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Decided yesterday Sorc Light is gonna be my comeback char, now I saw the parses...

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > Classes > Sage / Sorcerer
Decided yesterday Sorc Light is gonna be my comeback char, now I saw the parses...

Esthaniel's Avatar


Esthaniel
09.02.2017 , 03:25 PM | #1
After seeing numerous posts on Dulfy, TORCommunity, Discord and here I realized the specc I have been maining during my SoR progression time has been nerfed so hard it's utterly useless now and cannot compete in the slightest with a competent DPS on basically every other class. I never enjoyed Madness that much, but it's also down there.

So, apart from abusing some elusive chain lightning procc that appears more often than it should, I can basically lay my sorceress to rest again, after reinstating her for 2 days?

ottffsse's Avatar


ottffsse
09.03.2017 , 01:07 AM | #2
Quote: Originally Posted by Esthaniel View Post
After seeing numerous posts on Dulfy, TORCommunity, Discord and here I realized the specc I have been maining during my SoR progression time has been nerfed so hard it's utterly useless now and cannot compete in the slightest with a competent DPS on basically every other class. I never enjoyed Madness that much, but it's also down there.

So, apart from abusing some elusive chain lightning procc that appears more often than it should, I can basically lay my sorceress to rest again, after reinstating her for 2 days?
Situation is not quite like it was in beginning of 5.0. Right now the only classes will/should be pulling more dps than you (in a in-game fight) consistently from oull to pull will be well played Maras/ Deception sins-but they are above the rest. The rest are fairly close given fight to fight mechanics differences. No hm-op should ever be a problem. As for Nim- there are three or four fights where it may be advisable to just bring along a higher parsing melee alt (firebrand+sc/styra-aids etc).

The problem is the unfriendly gearing system for certain classes that are on the lower end of parsley dps output like sorcs. You will need mostly 242s (not just 236s) to do hm-ops comfortably and mostly if not every slot 248s for Nim. -that is a lot of time and commitment, at least for the 248s end game gear pieces.

Fellow-Canadian's Avatar


Fellow-Canadian
09.03.2017 , 03:25 AM | #3
If being competitive is important then you will want to play a different class. In terms of time commitment, Bioware has done some balancing, but at their current glacial pace, the meta will remain unchanged for the foreseeable future. You can invest the time in another class and it will last you a long time.
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Jushyfruit's Avatar


Jushyfruit
09.03.2017 , 01:04 PM | #4
Lightning is good enough right now for any content as long as your gear is good. The rotation is very unforgiving to mistakes and requires high APM and no ability downtime in order to keep up. If you put in the time to learning and executing lightning's rotation correctly the it is arguably one of the best ranged specs you can take to a fight given its great utility for groups. Brought my lightning sorc to Firebrand and Stormcaller and managed to get the highest ranged parse since the nerfs to other ranged classes. Don't let the rest of the parses determine how well you can play the class.
http://parsely.io/parser/view/312259/0
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Esthaniel's Avatar


Esthaniel
09.04.2017 , 04:28 AM | #5
I have been playing Lightning Sorc during SoR progress (HC 8/10, Cora P3, then I quit) and played Pyrotech Merc during the DM content in NiM (6/10), so it's not a learning issue. It is a min-maxing, "can I get the same output with the same effort" and "will I drag my group down by choice of class" kind of thing. And since Lightning Sorc is one of the speccs I always loved playing and my Sorc remains to this day amongst my favorite 2-3 toons, it would be a pity to not rely on it for balancing reasons.

I also have been playing Warlock, Shadow and MM hunter in WoW for various high end progression tiers.

Hoppinswtor's Avatar


Hoppinswtor
09.05.2017 , 03:46 PM | #6
Without chain lightning bug, take a look at how high my sorc is faring in story mode ops:

http://parsely.io/parser/operations/...all/all/5.3/0/
http://parsely.io/parser/operations/...all/all/5.3/0/
http://parsely.io/parser/operations/...all/all/5.3/0/
http://parsely.io/parser/operations/...all/all/5.3/0/
http://parsely.io/parser/operations/...all/all/5.3/0/
http://parsely.io/parser/operations/...all/all/5.3/0/
http://parsely.io/parser/operations/...all/all/5.3/0/

The same can be true with veteran/master mode (I haven't really pulled those as much on my lightning sorc).

On Tyth HM, you can easily hit 9k dps. On the sisters you can hit 8.5k especially if you get the beam.

It's more than viable, especially when there are multiple targets.
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ottffsse's Avatar


ottffsse
09.05.2017 , 04:04 PM | #7
Quote: Originally Posted by Hoppinswtor View Post
Without chain lightning bug, take a look at how high my sorc is faring in story mode ops:

http://parsely.io/parser/operations/...all/all/5.3/0/
http://parsely.io/parser/operations/...all/all/5.3/0/
http://parsely.io/parser/operations/...all/all/5.3/0/
http://parsely.io/parser/operations/...all/all/5.3/0/
http://parsely.io/parser/operations/...all/all/5.3/0/
http://parsely.io/parser/operations/...all/all/5.3/0/
http://parsely.io/parser/operations/...all/all/5.3/0/

The same can be true with veteran/master mode (I haven't really pulled those as much on my lightning sorc).

On Tyth HM, you can easily hit 9k dps. On the sisters you can hit 8.5k especially if you get the beam.

It's more than viable, especially when there are multiple targets.
I agree lightning is in a good place right now when compared to marksman and arsenal (burst rdps). Marksman has deadlier aoe potential but that's it.

Sorc is only still a harder class in end-game Pvp ranked because we are squishy compared to face-tank dcds of mercs. And skilled snipers gave also the edge there but you have to be really skilled on sniper for the dcds to work so that's ok. But in PvE I think sorc is better now than merc.

Dewlmenow's Avatar


Dewlmenow
09.05.2017 , 06:38 PM | #8
Quote: Originally Posted by ottffsse View Post
I agree lightning is in a good place right now when compared to marksman and arsenal (burst rdps). Marksman has deadlier aoe potential but that's it.

Sorc is only still a harder class in end-game Pvp ranked because we are squishy compared to face-tank dcds of mercs. And skilled snipers gave also the edge there but you have to be really skilled on sniper for the dcds to work so that's ok. But in PvE I think sorc is better now than merc.
Well, lightning is better than arsenal, but marksman is better than lightning and arsenal in every way except for rotational aoe which is mostly useless. For dps merc vs dps sorc, IO is by far the best dps spec either class has (ignoring chain lightning bug). Combine that with the vastly better dcd's mercs have and I can't honestly say sorcs are better than mercs. Sorcs are still clearly behind mercs and snipers in pve dps as they have been nonstop since 3.0.

verfallen's Avatar


verfallen
09.05.2017 , 10:03 PM | #9
Quote: Originally Posted by Dewlmenow View Post
Well, lightning is better than arsenal, but marksman is better than lightning and arsenal in every way except for rotational aoe which is mostly useless. For dps merc vs dps sorc, IO is by far the best dps spec either class has (ignoring chain lightning bug). Combine that with the vastly better dcd's mercs have and I can't honestly say sorcs are better than mercs. Sorcs are still clearly behind mercs and snipers in pve dps as they have been nonstop since 3.0.
Actually, the dps difference is too small to consider MM superior safe in pvp due to one big kicker in lightning favor:

Mobility.

The spec is great at keeping its dps on the move for a short bit, something MM struggle at, even if you spec your utilities for it. When you are allowed to just stand there and shoot with some target switch, certainly MM will fare better as its their figurative "home field". In general, sorc lightning will do better in pve tough.

As you stated, in the sustained aoe department sniper is not really capable of it, unless you add generous use of rifle shot. Suppressive fire hits like a truck, but is very costly. Still, on short to mid aoe the damage can be damn impressive. it always depend on how you do it, I wouldnt sell a good MM sniper short too fast tough.

Its not engineering or Virulence, but it can hit decently a group of thrash. Sorc wins when rotational aoe built in the single target rotation is concerned tough.

As for merc vs sorc dcds, while merc's dcds are very powerful in pvp, not so much in pve. They coded an ignore of responsive safeguards (along with most reflects, but sadly for merc, it was also an absorb for them) to most fights mechanic after people went a bit too happy on cheesing fights with those, and anyway you need to be directly targeted for most of them to work. Same for Trauma Regulator. No charges for raidwaid aoe. And same for the cd reduction on energy shield

Meanwhile, sorc's suit of defensives still work pretty well, with good self-healing still there, and some mild DR dcds on fast cooldowns.

PvP is obviously a whole different story balance wise, pretty sure you can see for yourself looking at all the "**** nerf sniper/nerf merc" threads abundance in the pvp subforum).


At OP, as stated in this thread, don't sell the class short.

Now if you absolutely want to be FoTM, well then obviously no one is saying lightning sorc is, in fact we pretty much all agree it isn't. Its definitely viable, mostly well balanced (could use a tiny bit dps increase perhaps, but hard to say with all the changes to other classes) but its not rolling anyone in pve or pvp. Go roll a lethality operative or deception sin I'd say for pve, and as stated, MM sniper or arsenal merc are still pretty king of pvp. Safe 1vs1, No beating an operative there yet.
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Monterone's Avatar


Monterone
09.09.2017 , 12:57 PM | #10
I'm in the same boat, bud. I've mained a sorc, along with a deception sin, since early beta and took a break over a year ago. I came back to see how things are and re-subbed for a month -- sorc is bottom of the barrel and gearing through PvP even for one character will take months it seems to get anywhere close to competitive.

State of the game is pretty bad at the moment.
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