I am sure there is post on this but the 4 pages I looked through had nothing on it.

Basically I am a balance sage and the change in making our dots not cleansable really had no impact on my dps.

Just a matter of reapplying them. I just think think the lack of cleansing in pvp has disrupted the game play.

I also heal and being able to cleanse dots off other players is part of being a healer. I know some dots can be removed but the way it was worked well imo.

Just a thought and to be honest I waiting for servers to come back online but this has been on my mind for awhile now. Its not super big deal.

I think resolve is prob a issue that needs to be fixed first but I am not holding my breath on that one.

I love being chain stunned.

...because DoTs are the only thing you can cleanse. NOT

I love my balance Shadow and most dot specs in this game. However, I will say I do think dots should be cleansable by healers. Im fine with it having to be up the healing skill tree to cleanse the dots of dotspecs. So in otherwords, change the perc so that the dots aren't persay unlceansable, but that they have a perk that makes them unlceansible unless they are cleansed by someone with the appropriate healer perc to cleansing. This would keep dot specs strong and increase sage healer demand since only they can cleanse force dots, and keep skill required for both sides. now I would have to watch to makes sure my dots haven't just been wiped, and the healer would have to also be on point with cleansing my dots.

Having dots cleansable just makes them a casual regs class. As soon as healers are around it guts their damage so they would be useless against premades. They will wreck casuals but be worthless against a team with half a clue.

 

You would have to increase the cooldown on cleanse but then all this stun/cclocking that a low cd cleanse is meant to partly counter would be even worse.

Edited August 21, 2014 by Tellenn

I agree. I kinda supported madness cleanse immunity back when it was underpowered for both sorcs and sins...but both of those specs are now very strong.

 

It doesn't make sense that a tech healer can "purge" force dots with dodge fairly regularly, but the force healer can't do so except with barrier. I can see why some don't want opposing madness sorcs to be able to cleanse each other's dots (even though I think that's fine), but heal spec should definitely be able to.

 

Dps sorcs can still cleanse whirlwinds (very useful), and heals can also cleanse physical effects like slows and roots, so it would be wrong to say that madness cleanse immunity = sorc cleanse useless. But I think it needs to be able to more than it can right now.

Edited August 21, 2014 by JediMasterSLC

Having dots cleansable just makes them a casual regs class. As soon as healers are around it guts their damage so they would be useless against premades. They will wreck casuals but be worthless against a team with half a clue.

 

You would have to increase the cooldown on cleanse but then all this stun/cclocking that a low cd cleanse is meant to partly counter would be even worse.

 

1) They will only get cleansed if the other team has a sorc. 1/8 classes being able to counter your damage output isn't something worth worrying so much about.

 

2. If cleansability = "worthless against a team with half a clue", why was madness sorc popular in 4s even before it got uncleansability?

 

3. Yeah actually, I would be totally fine with a longer cleanse CD. Yes, cleansing is a counter to CC, but rarely is there a time when your allies are CCd (and by this I mean mezzed, as hard stuns are usually not worth cleansing) twice within 5 seconds of each other.

Edited August 21, 2014 by JediMasterSLC

Cleansing order in swtor is applied based, I believe (based off force crush, which never comes off if your cleanse target is oblit slowed + crush slowed). Both Madness specs have plenty to cover their mind crush/crushing darkness. Force slow, affliction, rippling force, discharge dot, severe force + root. Covering dots is part of playing a dot class.

 

They should have made Pyschic Absorption lower the cooldown of mind crush and severed force by half if they become cleansed and purged (meaning evasion/resil also) instead of making force dispel almost useless. That would probably be too strong however with the upcoming sorc/sage buffs. Unfortunately this leaves the game in a state where cleansing doesn't mean that much. Dispel speed should be a huge part of people's game, especially healers. Most the time cleansing is a waste of a global.

3. Yeah actually, I would be totally fine with a longer cleanse CD. Yes, cleansing is a counter to CC, but rarely is there a time when your allies are CCd (and by this I mean mezzed, as hard stuns are usually not worth cleansing) twice within 5 seconds of each other.

 

Mez CC is really weak, because all the mezs have ridiculously long cooldowns compared to break.

 

Globals are also slow. 6-8 seconds of mez CC is like 4-5 globals. Take away the global the person used to CC and that's only like 3-4 globals gained for your team by CCing someone who doesn't have break up. Also assuming the target isn't dotted, randomly attacked or accidently AoEd; all of which happens a lot more than things being cleansed.

Mez CC is really weak, because all the mezs have ridiculously long cooldowns compared to break.

 

Globals are also slow. 6-8 seconds of mez CC is like 4-5 globals. Take away the global the person used to CC and that's only like 3-4 globals gained for your team by CCing someone who doesn't have break up. Also assuming the target isn't dotted, randomly attacked or accidently AoEd; all of which happens a lot more than things being cleansed.

 

Wat. Mezz CD is 1 minute. Break is 2 minutes. Mezzes are really strong. You obviously don't even 4s.

I am sure there is post on this but the 4 pages I looked through had nothing on it.

Basically I am a balance sage and the change in making our dots not cleansable really had no impact on my dps.

Just a matter of reapplying them. I just think think the lack of cleansing in pvp has disrupted the game play.

I also heal and being able to cleanse dots off other players is part of being a healer. I know some dots can be removed but the way it was worked well imo.

Just a thought and to be honest I waiting for servers to come back online but this has been on my mind for awhile now. Its not super big deal.

I think resolve is prob a issue that needs to be fixed first but I am not holding my breath on that one.

I love being chain stunned.

 

I some what agree that sorc healers needs to be able to purge effects, considering that ops healers do this every 20-30 secs, but making all effects clean-sable is not good. Annihilation, which already sucks, becomes 100% garbage with removing cleanse immunity. Madness will also suffer significantly in damage output if crushing darkness is clean-sable. Same goes for creeping terror for some extent considering it has a 9 sec CD.

2. If cleansability = "worthless against a team with half a clue", why was madness sorc popular in 4s even before it got uncleansability?

 

Get real... It wasn't popular, it was simply the only viable Sorc spec...

Get real... It wasn't popular, it was simply the only viable Sorc spec...

 

More popular than other 2 sorc specs, madness sin, pyro pt, full tank pt, all 3 merc specs, MM and eng sniper, conc and leth op, anni mara, veng and rage jug. But yeah, not popular.

actually dot is damage over time it is actually same as any damage just it is gradually instead of burst damage

so if you can cleanse it , it wouldnt be a damage wont it ?

Lethality style cleanse protection was better implemented. Then you can play with the remainder dot's damage to find a good balance.

Quit qq'ing....uncleansable for both force and tech DOTs are what needed for Meta

Having dots cleansable just makes them a casual regs class. As soon as healers are around it guts their damage so they would be useless against premades. They will wreck casuals but be worthless against a team with half a clue.

 

You would have to increase the cooldown on cleanse but then all this stun/cclocking that a low cd cleanse is meant to partly counter would be even worse.

 

Stoopid, you get two Os for that pile of crap you spewed.

 

Casuals get wrecked by noncasuals all the time, premade or not it happens, stop justifying your ****tiness and reliance on stealth and a broken game mechanic because you can't hack it with any other method.

More popular than other 2 sorc specs, madness sin, pyro pt, full tank pt, all 3 merc specs, MM and eng sniper, conc and leth op, anni mara, veng and rage jug. But yeah, not popular.

That is barely more than half of the advanced classes. Clearly Madness Sorcs were what you scraped off of the bottom of the barrel.

Remove DoT immunity, gut this braindead tanktunnel meta (dot tank, cc heals, hardstun tank, tunnel tank, profit.. and you can still pull this off without DoT immunity, if you cc healer! at least the pressure will be much lower, if the healer can keep up with cleansing) or the even dumber tabdotting of everyone that seems to be popular on some servers, where it is all about DoTs and sin tanks and pretty much lame teams, no tactics, and utter lack of any cc skill.

That is barely more than half of the advanced classes. Clearly Madness Sorcs were what you scraped off of the bottom of the barrel.

 

If you're counting mirrors, sure. Otherwise I think you need to go back and learn some math skills.

If you're counting mirrors, sure. Otherwise I think you need to go back and learn some math skills.

Sarcasm, sarcasm.

Uncleasable dots are generally a mistake. To be honest, it mostly just promotes a lower-skill style of play. Even the "dot classes" aren't getting all the damage from dots. Besides the dot classes generally have other features that give them viability.

 

I also hope that they bring cleanse back, besides just for mez. Additionally, I'm hoping the next patch brings some offensive purging.. which is something this game is seriously missing.

There are issues with the way cleanse and dots work in swtor compared to other games.

 

Cleanse is on a very low cd and needs to be as status effects are a big part of pve.

Dots provide little other than damage.

 

Generally cleanse cannot be spammed in pvp games as it is such an easy way to counter a huge chunk of a dot classes damage.

Also dots tend to provide more than damage so the idea of covering status effects particularly heal debuffs, that arent present in swtor, is usually a big part of the meta between healers and dot classes.

 

Swtor pvp is extremely simplistic compared to a lot of games. So instead of increasing the complexity of the game between dot classes and healers they opted to just remove it.

 

If for instance sever had a heal debuff there would be a reason to cover the dot and for healers to cleanse through to it. Otherwise it justs simple high damage mitigation for a healer to spam.

 

Spam cleansing can also devote some classes with aoe dots to dot coverage and they would become essential in groups.

Edited August 22, 2014 by Tellenn

2. If cleansability = "worthless against a team with half a clue", why was madness sorc popular in 4s even before it got uncleansability?

 

Because nobody used Sorc healer...

Because nobody used Sorc healer...

 

Not really. Even when I would run again other teams using a Madness Sorc it would create a little counter play against each other. Go ahead and waste a cleanse on my dots and leave your healer vulnerable to a WW that you can't cleanse anymore.(Cooldown)

 

Regardless, the ability to cleanse only adds DEPTH. If Bioware wanted to provide counters they could have in other ways instead of just dumbing down the combat system.

Edited August 23, 2014 by Xeraz

Because nobody used Sorc healer...

 

But DPS sorcs could cleanse them too...