He singlehandedly packs punch like a Strike Team of powerful individuals. He is the NEXT BIG THING, his story is representative of ultimate power progression among the Sith. He is likely to punk majority of Sith in the mythos in single combat, he has become unnatural.

 

Actually I recall it as a very brutal battle in which Mara also sustained heavy injuries but was still able to fight and she eventually got the upperhand in the end but Caedus pulled off a trick to eliminate her.

 

Caedus did use his powers in this duel and so did Mara. I don't see why we should ignore revelations of this duel.

 

I know about these duels.

 

Among those 4 Jedi knights whom Caedus defeated, only Katarn is worth noting. In comparison, Sith Emperor have canonically "easily" subdued Strike Teams of legendary warriors and powerful Force-users (superior display of power then Caedus).

 

As far as battle with Luke is concerned, Luke made a miscalculation of dueling Caedus in the latter's strong aspect. If Luke had just resorted to using his Force powers, he would have punked Caedus. Think of this matter in this manner; Luke was Jacen's uncle and he had some soft spot for him and then he also had to consider Ben's state of mind during this event, he didn't wanted to lure Ben to the dark side by being absolutely ruthless in-front of him, this would have given Ben wrong signals.

 

My perception is that Mara have been underestimated and Caedus have been overestimated.

1. The unsupported assumptions are highlighted.

 

I understand your point completely, but I'm afraid I'd relegate its credibility to a dumpster. There is no evidence, I repeat no evidence at all that states that this particular feat was achieved solely though the Force, if by the Force at all. It is pure speculation on your part I'm afraid, and not very logical explanation either.

 

In a Kaggath, which involves more than just an individual, but armies. It could just have well have been destroyed by military vehicles, projectiles etc. or a combination of all of the above. Which are far more well-known for causing substantial, indiscriminate and collateral damage especially to buildings. It is highly unlikely that they just used the Force to tear the thing down - given that they all Force attacks would be projected at each other. And it would take considerable effort and concentration for any Force User to do so. Its incredibly tenuous.

 

2. Of which I shall take into account, however I will also highlight some errors in judgement you have made.

 

3. The Sith Emperor is slowly drifting from the forefront and his death is becoming increasingly solidified, I don't doubt he will return, but I expect only briefly before succumbing to a final death. We shall see.

 

4. I never claimed you were making things up, but you exaggerate. Nox's actions have be canonised in the SWTORE, his abilities have yet to be elaborated on. Given that we lack the knowledge to make accurate claims.

 

5. It was a brawl in a closely confined space, in which Jade laid a trap that should have killed an ordinary Force User. Not once was Caedus able to use his lightsaber or really apply himself effectively. You are right though Jacen did use the Force, and Mara Jade had herself thrown about many times when he did and seemed incapable of resisting, so I don't see your point there. I see no evidence to suggest that the Sith Emperor would have fared any better, his lack of close quarters combat abilities would have more likely ensured his demise if anything.

 

And yes, the others were simple knights, but it is a mere demonstration that Caedus is easily capable of defeating Force Users on the level of Mara Jade Skywalker, and then some. Kyle Katarn being more than on that level. I am not attempting to make a comparison here, I don't believe that comparison you are trying to make can be made.

 

5. You make the erroneous error that Luke was an inferior lightsaber duelist to Caedus, and that he was in anyway lacking in this arena. This is incorrect, in fact all evidence suggests that Luke Skywalker was the greatest lightsaber duelist that the galaxy had ever seen, defeating the likes of Darth Sidious in his prime of whom Yoda and Mace Windu were both unable to overcome, the former being acknowledge as the greatest lightsaber duelist in history. So no, Caedus did not have a single advantage here, he was inferior in the Force and duelling skills. Remembering of course the two are closely interlinked, Luke like all Jedi, empowers himself with Force valor.

 

I understand that Luke may not have been in the right mindset, but that shouldn't have done anything to hamper his defenses, he may not have wanted to hurt Caedus, but he certainly did not want to be killed by him. Remembering that this is Luke Skywalker we are concerning ourselves with, the most powerful Force User the galaxy has ever seen, being able to go toe-to-toe with him under any circumstances proves that in a straight up fight Mara Jade would not have stood a chance. He is certainly more powerful than the Hero of Tython.

 

Your perceptions need adjusting, I suggest you look at more objective demonstrations of Force ability as opposed to highly circumstantial confrontations with Caedus' nonetheless powerful contemporaries.

We don't get to decide this personally, you have to be precise about what particular feats you are referring to.

 

My revelations are entirely based on canon information, no personal assumption involved.

 

Many feats of ALTER do not require massive command over CONTROL and SENSE spectrums even though they may occur complex to us. However, some feats of ALTER require extraordinary mastery in all spectrums of the Force and Sith Emperor fits the bill based on some of his feats.

 

Yes I know that my thoughts on this come from the WEG source books where things like Detoxifying Nerotoxin is considered heroic level difficulty of control which Saba has done and Sensing the Planet she did from across the galaxy when distance and relationship is all there that is a heroic level of Sense. ( I am just using Saba as an example right now as other specific events of some arent coming to my mind.).

 

Some Lightsaber Combat can be thought of as Heroic level Sense and Control feats, Of course Heroic just Alter feats come all over the place in TK feats for many characters especially since the more objects you add the more difficult it becomes or the more weight you add the more difficult it becomes or the more some one has to maneuver the object.

 

I am using a source though admitedly unsure about how up to date it is.

Not necessarily, you will be surprised that lot of actions do not require that level of skill.

 

According to DE sourcebook, most taxing Force feats are:

 

1. Force Storm (Wormhole)

2. Dopplegangers

3. Essence Transfer (successful)

 

I think that Emperor's Nathema feat is the most taxing one in the mythos.

That seems awfully out dated, given that Force adepts have been able to successful complete essence transfer.