No, you don't have to do MP if you want a "challenge", but this is an MMO, not a Single Player game like Assassins Creed. Don't force everyone else to play as you play.

 

If all you care about is a challenge in everything then you completely miss the point of playing a video game. Escape, relax, story, and fun. Not making everything you do a "challenge". HM and NiM modes are there if you want a challenge so bad. Dismiss your companion, remove some gear, etc. That will give you a challenge.

 

It's a GAME, not a ego contest. Only a minority of this game want such a challenge. Furthermore, it defeats the entire purpose of maxing companion affection if you can't be OP while doing personal content. That is your REWARD for all your hard work. A reward many of us enjoy and want. If you don't want it, then don't get any affection.

 

Grouping doesn't make content easy, in fact, it can bring a pile of headaches.

 

Don't force everyone to play as I play then tell me I miss the point of playing a video game because I don't play it for the reasons you do? Hypocrite much?

 

Who is forcing anyone to play as I do? The content was designed as challenging, people caused an uproar over it ( mostly because BW stuffed up in the first place and gave everyone god mode access to it ) and now the content that was designed with people who wanted challenging content in mind has been changed to suit those that don't - that in effect is forcing people who enjoy solo challenge play to play the "easy mode" way.

 

HM/NIm is group content ... though we'd covered that.

Removing gear or dismissing companion ... I have to take short cuts to enjoy the content the way it was originally designed? Why couldn't those that want easy content go run story content again or classes they haven't? Run around the open world and kill a few korslugs? Works both ways.

 

Yes a minority wanted to enjoy the minority of content that was challenging. That now equates to basically 1 thing as challenging solo play - HM SF and even that isn't overly challenging again.

 

Grouping makes content simple unless it's things like operations or HM FPs or even tactical to a degree ... thinking of the palyers who have an inability to work with others. With the Heroics on the other hand there is no challenge to grouping beyond grouping itself.

I think scarlet was speaking to ease of completion, not difficulty level.

 

Yes I was, thank you.

Thanks. Happy Thanksgiving!

Pets n EQ2 were similar for Necros and Conjies. Thing is, even in WoW you had to do things to keep that pet alive such as heal it (if I remember correctly) so you sttil had to engage actively in the encounter...if I remember correctly. My issue was that they had become more than pets. Yes not in every encounter but in a majority, it was possible for it to be a largely passive experience here. I have never seen that before and hope to never see it again.

 

The point is that was the past; I am talking about the present. In the past in WoW, you had to heal but you rarely need to anymore. Buffs for the tanking skills/stamina/armor of the pet along with Spirit Bond Talent (completely passively generates 2% of you and your pets health every 2 seconds) If you pull a lot, you might need to heal, but that is not the norm.

 

Wow replaced the 40+ talents with 7 choices of one of three talents and Blizzard insures there is at least one passive talent option per choice that does not require an elitist button press to activate.

 

Besides, there is still the point that you can level from 90 to 100 without leaving your instanced garrison or engaging in combat. From your garrison table, you can send followers on facebook-type missions to get LFR (storymode raid) gear. How is being able to get to max level and get equipped with raid gear without ever entering combat harder than 4.0.0??? Note you can hit max level without combat in GW2, LotRo, STO et al, but the raid gear from garrisons is WoW.

 

IMO, people who think 4.0.0 was significantly easier or more passive than you optionally could play in the much larger World of Warcraft are either very out of touch with WoW 2015 or misrepresenting things.

Don't force everyone to play as I play then tell me I miss the point of playing a video game because I don't play it for the reasons you do? Hypocrite much?

 

Who is forcing anyone to play as I do? The content was designed as challenging, people caused an uproar over it ( mostly because BW stuffed up in the first place and gave everyone god mode access to it ) and now the content that was designed with people who wanted challenging content in mind has been changed to suit those that don't - that in effect is forcing people who enjoy solo challenge play to play the "easy mode" way.

 

HM/NIm is group content ... though we'd covered that.

Removing gear or dismissing companion ... I have to take short cuts to enjoy the content the way it was originally designed? Why couldn't those that want easy content go run story content again or classes they haven't? Run around the open world and kill a few korslugs? Works both ways.

 

Yes a minority wanted to enjoy the minority of content that was challenging. That now equates to basically 1 thing as challenging solo play - HM SF and even that isn't overly challenging again.

 

Grouping makes content simple unless it's things like operations or HM FPs or even tactical to a degree ... thinking of the palyers who have an inability to work with others. With the Heroics on the other hand there is no challenge to grouping beyond grouping itself.

 

The only thing I would say is this. I think the issue regarding challenge is largely an consequence of introducing the OP companions in the first place. Yes that minority that would have found the missions bonafidely difficult, the ones Michael said the expected NOT to enjoy the content, would have been upset. Most of those against the idea of challenge though, I believe, would have done what they did last expac, complain about the grind then move on, simply because they would not have known the difference.

 

However introducing the broken companions created a false impression in their minds as to what the difficulty should have been. Initially they could not believe BW intended a challenge (all the "they only did this because of cries from elitists crap.) This reinforced a " we were done dirty" attitude and all the hyperbole etc and all of this combined did what it typically did in humans, especially those in the anonymous environment of the internet, people dug in their heels and yelled even louder.

Edited November 25, 2015 by Ghisallo

Don't force everyone to play as I play then tell me I miss the point of playing a video game because I don't play it for the reasons you do? Hypocrite much?

 

Who is forcing anyone to play as I do? The content was designed as challenging, people caused an uproar over it ( mostly because BW stuffed up in the first place and gave everyone god mode access to it ) and now the content that was designed with people who wanted challenging content in mind has been changed to suit those that don't - that in effect is forcing people who enjoy solo challenge play to play the "easy mode" way.

 

HM/NIm is group content ... though we'd covered that.

Removing gear or dismissing companion ... I have to take short cuts to enjoy the content the way it was originally designed? Why couldn't those that want easy content go run story content again or classes they haven't? Run around the open world and kill a few korslugs? Works both ways.

 

Yes a minority wanted to enjoy the minority of content that was challenging. That now equates to basically 1 thing as challenging solo play - HM SF and even that isn't overly challenging again.

 

Grouping makes content simple unless it's things like operations or HM FPs or even tactical to a degree ... thinking of the palyers who have an inability to work with others. With the Heroics on the other hand there is no challenge to grouping beyond grouping itself.

This is where a toggle option comes in. That way people could play how they want without effecting others.

 

Also, sorry for bring a ***** before.

Apparently so is taking the time to kill things then heal so lets get rid of that as well is my point ( in response to everyone who thought nerfed companions was tedious as it took more time ).

Killing things wouldn't be tedious if the combat was fun. Games with WoW like combat are annoying. If I am playing a Jedi I want to feel like I am playing a Jedi and not have to push buttons.

 

I want a combat system like Kingdom Hearts II, Heavenly Blade, Force Unleashed, etc. The blaster classes could have been done like the shooting in Mass Effect 2 or 3.

 

If a Mass Effect MMO does ever come out it can't be like TOR. It has to have the gameplay of ME 2 or 3.

The point is that was the past; I am talking about the present. In the past in WoW, you had to heal but you rarely need to anymore. Buffs for the tanking skills/stamina/armor of the pet along with Spirit Bond Talent (completely passively generates 2% of you and your pets health every 2 seconds) If you pull a lot, you might need to heal, but that is not the norm.

 

Wow replaced the 40+ talents with 7 choices of one of three talents and Blizzard insures there is at least one passive talent option per choice that does not require an elitist button press to activate.

 

Besides, there is still the point that you can level from 90 to 100 without leaving your instanced garrison or engaging in combat. From your garrison table, you can send followers on facebook-type missions to get LFR (storymode raid) gear. How is being able to get to max level and get equipped with raid gear without ever entering combat harder than 4.0.0??? Note you can hit max level without combat in GW2, LotRo, STO et al, but the raid gear from garrisons is WoW.

 

IMO, people who think 4.0.0 was significantly easier or more passive than you optionally could play in the much larger World of Warcraft are either very out of touch with WoW 2015 or misrepresenting things.

 

Well clearly no logical conversation is capable here because you can't even use the term elitist properly. An elitist is not based around how one plays or one's opinion but rather how you treat another player because they feel they are superior to others.

 

That said you have a particular duty atm. You are making a claim that a change has occurred that has made the warlock a ZERO button spec. Not simply a one or two button but zero, when you are not over geared/level for a group of mobs (remember the content in question has groups with golds and silvers). Since NO ONE else is making this claim you have to present proof of this sea change in the mechanics. If not it is exaggeration at best an out right lie at worse. Especially since I have been checking every resource possible and NOTHING substantiates this at all. Even with the passive you note there are solo mobs that do FAR more damage than 2% of you and/or your companions health every 2 seconds. Using that passive as a reason is simply ludricrous.

 

Your last part is also a complete strawman and further supports the fact that you are at least exaggerating. If you were accurate then it would not be necessary to engage in such obvious strawmaning. How straw manning?

 

1. We are not talking about how you level of gear up. We are talking about how easy combat is, that combat should not be an entirely passive/voyeristic experience and no game... Not even WoW, allows combat to be a COMPLETELY passive experience.

2. Strawmaning continues because in GW 2 to level you still have to do something... Craft. Lotro the same (though the exp simply is pretty horrid after level 55).

 

I could go on but there is so much factually wrong and/or unsupported as well as strawmaning going on in your post that, as I said, any reasoned debate is impossible.

 

That all said I can appreciate if you have an issue with the Mission content difficulty and think it inappropriate. The problem is that making companions so they can complete much of it doesn't stay there...it cascades up the chain of progression they have and causes problems in each

 

So in reality, like most, your issue is really that BW has a different vision for SWTOR as a game than you do dead stop. As such, especially if your spurious comment bout the warlock was true, who is the one who logically should go elsewhere?

Edited November 25, 2015 by Ghisallo

Please DEVs make achievement for "Complete Heroic 2+ without companion". This will give us (hardcore players) a reason to play and struggle. All content in the game became too easy for me so I want it to be more challenging.

As far as I can see, it is impossible for you to nerf companions (again) coz you will lose newbies and softcore players. But what if you just add a new achievement? This will be super cool.

Deleted... Misread Edited November 25, 2015 by Ghisallo

Please DEVs make achievement for "Complete Heroic 2+ without companion". This will give us (hardcore players) a reason to play and struggle. All content in the game became too easy for me so I want it to be more challenging.

As far as I can see, it is impossible for you to nerf companions (again) coz you will lose newbies and softcore players. But what if you just add a new achievement? This will be super cool.

 

You can still do some of the H2+s without companion these changes didn't have any effect on level sync.

You can still do some of the H2+s without companion these changes didn't have any effect on level sync.

 

I can do ALL heroics without companion. By ALL I really mean all. And how can I prove it? Only "fraps or never happen". I want others players to see that I can. And I want to find others who also can. I am pretty sure there are many like me but not so many as softcore players.

So all as in SF and Makeb? including the one with Vents?

I can do ALL heroics without companion. By ALL I really mean all. And how can I prove it? Only "fraps or never happen". I want others players to see that I can. And I want to find others who also can. I am pretty sure there are many like me but not so many as softcore players.

Why do you care and want others to know you can?

 

I can't help but hate achievements because all they have done is hurt gaming. Someone shouldn't get rewarded for doing something. Just doing it is it's own reward.

Gotta say I really do like the changes and feel they have worked well. The game is fun and less tiresome on the weeklies while still a challenge in higher content. The changes are certainly time savers.

 

I certainly cant sit back and let the companion do it without death on the heroics, so I do have to do most of the work, but with far less risk of death and saving time doing the missions (with the exception of early level worlds).

 

The heroic that killed my Merc BH last week, didn't do so today, but if I hadn't been taking an active roll and paying attention, it'd have still been death city, so good stuff.

 

I have not tried SF Heroic solo yet, but then I only managed to do this once with buffs when the companions were fully overpowered, so I don't expect it to be any better...maybe i'll get lucky again or now that my companion influence and alliance rating are better I will actually find it easier. I'll have to wait and see.

Edited November 25, 2015 by Ferretfur

Great changes, Swtor is now just as it should be.

I was more on the "the companions are OP" side and actually submitted a bugreport about it on the first day 4.0 hit. But I also agreed that last week's nerf had been too strong. With yesterday's adjustment, I tested a couple of Heroics on Hoth, Voss and Star Fortresses (tank spec, item level ~200, healing companion influence 20, no alliance buff). Things have become easy again, but this time with a good feel.

 

The current dfficulty is something I can live with, easy enough to make the inevitable grind not too tedious but not to the point that it feels like a visual novel.

I was more on the "the companions are OP" side and actually submitted a bugreport about it on the first day 4.0 hit. But I also agreed that last week's nerf had been too strong. With yesterday's adjustment, I tested a couple of Heroics on Hoth, Voss and Star Fortresses (tank spec, item level ~200, healing companion influence 20, no alliance buff). Things have become easy again, but this time with a good feel.

 

The current dfficulty is something I can live with, easy enough to make the inevitable grind not too tedious but not to the point that it feels like a visual novel.

 

This ^. Can't agree more.

Pets n EQ2 were similar for Necros and Conjies. Thing is, even in WoW you had to do things to keep that pet alive such as heal it (if I remember correctly) so you sttil had to engage actively in the encounter...if I remember correctly. My issue was that they had become more than pets. Yes not in every encounter but in a majority, it was possible for it to be a largely passive experience here. I have never seen that before and hope to never see it again.

 

Well, you're not recalling correctly, they are designed to kill mobs just like a weapon, but there is a reason for this...they are designed as a pet class.

 

Early on in the game pets were weak, but they were strengthened later through various patches and changes. it is the main weapon in the demonologist arsenal.

 

Now, note, those classes are specifically designed to depend on pets, and players know and accept this for the most part. This game on the other hand is NOT designed this way, so having the companions OP after having them in a supporting role for three years was likely a shock for some folks.

I like the current changes to the companions, it was a good compromise. You can't make everyone happy all the time but this went a long way to closing the gaps for me from both viewpoints. I thought they were OP before but then thought they were too weak and made doing the H2's tedious. Now I think they are a good in the middle balance.

 

Still need the tanks shield fixed though, they still seem like they don't have a shield on in tank mode. 0.0% shield and absorption chance.

So, the fact that people started soloing Heroic 2's like crazy came as a surprise? Well, in any case, it's good that the developers decided to encourage it.

Companions are OP once again... Nar Shaddaa's H2's with a tank companion playing a rushing heal sage with almost no downtime and with a healer companion playing a tank vanguard with absolutely no downtime.

 

Healers once again deal a good bit of damage because they've nothing else to do.

 

I haven't tried the DPS companion still, but the healer one is the most important, and it's too efficient when paired with a tank. As it is now, the best solo combo seems be tank spec with mostly DPS gear and heal companion... quite wrong, it reminds me of some pre-2.0 juggernaut/guardian twisted PvP gameplay.

 

There has to be something done for Marauders/Sentinels (and perhaps Assassins/Shadows) considering how brittle they are, and healer companions rebuff wasn't the right fix.

 

As a side note, it should be accounted what I like the most PvE-wise is solo hard encounters playing a tank where there's little margin of error. I don't care if it takes a long time as long as the reward itself is worth it (but that's an issue right now... no really valuable craft means little rewards are worth "working" on a solo fight).

Edited November 25, 2015 by JMCH

So, the fact that people started soloing Heroic 2's like crazy came as a surprise? Well, in any case, it's good that the developers decided to encourage it.

 

From release of this game in 2011. I was soloing H2's all the time all you had to do was gear your companion and keep them geared while you leveled. This was before heroic moment and all that stuff. So not sure what the issue is. And now the devs are saying H2 means 2 fighters and they consider your companion one of those. It should be easy with your companion as you are meeting that requirement. Now doing them solo is more of the challenge.

Edited November 25, 2015 by SGMRock

Well, you're not recalling correctly, they are designed to kill mobs just like a weapon, but there is a reason for this...they are designed as a pet class.

 

Early on in the game pets were weak, but they were strengthened later through various patches and changes. it is the main weapon in the demonologist arsenal.

 

Now, note, those classes are specifically designed to depend on pets, and players know and accept this for the most part. This game on the other hand is NOT designed this way, so having the companions OP after having them in a supporting role for three years was likely a shock for some folks.

 

Yes I know they are weapons BUT (and I spent all night research... yeah I am like that... even had a friend on west coast time log in and go to level and gear appropriate solo mobs to test. If necessary experiment will be repeated and frapped, then linked).

 

When I say passive I am not engaging in hyperbole. I do not mean "well just have to hit one maybe 2 or three buttons." Maybe a funnel here, drain life there. I am not saying this at all. What I am saying is that in NO game, WoW included, could you do the following (again take below as literal, not hyperbole...

 

navigate to GROUP of mobs (especially when they had tougher mobs amoung them like our silvers and golds)>target mob>hit "pet/companion" attack button>stand up leave room>come back minutes later and collect loot while looking at two full health bars

 

and have it work on a consistent basis. YES the bulk of a Warlock/Necro/Conjie's damage comes from the pets but they are not a passive experience like that until you have it VERY over geared (if your pets stats are based on your level) or have it over leveled. Could you do it with an single "normal" mob? Maybe two? Yes. BUT that is not the experience the the Heroic missions provide is it? Rarely groups of less than 3 and regardless of group size there is always more than just "normal" mobs in it.

I'm sorry to say I wish you did lower them. I'm a healer for most if not all my chars or toon. So when you guy increase the healing it leaves me out of job when in groups. I had people BOOST about their compain healing better then me in Hard mode and what not. Because of that getting in to them is harder. I have not gotton back to hardmodes because of that. With noob players not ever playing HM before saying a compain can do better then you. Well that hurts. I hope you guys can fix things up as I rather be the one healing then some NPC.