So yeah... they got their instant self heal... and I love it. Of course it basically heals me for one decent hit, and as most level 50 sorcs know we get targeted... a lot. We're squishy and people love the shiny numbers that pop up above our heads.

Anyways, so besides lacking some competitive burst I feel like sorcs really aren't that bad.... BUT... just a little survivability couldn't hurt. And this idea would basically be sacrificing DPS for Heals and applies to madness tree only.

Idea: Lightning spam procs wrath which makes crushing darkness instant right?

What if you could use that wrath proc to cast an instant crushing darkness ORRRRRRR use it to cast an instant dark infusion instead?

Because it can proc more than crushing darkness is up as well it could really help a DPS sorcs support heals and make them slightly more viable I think.

Then I want something for my madness assassin.

A point you have sir...

Someone should bump all of OP's threads claiming Sorc/Sage were top PVP classes that should never lose when he was running a Mara.

1. Never said top PvP class....I said they're capable and I said I do very well with them. And I do.

2. Never said "never".... but I rarely lose to warriors in 1v1 fights except for a GOOD carnage marauder or a GOOD vengeance jug... and we all know there aren't any vengeance jugs. Those are make believe... like unicorns and leprechauns.

Cute misinterpretation of anything I've ever said tho... 3/5 for effort.

So yeah... they got their instant self heal... and I love it. Of course it basically heals me for one decent hit, and as most level 50 sorcs know we get targeted... a lot. We're squishy and people love the shiny numbers that pop up above our heads.

 

Anyways, so besides lacking some competitive burst I feel like sorcs really aren't that bad.... BUT... just a little survivability couldn't hurt. And this idea would basically be sacrificing DPS for Heals and applies to madness tree only.

 

Idea: Lightning spam procs wrath which makes crushing darkness instant right?

 

What if you could use that wrath proc to cast an instant crushing darkness ORRRRRRR use it to cast an instant dark infusion instead?

 

Because it can proc more than crushing darkness is up as well it could really help a DPS sorcs support heals and make them slightly more viable I think.

I'm curious if you spec into the extra 2% damage reduction in the Madness tree...hmm? I'm sure you could sacrifice some Affliction damage for survivabiliy! Also, I'm curious if you use the sorc dps set bonus or the stalker set bonus.

Not trying to single you out if you do, because honestly, everyone wants to min/max for damage and still retain survivability, and from what i can tell, no one really takes that 2% DR because they want to max out their damage, and some people use the stalker set over the sorc dps set.

If you do use the sorc dps set, maybe consider stacking a bit more endurance since heals from the spec and gear are % based.

I don't think making dark infusion instant would be balanced much at all, and I do believe that whatever extra survivability a sorc dps needs is available to them, and whatever isn't can be made up for with better gameplay.

PS: I've seen one dps sorc stack fortitude augments, and he was sitting at around 21-22k health. Not min-maxed, but a bit tougher. Personally, i still min max damage with the stalker set, i just have to make sure i'm constantly on my A-game so i don't get melted too easily. If I got a buff, i would never get out dps'd, even by PT's and warriors.

1. Never said top PvP class....I said they're capable and I said I do very well with them. And I do.

 

2. Never said "never".... but I rarely lose to warriors in 1v1 fights except for a GOOD carnage marauder or a GOOD vengeance jug... and we all know there aren't any vengeance jugs. Those are make believe... like unicorns and leprechauns.

 

Cute misinterpretation of anything I've ever said tho... 3/5 for effort.

Look at you make more excuses and back pedal. Not that I care much, forum wars aren't my life like they are yours.

When speaking about class balance, the assumption is we are speaking of equally, good skilled players actually utilizing the classes to their potential. Of course a good Sorc will beat a keyboard turning Marauder most of the time, a good player in anything should beat a bad player in this game if they are sub-intelligent.

The fact that you struggle so badly with simple concepts indicates you're likely of the latter group.

Raze is already better than wrath. Infact in 1.2 wrath was nerfed and nothing added in it's place. Raze can be used (with proc) every 7.5 seconds where a sorc has to wait for the full CD before adding it to its already weak vs most classes DPS.

Here's an idea to resolve it.. Why not lower to the global CD of crushing darkness. This would alow more constant DPS from the madness spec sorc while not changing the already great DPS of the Madness spec Sin.

Well I came across a thread earlier that had datamined information about the changes to Sorc going to be made. Whether it's true or not I do not know but it had stuff like;

When bubble is up you can't be interupted

When bubble ends it finishes cooldown on force speed

When bubble is up you get healed small amounts (think it said like 0.5% of total every second)

The force regeneration debuff 3 seconds shorter

Possibly a teleport of some kind.

As I said I just happened to come across it and it's not certain. Whether it's those exact updates or not I do hope they get a buff because they really need it.

And I'd just like to point out that I had nothing to do with any of the datamining or anything along those lines (wouldn't know where to start).

Look at you make more excuses and back pedal. Not that I care much, forum wars aren't my life like they are yours.

 

When speaking about class balance, the assumption is we are speaking of equally, good skilled players actually utilizing the classes to their potential. Of course a good Sorc will beat a keyboard turning Marauder most of the time, a good player in anything should beat a bad player in this game if they are sub-intelligent.

 

The fact that you struggle so badly with simple concepts indicates you're likely of the latter group.

So I make a thread on a random idea at which point you decide is a good time to attack me with false statements... I correct you and am a noob for doing so. Because correcting the words you put into my mouth clearly shows I'm a bad player...

Gotchya....

I'm curious if you spec into the extra 2% damage reduction in the Madness tree...hmm? I'm sure you could sacrifice some Affliction damage for survivabiliy! Also, I'm curious if you use the sorc dps set bonus or the stalker set bonus.

 

Not trying to single you out if you do, because honestly, everyone wants to min/max for damage and still retain survivability, and from what i can tell, no one really takes that 2% DR because they want to max out their damage, and some people use the stalker set over the sorc dps set.

 

If you do use the sorc dps set, maybe consider stacking a bit more endurance since heals from the spec and gear are % based.

 

I don't think making dark infusion instant would be balanced much at all, and I do believe that whatever extra survivability a sorc dps needs is available to them, and whatever isn't can be made up for with better gameplay.

 

PS: I've seen one dps sorc stack fortitude augments, and he was sitting at around 21-22k health. Not min-maxed, but a bit tougher. Personally, i still min max damage with the stalker set, i just have to make sure i'm constantly on my A-game so i don't get melted too easily. If I got a buff, i would never get out dps'd, even by PT's and warriors.

This is what I'm running right now.

I spec into the endurance simply to avoid into spec'ing into other things. parasitism seems useless without the talent higher in the tree and why would I need reduced damage to periodic effects when I can cleanse most of them?

Stalker set bonus for extra charge of recklessness.

And it was just a random idea... something that would work inside the game play. I do quite well on my sorc and am able to kite people no problem most of the time... between the slow, reduces CD on sprint and all the new goodies that came with the last buff are awesome.

I just get random ideas in my head and this one made sense to me simply because it would basically just be trading off some DPS for some healing. I was thinking of it as a support heal as well as a self heal. But the option would be nice. I think a small change like that could give sorcs more viability even without the burst.

So I make a thread on a random idea at which point you decide is a good time to attack me with false statements... I correct you and am a noob for doing so. Because correcting the words you put into my mouth clearly shows I'm a bad player...

 

Gotchya....

Actually nobody cares, that's why nobody is bumping anything. Maybe the mods care, they like to hand out infractions all the time but that's it.

You can keep stating your nonsense and I can keep disputing it until one of us gets bored and moves on. I have some meeting at some random time today maybe so I am killing time until I either have to go to that or I can go home. We'll see which of us leaves first.

Actually nobody cares, that's why nobody is bumping anything. Maybe the mods care, they like to hand out infractions all the time but that's it.

 

You can keep stating your nonsense and I can keep disputing it until one of us gets bored and moves on. I have some meeting at some random time today maybe so I am killing time until I either have to go to that or I can go home. We'll see which of us leaves first.

An internet showdown.... clearly the only adult way to handle this dispute.

It gets better and better.... keep it coming.

Wrath procs happen too frequently. Letting you get an instant heal is too much. I hit 50 last week, already in fully augmented war hero. I find that my survivability is decent. I usually run full madness or a madness/lightning hybrid. With hybrid I have lots of CC, with madness I have enough CC and force speed so as long as I position well I don't have too many problems. I can usually LOS and heal enough to stay alive.

What I do have an issue with is damage, particularly burst, especially when fighting sentinels, guardians and vanguards. They are able to shrug off my DoT damage, while I don't always die to them (like I said I can speed away and heal) I find it incredibly frustrating that force sweep does so much damage with such little set up. On top of that the window of opportunity to get hit with that massive sweep is too much. Even if I play it perfectly, they jump I knock them back or CC, etc their buffs are still up or they just use the second leap and hit me for 6k. Between the sweep, jump and force exhaustion They take a good 8k health off (I currently have 17,280 HP I think) almost instantly and they're going to do it again in another 7 seconds. Compared to how long it takes me to do 8k worth of damage... it's ridiculous. I'm lucky if my hardest hitting ability breaks 3500. Plus they have saber ward, rebuke and the 90% damage reduction on top of being able to stealth (sentinels).

It just seems like an uphill battle considering I don't have the defense, damage or utility they have. If Force Sweep is going to hit so hard there has to be a counter for it, either a smaller window when they have auto crit and singularity, or it has to be a longer window between sweeps. Getting hit with multiple sweeps at once is another issue.

So some ideas:

-Some kind of spell steal? It would allow the sorc to steal a random buff (not class buff) like Singularity, saber ward or rebuke. That way sorcs would have a way to maybe prevent a sweep or turn some of that massive defense in our favor.

-Make overload AOE again. With the current lag there are at least 3 times a night that I have someone in front of me, hit overload and it misses because they were actually behind or on top of me. I don't get this change, it was fine as an AOE. It also takes a critical second if you get jumped on from two directions to position both players in your cone, you're going to get double swept in that time. No good. Stupid change.

-Maybe add another DoT in Madness. An additional DoT high in Madness might help boost damage to a point that's decent enough to contribute to a team. As it is right now, if the other team has a healer you're just a minor inconvenience.

-Thundering blast: this spell is a joke. It hits like a wet noodle, you'd be better off as full lightning to skip it and pick up death field instead. Takes an eternity to cast for pitiful damage. There either needs to be a way to make it instant and/or damage needs a dramatic boost. Either that or it needs an additional effect like trauma or proccing lightning storm. If it's instant it needs to be on a timer, oh wait... it already is.

-Shield should maybe absorb a little more?

-Force slow should initially root in place to prevent force leap (like creeping terror) for 2 seconds

-Lightning strike: Damage is too low or cast time is too high.

I'd prefer not to nerf any classes, just want a way for us to counter those big sweeps and massive defense other classes have.

Wrath procs happen too frequently.

Condensed... but I think more frequent use of those procs could make a DPS sorc viable in rated maybe...

Right now only viable as heals of course and normally for the stun bubble as well. None of the top teams that I know of are running a madness heavy sorc on their A team.

Not only would something like this possibly give it enough damage to compensate for the lack of burst.... but it could also up the viability of the spec by increasing the usefulness of the support heals.

Like I said though... just a random idea. I don't really think these things out... they pop in my head... I type them up and see what people think.

I love my sorc and I own face with it... however it's not taking my marauders spot on our rated team any time soon.

BTW.... I much prefer the new overload to the old one... well... other than the animation.

An internet showdown.... clearly the only adult way to handle this dispute.

 

It gets better and better.... keep it coming.

Inspiration.....

Actually nobody cares, that's why nobody is bumping anything. Maybe the mods care, they like to hand out infractions all the time but that's it.

 

You can keep stating your nonsense and I can keep disputing it until one of us gets bored and moves on. I have some meeting at some random time today maybe so I am killing time until I either have to go to that or I can go home. We'll see which of us leaves first.

Apparently you care, or you wouldn't be trolling this guy. Or is there something more to it?

I don't actually know UGLYMRJ, but I do find many of his posts (including this one) interesting. But equally as interesting is the fact that there always seem to be one or two people in these threads attacking him over seemingly innocuous posts. He's just sharing some ideas with the player base regarding sorcs. Is it really worth your while to attack that? And if you disagree so much, why don't you roll a char on his server and show him what's what in pvp (or maybe you tried that, it didn't work out so well, hence the forum angst)?

Condensed... but I think more frequent use of those procs could make a DPS sorc viable in rated maybe...

Maybe but you wouldn't be viable for your dps? It would be the healing? Instead of adding more downtime to doing damage I'd rather do something passively. Maybe rework Devour so that it increases healing by current amount but applies that healing to your entire group and heals you for an extra 50%. As a DPS though I'd rather my team take me because of my DPS and not because of my healing. Another thought maybe make Death Mark a force resistance debuff that applies to all force damage and not just your DoTs? Dunno, I haven't thought about the problem of being wanted by a group as much as playing War Zones in PuGs.

Inspiration.....

Not gonna lie... was kinda hoping it was

Tombstone is always effective though. How can one not be inspired by that mustache?

Apparently you care, or you wouldn't be trolling this guy. Or is there something more to it?

 

I don't actually know UGLYMRJ, but I do find many of his posts (including this one) interesting. But equally as interesting is the fact that there always seem to be one or two people in these threads attacking him over seemingly innocuous posts. He's just sharing some ideas with the player base regarding sorcs. Is it really worth your while to attack that? And if you disagree so much, why don't you roll a char on his server and show him what's what in pvp (or maybe you tried that, it didn't work out so well, hence the forum angst)?

I'm glad I'm not the only one that sees it... I sometimes wonder if I'm the one losing my mind.

Maybe but you wouldn't be viable for your dps? It would be the healing? Instead of adding more downtime to doing damage I'd rather do something passively. Maybe rework Devour so that it increases healing by current amount but applies that healing to your entire group and heals you for an extra 50%. As a DPS though I'd rather my team take me because of my DPS and not because of my healing. Another thought maybe make Death Mark a force resistance debuff that applies to all force damage and not just your DoTs? Dunno, I haven't thought about the problem of being wanted by a group as much as playing War Zones in PuGs.

I think it would honestly make it viable for both... more of a support class than it already is. It's capable of big numbers but lacks burst... but what if that burst was made up but high numbers all around.

The way I see it playing out... (Not saying it's a good or bad idea... just an idea)

Wrath is proc'd but you just used your crushing darkness and it's on CD. Throw a friendly a heal and get another wrath proc'd by the time crushing darkness is off CD. Yeah... sorcs would be capable of some sick DPS, which they already are but something like that could bump those off heal numbers from 100-250K (depending on the fight) to 300k+... add that on top of potential top DPS and I'd like to think that would outweigh the burst they lack and make a madness spec'd sorc viable for rated DPS.

it would be kinda op because you could cycle it on crushing darkness cd.

When bstun gets fixed, sorc/sage is probably gonna need something for survivability.

it would be kinda op because you could cycle it on crushing darkness cd.

 

When bstun gets fixed, sorc/sage is probably gonna need something for survivability.

I don't really see it as a survivability problem even though it could help... like I said though... I see it as a way to put up some nice healing numbers on top of some already nice DPS numbers to compensate for the burst that madness lacks.

Apparently you care, or you wouldn't be trolling this guy. Or is there something more to it?

 

I don't actually know UGLYMRJ, but I do find many of his posts (including this one) interesting. But equally as interesting is the fact that there always seem to be one or two people in these threads attacking him over seemingly innocuous posts. He's just sharing some ideas with the player base regarding sorcs. Is it really worth your while to attack that? And if you disagree so much, why don't you roll a char on his server and show him what's what in pvp (or maybe you tried that, it didn't work out so well, hence the forum angst)?

Not really, or I'd bump the posts, but that requires more effort than I care to use.

People attack him because that's all he did for months and months. He trolled to the high heavens back in May, I left the game soon after and didn't even look at it again until FTP. I wound up re-subbing only for PVE, but anybody that was around back then would remember him and since he was so annoying and is now being completely inconsistent (I guess he does that every 5 minutes though) some people will call him for it.

Remember if it's one or two people sure, you're justified in thinking it's them. When it's 4+ people as he's stated and the number keeps growing, it's him.

Not really, or I'd bump the posts, but that requires more effort than I care to use.

 

People attack him because that's all he did for months and months. He trolled to the high heavens back in May, I left the game soon after and didn't even look at it again until FTP. I wound up re-subbing only for PVE, but anybody that was around back then would remember him and since he was so annoying and is now being completely inconsistent (I guess he does that every 5 minutes though) some people will call him for it.

 

Remember if it's one or two people sure, you're justified in thinking it's them. When it's 4+ people as he's stated and the number keeps growing, it's him.

The funny thing is I'm probably one of the more open minded people on these forums and also one of the few to admit that I'm wrong...

Which makes these kinda attacks even funnier... but troll on friend. It's def good for a chuckle.