and what the heck is LBLO?????

Yes, i also hate random acronyms.

But it's Last boss Lockout.

It's sad that people don't get that an acronym is only used after you used the words themselves and from here onwards it will be adressed as the acronym. They think they are cool for using it, but they are really not. Just showing low linguistic level.

The difference is, who wants to carry bads through an sm op that might never get finished? They are not gonna learn anything if nobody is running pugs. People who know what they are doing will only run them with guildies and friends, because that way they mimimize the risk of wasting time by not completing it. I don't mind clearing sm ops with newcomers who are willing to learn and can do more than saber strike, but if I don't get anything out of it myself, like a chance to complete the ops or even a lock, I'll pass. It will be more and more difficult for new players to hop in and start clearing sm ops, and that will hurt the community in the long run.

Maybe then the "bads" will consider looking up a rotation, and checking out the operation on YT rather then expecting people to always carry them? Just a thought.

I like this idea, personally. I have nothing against conquest, if you're into it. I've gone for some titles occasionally. But LBLO runs are a way to cheese conquest.

Also, unlocking SM means you can practice on it more than once per week. iunno. I don't see the down side to legit game play.

I like this idea, personally. I have nothing against conquest, if you're into it. I've gone for some titles occasionally. But LBLO runs are a way to cheese conquest.

 

Also, unlocking SM means you can practice on it more than once per week. iunno. I don't see the down side to legit game play.

The downside is nobody trusts anyone's ability to complete an operation outside of EV and KP and a few more last bosses only. So for those of us who don't want to commit to a raiding schedule, this is reducing our pickup options.

Also frankly, the people aren't wrong. Most random groups are painfully slow or fold.

Maybe then the "bads" will consider looking up a rotation, and checking out the operation on YT rather then expecting people to always carry them? Just a thought.

Ideally yes, it would be great it they had to learn to complete an op. But the problem with a lot of bads is, they don't know they are bad. They waltzed through story with a healing companion (or bought a datacron), never had to use interrupts or cooldowns, never died when they were leveling. So they think they are good. If a group wipes in SM op, it's everyone else's fault.

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And to whoever thinks it's about conquest, it's not (apart from a handful major conquest guilds). people do LB runs to get CXP, to get gear. Had BW not made gearing up so grindy, people wouln't be doing LB runs as much as they do now.

Ideally yes, it would be great it they had to learn to complete an op. But the problem with a lot of bads is, they don't know they are bad. They waltzed through story with a healing companion (or bought a datacron), never had to use interrupts or cooldowns, never died when they were leveling. So they think they are good. If a group wipes in SM op, it's everyone else's fault.

 

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And to whoever thinks it's about conquest, it's not (apart from a handful major conquest guilds). people do LB runs to get CXP, to get gear. Had BW not made gearing up so grindy, people wouln't be doing LB runs as much as they do now.

BW gives you those rewards with the expectation that you will have run through the op. That cxp is tied to the last boss because he's the LAST boss...not the first boss of the night because you found a way to cheese the content.

The downside is nobody trusts anyone's ability to complete an operation outside of EV and KP and a few more last bosses only.

Not only that, but if new players manage to get into an ops with random people and make a mistake that wipe the group, they're gonna end up into a lot of ignore lists, and getting into groups is going to get even more difficult then.

Which reminds me: legacy ignore would be great if the lockouts are taken away. Or at least take off the 10 seconds wait we have when adding names to the list. I don't mind adding same names on my alts, but I don't get why I would have to wait for 10 seconds between adding them.

Not only that, but if new players manage to get into an ops with random people and make a mistake that wipe the group, they're gonna end up into a lot of ignore lists, and getting into groups is going to get even more difficult then.

 

Which reminds me: legacy ignore would be great if the lockouts are taken away. Or at least take off the 10 seconds wait we have when adding names to the list. I don't mind adding same names on my alts, but I don't get why I would have to wait for 10 seconds between adding them.

Nice way of adding to the point regarding which OPs will be devoid of life in the end.

If people can't work together to enjoy something and deal with their own issues instead of lashing out at others with that idiotic ignore feature, they shouldn't be there in the first place, it doesn't matter if they are new or a an experienced OPs player.

You are there to have fun and enjoy it, not to act like a fool.

Nice way of adding to the point regarding which OPs will be devoid of life in the end.

If people can't work together to enjoy something and deal with their own issues instead of lashing out at others with that idiotic ignore feature, they shouldn't be there in the first place, it doesn't matter if they are new or a an experienced OPs player.

 

You are there to have fun and enjoy it, not to act like a fool.

Lashing out is one thing, adding people to ignore list another. I for once never lash out to anyone, but people end up on my ignore list for lashing out to someone in the group. Being rude or toxic, and ignore list it is. However people never end up on my ignore list for making a mistake, they only end up there if they do it over and over again, and do not bother to listen to advice. It 's a group effort and if someone can't play in a group, I don't want to get grouped up with them again.

So please don't speak like you know me and my reactions, you clearly don't. I'm not saying there aren't people like you describe there, but it's probably a minority.

Maybe I'm hallucinating this, but aren't the devs completely reworking older operations so that they are back to their OG level (i.e. EC is level 50 again), then bolstering down players to the appropriate level?

Anywho, I'm expecting SM operations to be even easier, which is why lockouts won't be a thing anymore.

The difference is, who wants to carry bads through an sm op that might never get finished? They are not gonna learn anything if nobody is running pugs. People who know what they are doing will only run them with guildies and friends, because that way they mimimize the risk of wasting time by not completing it. I don't mind clearing sm ops with newcomers who are willing to learn and can do more than saber strike, but if I don't get anything out of it myself, like a chance to complete the ops or even a lock, I'll pass. It will be more and more difficult for new players to hop in and start clearing sm ops, and that will hurt the community in the long run.

To me a lot of blaming bads for their inexperience is like the time when people wouldn't take people in their pug groups on fleet without achievements. How could they get the experience if people wouldn't let them join?

So you're saying if LBLOs are removed there will be even less people forming groups because of the perceived majority of players that are bad holding them back, and the cycle continues that these players will never get better, they'll always be "bad" because too many "better" players keep finding ways/reasons to exclude them.

The LBLO system wasn't teaching them the ops, anyway. It was only teaching them how to cheese 80% of the operation (or get carried) so they never actually get any experience with the first 80% and very little learned from the last 20%.

What I'm saying is praising the LBLO system is weird from this experience standpoint. They weren't learning the ops this way. If they remove the LBLO system, they're going to need to learn the whole op, and maybe they'll actually get better seeing new mechanics (as long as they can't be ignored, but if they nerf SM that's a whole different story as to not preparing people for harder mechanics).

So they can either keep on with the LBLO only knowing 20% of any operation and still be "bad" whenever they actually run the whole thing, or be forced to learn 100% of them and will get more broad raiding experience and potentially get better or at least more well-rounded.

I just see the potential for better with this idea rather than trying to cater my experience to avoiding noobs (not newbs) and asking Bioware to further find more shortcuts to let people skip more content with max rewards.

On the one hand I'm perfectly happy teaching to someone that will listen.

On the other hand theres the 5th time I've wiped the minefield in EC because some dummy ran into it and the rest enraged the droid (and I'm the only one that knows how to run the puzzle in addition to being the only tank). It gets old, and fast.

Based on last PTS which had scaled EV & KP, yeah SM & Vet were a lot easier, although the way scaling works right now is inadequate, IMHO, as it hardcaps Master & Power, so relic procs and other boosts to those stats don't have an effect. I'm hoping all that gets fine tuned. The weird thing is that compared to scaled ops, the scaled heroics were actually kind of hard, felt noticeably harder that they do in live server.

I don't hate the idea of no more LBLO, but it will definitely affect my alts in a big way - I work full time+ and have plenty RL obligations, my time in game is limited, and LBLO help me cram my alts through enough content weekly to stay relevant.

To me a lot of blaming bads for their inexperience is like the time when people wouldn't take people in their pug groups on fleet without achievements. How could they get the experience if people wouldn't let them join?

So you're saying if LBLOs are removed there will be even less people forming groups because of the perceived majority of players that are bad holding them back, and the cycle continues that these players will never get better, they'll always be "bad" because too many "better" players keep finding ways/reasons to exclude them.

The LBLO system wasn't teaching them the ops, anyway. It was only teaching them how to cheese 80% of the operation (or get carried) so they never actually get any experience with the first 80% and very little learned from the last 20%.

 

What I'm saying is praising the LBLO system is weird from this experience standpoint. They weren't learning the ops this way. If they remove the LBLO system, they're going to need to learn the whole op, and maybe they'll actually get better seeing new mechanics (as long as they can't be ignored, but if they nerf SM that's a whole different story as to not preparing people for harder mechanics).

 

So they can either keep on with the LBLO only knowing 20% of any operation and still be "bad" whenever they actually run the whole thing, or be forced to learn 100% of them and will get more broad raiding experience and potentially get better or at least more well-rounded.

 

I just see the potential for better with this idea rather than trying to cater my experience to avoiding noobs (not newbs) and asking Bioware to further find more shortcuts to let people skip more content with max rewards.

The issue is not just LBLO, it's not having a lockout on any boss if the group fails. So the time spent in sm ops will be wasted if it never gets completed. It doesn't hurt me personally at all, as we are now getting CQ points from all content. I'll just stop doing sm ops with pugs completely to minimize the risk of wasting my time.

Last Boss Lock Outs only became popular because of 5.0's RNG gearing and Ossus timed weekly.

The removal of Story Mode Last Boss Lock Out seems to indicate that 6.0 gearing will be 5.0 and Ossus under a new name.

Last Boss Lock Outs only became popular because of 5.0's RNG gearing and Ossus timed weekly.

 

The removal of Story Mode Last Boss Lock Out seems to indicate that 6.0 gearing will 5.0 and Ossus under a new name.

I'll grant you that.

But guilds have been doing them long before 5.0 to help gear guild members up and to help teach them HOW to do an op in the first place.

So you feel that LBLO are not a good thing and that removing progression lockouts on story mode operations is a good thing? I think it is not.

The main reason is there is going to be an adjustment for everyone to get their new gear and any rotation changes and a story mode is a good place to get these changes tested. It is so easy to change the conquest objective to include more bosses to then comply with the objective than to change a critical aspect of the game.

The other reason is that it just might not matter if they level sinc to the original levels as the planetary level sync and normal level sync does not take into consideration your secondary stat balance. If it did then it would be hard to kill mobs as a seventy reduced to level twelve as it is for a level twelve.

Nearly all the bosses are tank and spank now with little dancing needed and that is why master and blaster beat pugs up because no one bothers to learn the fights. Put the original fights back to requiring the proper dance then people would know they can't just chees through ops. That is why blackwing Lair was one of my favorites in wow cause a level fifty raid ate up level 70, 80, and level 90 toons for lunch.

Operations should require you to do the dance.

Master mode flashpoints should require the dance as well.

Again it is easier to change a conquest goal to add more bosses to the list than mess with a system that may break operations altogether. Than again...

I see this as a bad idea. They want to push people to play group content, and then, after people find group content that they like (or can at least tolerate) they take it away. LOs are a way for casual or anti social players to see a little of the group content and maybe ease into playing full ops. It also helps those who have limited time get to conquest. Some people don't have the time to devote to a full run (especially of some of the longer ops). They may want to see some of it, and a LO allows that, even if it is only the last boss.

Don't take away our LOs!

Last Boss Lock Outs only became popular because of 5.0's RNG gearing and Ossus timed weekly.

 

The removal of Story Mode Last Boss Lock Out seems to indicate that 6.0 gearing will 5.0 and Ossus under a new name.

From what I saw in today's live stream, 6.0 gearing will be all about getting a lot of trash gear that you will want to dismantle to get tech credits to purchase other gear. So they are going for quantity over quality. Ossus was about getting better quality gear at a regulated pace.

Both methods lead to a grind for gear, and it is up to the individual player as to which method of gearing that they prefer.

In my opinion, the way gear was handled in 4.0 was the best that we have seen in this game so far, but sadly, those days are far behind us.

As far as last boss lockouts are concerned, I stopped doing sm ops because of them. I much prefer doing all bosses, and I don't like having to wait around while people wanting to get a lockout leave the op, and then need to requeue so that we can finish what we started. Or worse yet, people who just quit group before the last boss to save a lockout, leaving everyone not leaving to fend for themselves.

Yes, i also hate random acronyms.

 

But it's Last boss Lockout.

 

It's sad that people don't get that an acronym is only used after you used the words themselves and from here onwards it will be adressed as the acronym. They think they are cool for using it, but they are really not. Just showing low linguistic level.

It's also an unnecessarily long acronym. On my server it's just called LB runs. I mean, that's all it's about: the last boss. That it's a lockout run is already clear with that. So it's a bit ironic to see this oversized acronym. US servers perhaps?

Down with grouping up in game!

All hail the Elitists Solo MMO!

Why take away what SO many enjoy most in the game, LBLOs are great to fall back on at the end of the day, or even the end of the week... "Hey!, I still have an EC LBLO from Wednesday, wanna get a group together so I can burn it?"