How anyone could come up with the idea of having a space starfighter game and not include Stick/HOTAS/Rudder Peddle is so stupid it is beyond comprehension.

Bioware/EA seems to want to dumb everything down to the lowest common denominator and create products that are hot garbage. If you wan't Galactic Starfighter to succeed implement STICK/HOTAS/RUDDER support ASAP. Also include Track IR support.

Next how about implementing a HUD that ACTUALLY TELLS YOU SOMETHING. The fact that there is no speed indicator or any useful information on the HUD is face palm worthy.

If you catered to SPACE SIM and FLIGHT SIM enthusiasts, you would have a customer base of people that only played GSF. I know you are going to have some crybabies out there who say whaaa whaaa whaaa it is not fair, I do not have a Stick/HOTAS combo. Well Boo Freaking Hoo. Casual gamers are not who you should be marketing to, they get bored easily and move on to the next shiny toy that comes out. X-Wing VS Tie Fighter was a huge success, it had a huge community that played it for YEARS. If GSF was revamped into a proper sim it would attract players.

GSF is so bad and not fun to play, I will enter a match and just fly around and shoot at random things. I do not bother with trying to win, play the objectives, nothing. I am only there for the daily rewards and CXP points to level my toons. If it were actually fun to play I would invest serious time into learning the game.

There are plenty out there--me included--who strongly disagree with you. If it's one thing I've learned from the countless critiques GSF receives is that it is despised the most by those who understand it the least.

Pay attention to the recent posts by the Dev's regarding GSF and you will find 3 threads asking for specific feedback. If joystick support means that much to you I suggest you add your input to the pile. Rest assured there are already others who have voiced similar grievances. I don't share your opinion. Most of us who know how to play get along perfectly fine with a keyboard and mouse but I know this is a topic that has existed since GSF's launch and if there is a way to make the joystick people happy they should try to implement it.

If you catered to SPACE SIM and FLIGHT SIM enthusiasts, you would have a customer base of people that only played GSF. I know you are going to have some crybabies out there who say whaaa whaaa whaaa it is not fair, I do not have a Stick/HOTAS combo. Well Boo Freaking Hoo. Casual gamers are not who you should be marketing to, they get bored easily and move on to the next shiny toy that comes out. X-Wing VS Tie Fighter was a huge success, it had a huge community that played it for YEARS. If GSF was revamped into a proper sim it would attract players.

Is there room for a Star Wars themed space sim? Probably.

Will GSF be it? No. It makes no sense. Make it a game of its own, so it can have a suitable engine and be marketed to the right group of people.

Is stick support in GSF worth it? Wouldn't hurt, but it's probably hard to compete with mouse for shooting in the current implementation.

GSF is so bad and not fun to play, I will enter a match and just fly around and shoot at random things. I do not bother with trying to win, play the objectives, nothing. I am only there for the daily rewards and CXP points to level my toons. If it were actually fun to play I would invest serious time into learning the game.

Since the GSF rewards aren't that impressive when you just mindlessly fly around - have you considered doing something else with better rewards instead?

GSF is so bad and not fun to play, I will enter a match and just fly around and shoot at random things. I do not bother with trying to win, play the objectives, nothing. I am only there for the daily rewards and CXP points to level my toons. If it were actually fun to play I would invest serious time into learning the game.

If you frequently ruin 15 other people's experience by doing something you hate - over and over- then, with all due respect, maybe you need go home and re-think your life.

***WARNING*** This thread rehashes many old arguments! Engage at your own peril.

How anyone could come up with the idea of having a space starfighter game and not include Stick/HOTAS/Rudder Peddle is so stupid it is beyond comprehension.

Your comprehension skills need some work. Just because you don't like the control scheme doesn't mean it's wrong or works poorly. Freelancer worked spectacularly with mouse controls. It also had a very similar 3rd-person perspective for controlling your ship. Mouse control makes plenty of sense.

Bioware/EA seems to want to dumb everything down to the lowest common denominator and create products that are hot garbage. If you wan't Galactic Starfighter to succeed implement STICK/HOTAS/RUDDER support ASAP. Also include Track IR support.

Yes, expecting players of an F2P MMORPG to have/buy extra peripherals that are not used anywhere else in the game is a smart business decision.

...

Or not? GSF isn't designed to work with those systems from a conceptual standpoint or a mechanical one. It's not a flight sim. It's not a space sim. It's a tactical arcade space shooter. Or whatever. If you want a different sort of game, go play that kind of game. If you want to try something new and see if you can adapt your skills to succeed at it, maybe alter your approach.

Next how about implementing a HUD that ACTUALLY TELLS YOU SOMETHING. The fact that there is no speed indicator or any useful information on the HUD is face palm worthy.

There is plenty of useful information on the HUD. It doesn't represent your speed numerically, but you have a visual representation of the throttle which also shows when you're using your afterburners. I've played thousands of matches, and never once have I thought 'if only I knew my precise speed, I'd have handled that situation much differently.' I wouldn't mind if they showed your specific speed, but it is in no way necessary to gameplay.

The HUD shows: your throttle setting, your shield strength across both arcs, your hull strength, your active weapons, your abilities, your current target, a lead reticle to fire at, the range to your target, the firing arc of your Primary and Secondary weapons, the buffs/debuffs on your current target, the buffs/debuffs on your ship, who your current target is targeting, a minimap with all ships in sensor range represented and their facing, the direction of any weapons fire you're taking, whether you are currently being missile-locked, your Weapon Power Pool, your Engine Power Pool, the location of the three nodes A B C in Domination matches... and probably more stuff. I guess none of that is useful to you?

GSF is not a space sim. It is not scientifically modeling space flight. Don't expect it to behave like one or offer the same kind of information a simulation would.

If you catered to SPACE SIM and FLIGHT SIM enthusiasts,

...you'd probably want to make a game that is a space sim, or a flight sim. GSF is neither.

you would have a customer base of people that only played GSF. I know you are going to have some crybabies out there who say whaaa whaaa whaaa it is not fair, I do not have a Stick/HOTAS combo. Well Boo Freaking Hoo.

Your whole post is a mean-spirited, whiny rant about why you want things to be precisely your way or no way at all, and you expect people to respond positively to this?

Casual gamers are not who you should be marketing to, they get bored easily and move on to the next shiny toy that comes out. X-Wing VS Tie Fighter was a huge success,

...In 1997

Twenty years ago.

it had a huge community that played it for YEARS. If GSF was revamped into a proper sim it would attract players.

So you think it is smart to stick a space simulator that requires a wholly different set of peripherals into a F2P MMORPG? How about you go make an MMORPG, aim it at a casual player base, cultivate a general feel of 'this game is easy to play and get into and can be played without much study' and THEN stick a complex space simulator inside it that relies on precise numeric readouts and uses no controls that are pertinent to the rest of the game. Let's see how well you do!

GSF is often cited as 'hard to get into' as is. Adding more layers of complexity on top of that would be insane.

GSF is so bad and not fun to play,

...that you won't play it, right? Right?

I will enter a match and just fly around and shoot at random things. I do not bother with trying to win, play the objectives, nothing.

Oh. So griefing everyone who does enjoy the game is a proper and responsible thing to do, and a productive way to spend your time.

Go away. Stop playing a game you don't like. Leave. Exit. You are not wanted. You are making the situation worse.

I am only there for the daily rewards and CXP points to level my toons. If it were actually fun to play I would invest serious time into learning the game.

Who cares? You come here, demand a game other than the one that exists, and publicly admit to making the gameplay experience of everyone around you worse.

Go.

Leave.

Stop playing it. Let people who actually enjoy this non-space-sim play the game that exists while you go find something that fits your narrow view of what is 'fun.' You have plenty of options these days. Good luck.

- Despon

There is plenty of useful information on the HUD. It doesn't represent your speed numerically, but you have a visual representation of the throttle which also shows when you're using your afterburners. I've played thousands of matches, and never once have I thought 'if only I knew my precise speed, I'd have handled that situation much differently.' I wouldn't mind if they showed your specific speed, but it is in no way necessary to gameplay.

 

The HUD shows: your throttle setting, your shield strength across both arcs, your hull strength, your active weapons, your abilities, your current target, a lead reticle to fire at, the range to your target, the firing arc of your Primary and Secondary weapons, the buffs/debuffs on your current target, the buffs/debuffs on your ship, who your current target is targeting, a minimap with all ships in sensor range represented and their facing, the direction of any weapons fire you're taking, whether you are currently being missile-locked, your Weapon Power Pool, your Engine Power Pool, the location of the three nodes A B C in Domination matches... and probably more stuff. I guess none of that is useful to you?

- Despon

Numbers for shield and hull remaining might be useful, sometimes qualitative representations are worse than quantitative. Numerical speed is not necessary since we don't have precise throttle control.

The HUD could also be more useful if it told people when their perfectly fired shot was Evaded.

But otherwise, Despon is right. My X52 Pro collects dust, despite the fact that Saitek even updated the software for Win 10. I'm sad about that, and I tried to get joystick support when GSF was beta, but that ship has sailed, and arguably for the better.

Go see the Developer-created Friction Points thread or the joystick thread for all sorts of logical reasoned responses as to why there is and should not be joystick support in GSF, if you care to actually "discuss" anything beyond your angry rant.

I think GSF not being 100% percent user friendly is one of the things that I like about it. My main pet peefe is that it's still based around the Battle of Kuat (and that both Admirals are no longer associated with their respective factions, and one is dead). I'd certainly be able to get into it more, if it felt more current.

Unfortunately that's true about all of the repeatable end game content in the game. Look at the alderaan civil war warzone... however, with Bors Ulgo deposed, and the Star Fortress over Alderaan destroyed, it isn't implausible that the war for the throne heats up again. Consider Novare Coast... that the battle over critical Baradium deposits on Denova with Kephess dead and the Warstalkers part of the Alliance could continue. With the Eternal Empire being defeated, the arms race could certainly ramp up again and Kuat would obviously have strategic value ... I mean KDY stays influential for the next 3000 years. So, it doesn't take a lot of suspension of disbelief to think the space battles could still be going on. And, depending on your choices, both admirals could be very much alive. Assuming you save her, it's not like she physically stays on Odessen. You do run into an issue if your version of the Eternal Alliance sides with the Empire on Iokath. But, that is the pitfall with the evolution of a story based MMO.

EDIT: I mean I guess they could record new voice over for the battles to make them generic Republic or Imperial admirals instead of Zasha Ranken and Bey'wan Aygo. But I would miss Steve Blum telling me to "don't quit, keep fighting!"

Unfortunately that's true about all of the repeatable end game content in the game. Look at the alderaan civil war warzone... however, with Bors Ulgo deposed, and the Star Fortress over Alderaan destroyed, it isn't implausible that the war for the throne heats up again. Consider Novare Coast... that the battle over critical Baradium deposits on Denova with Kephess dead and the Warstalkers part of the Alliance could continue. With the Eternal Empire being defeated, the arms race could certainly ramp up again and Kuat would obviously have strategic value ... I mean KDY stays influential for the next 3000 years. So, it doesn't take a lot of suspension of disbelief to think the space battles could still be going on. And, depending on your choices, both admirals could be very much alive. Assuming you save her, it's not like she physically stays on Odessen. You do run into an issue if your version of the Eternal Alliance sides with the Empire on Iokath. But, that is the pitfall with the evolution of a story based MMO.

 

EDIT: I mean I guess they could record new voice over for the battles to make them generic Republic or Imperial admirals instead of Zasha Ranken and Bey'wan Aygo. But I would miss Steve Blum telling me to "don't quit, keep fighting!"

I personally run under the assumption that if a character could possibly die, they *probably* did/have. That aside, while I do enjoy GSF, and understand the contextual (and temporal) importance of KDY, it seems a bit absurd that all space battles are in the Kuat System (even if most of them are). Perhaps a few once and again could happen somewhere a bit more unconventional. I wouldn't mind skirmishing over Hoth, with an accuracy debuff, or something.

Well, somehow this thread still exists. So I may as well talk a bit.

How anyone could come up with the idea of having a space starfighter game and not include Stick/HOTAS/Rudder Peddle is so stupid it is beyond comprehension.

You should probably read my "A word to the joystick botherers" thread:

http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=926753

This thread has already brought up the big points- that if you go through all the effort needed technically to add analog joystick support to SWTOR in every version of Windows it runs in, and then the only thing you do with that is have it as an auxiliary control scheme for GSF, you have screwed up badly, PLUS if you do joysticks properly, they will be necessary to do well in GSF (and if you do them IMPROPERLY, you end up with people complaining about how they are treated badly). It's a mile of development for an inch of game value.

We already live in a world where people complain that they can't play GSF. Because of gear (no longer an issue, but people still complain), p2w ships (never an issue at all), and all manner of other objectively wrong things. Why add "I can't afford a $250 HOTAS" to this list?

Bioware/EA seems to want to dumb everything down to the lowest common denominator and create products that are hot garbage. If you wan't Galactic Starfighter to succeed implement STICK/HOTAS/RUDDER support ASAP.

You think GSF's issue is that it is "dumbed down"? This is a segment of the game that offers free threespace flight. There are still pilots that spiral into rocks immediately. Preparing the players for something that is a hybrid of MMO combat, arcade space sim, and third person shooter is already a huge challenge for the playerbase. Actually implementing what you ask for would widen an already gaping chasm.

Also include Track IR support.

Adding joystick support already ads a new control scheme, now they need to add a new visual output scheme? Good grief. I will say this: this is your second best idea in the thread. It's still a large amount of development and would need a new way to handle freelook just for it, but at least in theory you could add it without changing the design totally or adding huge balance issues. It would also be a minor benefit at best. Still, merely an impractical idea, and it would be fun.

Next how about implementing a HUD that ACTUALLY TELLS YOU SOMETHING. The fact that there is no speed indicator or any useful information on the HUD is face palm worthy.

The GUI piece you need is actually distinction from miss/evade. Adding numbers to shields, especially with the colorblind-unfriendly current state, would be your second one. Adding a speed number wouldn't hurt, and is technically your best idea in the thread, because it would add to the GUI something useful, have no balance implications, and not require a mile of development.

If you catered to SPACE SIM and FLIGHT SIM enthusiasts, you would have a customer base of people that only played GSF.

To a great degree, they already do. This section of the game has a group of really dedicated players who really like the arcade space sim aspects. But you can't really add or subtract more, and the fact that they have given us what they have is already monumental. Think about how damned derp so much of this game is. How much grinding (and social cost) you have to do to find pve content that is challenging and interesting. How much practice you need to stay on top of pvp and its reasonably harsh balance. GSF offers you an experience similar to that once you have reasonably mastered its control scheme, and you can compete meaningfully on a pretty fresh character. The game has already made several unforgiving choices, such as allowing roll and pitch instead of a 2D playing field with 3D graphics, or any of the other nonsense you find in most pop games. This game really stretches what can be presented to an MMO playerbase, and it does it really well.

I know you are going to have some crybabies out there who say whaaa whaaa whaaa it is not fair, I do not have a Stick/HOTAS combo. Well Boo Freaking Hoo.

It's a pretty valid complaint, given that the game's audience is drawn from SWTOR players. GSF doesn't need another arbitrary barrier to entrance, given that it has several legitimate ones drawn from its nature, that can't be avoided without deleting the game. Adding a huge one like this really IS a big deal, and if you can't see that, you are being very selfish.

Casual gamers are not who you should be marketing to, they get bored easily and move on to the next shiny toy that comes out.

There's a difference between marketing to casual gamers and making the game very hard for them to approach. GSF is meaningfully f2p. You can make a new account, create a character, play GSF, and get to maximum everything in it. The rest of the game offers you nothing like this.

X-Wing VS Tie Fighter was a huge success, it had a huge community that played it for YEARS. If GSF was revamped into a proper sim it would attract players.

I know you guys occasionally come around and poop on the game, but I've never seen any evidence that you would spend any time or money on GSF if it did what you wanted. I've seen plenty of evidence that players would be pushed away by requiring a HOTAS. I already farm super hard, what could I accomplish if I could plug my HOTAS in and get 0-order control to my ship's controls, while mouse guys on strike fighters are chasing a reticule around? If it was done correctly, a HOTAS would be an absolute necessity. If it was done wrong, it would be the subject of massive amounts of threads and complaints.

GSF is so bad and not fun to play, I will enter a match and just fly around and shoot at random things.

If it's so easy and casual, why not master it real fast? Why not show everyone how to be super great at the game, and then preach from that pulpit?

I do not bother with trying to win, play the objectives, nothing. I am only there for the daily rewards and CXP points to level my toons. If it were actually fun to play I would invest serious time into learning the game.

You are basically bragging about griefing a community because the devs couldn't cater to you on control scheme. Even though the game has three space controls, good physics, a good diversity of ship and component choices, different maps, excellent team play, the power settings and fore/aft-split shielding you love from the X-Wing days, full access to numbers on the paper doll, numerous tweaks possible with crew members and upgrades, variable pitch and yaw by ship type, better pitch than yaw unlike some competitors... even though it has the realistic and unrealistic pieces you DO love from the XvT days, you can't get over not having a joystick to farm foodships, and as a result, screw us all.

Pathetic.

Well Denon Exosphere isn't at Kuat. AFAIK Lost Shipyards isn't either.

So, three system rotation?

 

GSF is so bad and not fun to play, I will enter a match and just fly around and shoot at random things. I do not bother with trying to win, play the objectives, nothing. I am only there for the daily rewards and CXP points to level my toons. If it were actually fun to play I would invest serious time into learning the game.

That's an honest response and based on what I read of the replies, you guys are missing the bottom line.

Even last night I had matches that were not fun to play at all, and a few of those I was on the winning side. If winning matches can lack enjoyment it should not be a stretch to hear when someone expresses their dissatisfaction.

Disclaimer: After being gone about a year to find a bug from 3.0 still persisting and gsf items I had purchased gone from my hangar I'm not inclined to defend GSF in any way.

That's an honest response and based on what I read of the replies, you guys are missing the bottom line.

 

Even last night I had matches that were not fun to play at all, and a few of those I was on the winning side. If winning matches can lack enjoyment it should not be a stretch to hear when someone expresses their dissatisfaction.

 

Disclaimer: After being gone about a year to find a bug from 3.0 still persisting and gsf items I had purchased gone from my hangar I'm not inclined to defend GSF in any way.

An honest response does not make it good, or fair. That he is dissatisfied is understandable. That he throws games because of that is not.

No one is forced to play. If he doesn't enjoy GSF, he can stop queueing! He could also present his issues, but throwing matches is, I'm pretty sure, against the SWTOR RoC.

The issues that plague you are not related to most new players. Most of them haven't played since 3.0 and haven't purchased any GSF items.

You know what? I completely forgot this was even a thing.

The only time I ever knew about GSF was from a keyboard slip up, nobody ever talks about it at all.

Seems a shame if it's as bad as people in this topic make out as the solo on rails space combat has limited appeal.

Seems a shame if it's as bad as people in this topic make out as the solo on rails space combat has limited appeal.

Fun

Good

Bad

What are these? Define them, then ask someone else to define them, then another person. Try a hundred. See if you get a coherent, focused response.

SWTOR is a pretty bad RTS game, right? And it's a terrible example of a Racing Simulator. It has vehicles, so it's a racing sim, right? What a shame. If only they had made it a good RTS and Racing Sim, it would have captured the audience that loves those.

GSF is a PvP arcade space shooter with strong tactical elements. Though there are balance issues (find me a game where there aren't balance issues) it is still 'fun' to a population of gamers that enjoy the sort of challenges that it provides. The underlying game design, if evaluated on its own merits and not in comparison to genres where it clearly is not intended to compete, is well thought out. It's appealing enough to a particular audience to have retained that audience despite the many challenges they have faced.

I don't like the ground game. I grew tired of the story parts of the ground game, and never cared for raiding or other experiences that the typical MMORPG game provides. I don't feel compelled to go into the ground game forums and dump all over it just because it exists. I can recognize that it is not for me, and that other people may find it rewarding and 'fun.' Is this so difficult of an ethos to embrace?

- Despon

Not entirely sure I deserved that snarky onslaught tbh.

I didn't murder your daughter brah, it was somebody else.

An honest response does not make it good, or fair. That he is dissatisfied is understandable. That he throws games because of that is not.

 

No one is forced to play. If he doesn't enjoy GSF, he can stop queueing! He could also present his issues, but throwing matches is, I'm pretty sure, against the SWTOR RoC.

 

The issues that plague you are not related to most new players. Most of them haven't played since 3.0 and haven't purchased any GSF items.

Now someone's jumping to conclusions - he never stated he intentionally threw matches. Sure not focusing on objectives doesn't help, but when there are only two modes and one is literally flying around and shooting at others he's not throwing matches, as opposed to someone committing suicide repeatedly. In a sat match teams can be so one-sided that the opposing ships can never make it to the sats anyway. Regardless, flying around and attempting to shoot stuff is still participation.

Not entirely sure I deserved that snarky onslaught tbh.

 

I didn't murder your daughter brah, it was somebody else.

Sometimes our players can be a tad too passionate. And while those people tend to be the ones that only enjoy just the GSF aspect of swtor, they're very few in number. When a 3.0 bug persists in 5.0, you really know just how far down the list the game mode is. At least GSF is more popular than Space Missions.

Now someone's jumping to conclusions - he never stated he intentionally threw matches. Sure not focusing on objectives doesn't help, but when there are only two modes and one is literally flying around and shooting at others he's not throwing matches, as opposed to someone committing suicide repeatedly. In a sat match teams can be so one-sided that the opposing ships can never make it to the sats anyway. Regardless, flying around and attempting to shoot stuff is still participation.

GSF is so bad and not fun to play, I will enter a match and just fly around and shoot at random things. I do not bother with trying to win, play the objectives, nothing. I am only there for the daily rewards and CXP points to level my toons. If it were actually fun to play I would invest serious time into learning the game.

Let's read together. He never said he's shooting at people, only "random things" (which well could be rocks or shiny glowing purple and blue orbs). He specifically said he will not bother with trying to win or playing objectives. Now, you can defend him, but you're wrong. He is throwing matches. Taking the spot of a contributer (or even someone trying to contribute) and doing none of that is throwing a match.

I'm sure you'll enjoy having him on your team when facing the dreaded premades though.

Sometimes our players can be a tad too passionate. And while those people tend to be the ones that only enjoy just the GSF aspect of swtor, they're very few in number. When a 3.0 bug persists in 5.0, you really know just how far down the list the game mode is. At least GSF is more popular than Space Missions.

I believe my level of passion is perfectly calibrated for the moment at hand. Someone who admittedly never played GSF or even really thought about it came in here, assumed it was 'bad' (because people who complain on the internet are never wrong) and then talked about murdering my daughter or something, which gives me a pretty good indication my initial response was properly targeted. My thoughts were not expressly reserved for him, as that sentiment has been prevalent enough elsewhere as evidenced by the thread title.

Popularity is not an indicator of quality. If it was, then we could safely declare Candy Crush Saga with its 93 million users the best game of all time, and start some threads about how GSF needs more candy, and definitely requires more crushing. And a saga.

- Despon

Let's read together. He never said he's shooting at people, only "random things" (which well could be rocks or shiny glowing purple and blue orbs). He specifically said he will not bother with trying to win or playing objectives. Now, you can defend him, but you're wrong. He is throwing matches. Taking the spot of a contributer (or even someone trying to contribute) and doing none of that is throwing a match.

 

I'm sure you'll enjoy having him on your team when facing the dreaded premades though.

Isn't that a little negative, to automatically assume that shooting random things aren't ships or mines? I mean flying around and shooting at an asteroid wasn't the first image that came to mind and there isn't a lot else to shoot at given how empty space is. If he's shooting at things out of range that's no different than a new pilot. If we classify him as throwing matches because he's flying around shooting aimlessly - that would include virtually every new pilot. I've seen plenty of people try that were completely ineffective.

As for "dreaded pre-mades", I've already been up against and with drak since coming back. Both matches were boring, either there was no challenge and pursuing active targets would be cruel given their circumstance or my team was utterly obliterated having no chance at all. Sure, I could swap to a gunship and net some kills but if your team isn't skilled enough you end up just adding losses to your record.

Frankly I would say the lop-sided matches do far more damage than someone barely putting effort - people are a lot more likely to try when they see opportunity to win.

I believe my level of passion is perfectly calibrated for the moment at hand. Someone who admittedly never played GSF or even really thought about it came in here, assumed it was 'bad' (because people who complain on the internet are never wrong) and then talked about murdering my daughter or something, which gives me a pretty good indication my initial response was properly targeted. My thoughts were not expressly reserved for him, as that sentiment has been prevalent enough elsewhere as evidenced by the thread title.

 

Popularity is not an indicator of quality. If it was, then we could safely declare Candy Crush Saga with its 93 million users the best game of all time, and start some threads about how GSF needs more candy, and definitely requires more crushing. And a saga.

 

- Despon

He was stating that as a swtor player he had even forgotten the mode existed - a harmless statement and actual feedback that could be used to help give GSF more visibility to the player base and potentially net new pilots.

Your response was taken as hostile, as if he had murdered your daughter. A poor analogy but he simply was stating your response was really hostile when his initial comment was not even a personal attack directed at you.

Candy Crush makes money and gets support. GSF still can't get a bug fixed from 3.0 when its now 5.3. We may find GSF far more enjoyable but that doesn't make Candy Crush less successful. Appealing to the masses isn't everything, but appealing to a small niche in a declining population doesn't stand for much either.

Appealing to the masses isn't everything, but appealing to a small niche in a declining population doesn't stand for much either.

Are you seriously in this thread playing devil's advocate to defend an OP who deliberately ignores the point of the game out of spite because he wants GSF to be a space simulator and not the game it is? Do you want to know what an even more niche population is? Dudes with flightsticks.

In a sensible world, GSF would be a standalone game and not shoved into a corner of an MMORPG. The world is anything but sensible, so we have what we have, which is a game that at its core is well conceived. Some people expected or wanted a different sort of thing from 'space combat in SWTOR,' but some people liked and continue to like the thing that exists. Some people are indifferent and don't care about space combat games, because they are here to play an MMORPG. That group is by far the largest.

GSF is not going to become a space simulator, and it's not going to become Battlefront's shallow-but-pretty space combat thing either. It is going to remain the sort of game that it is, and the best possible outcome is that it fulfills that concept. Right now, the people who may have an interest in GSF have a choice: learn to play the game as it is, or don't. The former produces better results and yields more 'fun' for the sort of people who want to play the game that GSF is. Those that don't find it 'fun' ought to spend their time playing something that they like.

- Despon

Isn't that a little negative, to automatically assume that shooting random things aren't ships or mines? I mean flying around and shooting at an asteroid wasn't the first image that came to mind and there isn't a lot else to shoot at given how empty space is. If he's shooting at things out of range that's no different than a new pilot. If we classify him as throwing matches because he's flying around shooting aimlessly - that would include virtually every new pilot. I've seen plenty of people try that were completely ineffective.

 

As for "dreaded pre-mades", I've already been up against and with drak since coming back. Both matches were boring, either there was no challenge and pursuing active targets would be cruel given their circumstance or my team was utterly obliterated having no chance at all. Sure, I could swap to a gunship and net some kills but if your team isn't skilled enough you end up just adding losses to your record.

 

Frankly I would say the lopsided matches do far more damage than someone barely putting effort - people are a lot more likely to try when they see opportunity to win.

No. Are we both talking about the same player? The one who called the game a "steaming hot pile of garbage"? I think it's pretty justified to assume he doesn't care about shooting at actual targets.

He's different from a new player, because a new player actually tries. He doesn't. He states as much himself, I don't know why you refuse to acknowledge it. That is throwing matches. A new player may be incompetent, but they're not " throwing" (i.e losing on purpose) anything. The comparison is ridiculous.

It seems like it doesn't matter to you, but I'd rather have players who actually try on my team regardless of skill. When I look at a scoreboard after a match and see someone who did horribly, but I saw them ask questions during the match, I'm ok with that. When I see someone circling around themselves firing RFL, I'm not.

Also, you're dead wrong about players not putting effort. On SL, impside used to die every time a certain individual was queued. All they did was drift in space, die by enemy (or rock, if no enemy got the in minute or so) and respawn. I've never seen queues die as fast to premades.