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Return Veteran's Edge stacks to NIM Raids

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > General Discussion
Return Veteran's Edge stacks to NIM Raids

Ergecrs's Avatar


Ergecrs
02.21.2020 , 07:31 AM | #91
Here is what they need to do. Run a weekly or monthly NIM raid no stacks for the hardcore raiders. Kinda like a NIM power but it would change each week or month. This would make both camps happy and give those that want to progress on harder nim the chance and those learning the mechanics the chance. Win win.

FerkWork's Avatar


FerkWork
02.21.2020 , 09:53 AM | #92
Quote: Originally Posted by Ollmich View Post
Of course it wouldnít satisfy everyone. On the other hand, we would have more control over our stats, could trade one for another in certain encounters, wouldnít be forced to use ****** relics, etc. Nim crystals would be a thing (Iím not sure if they work in scaled content and havenít seen any reports about it). Or people would just wait for new augments and tiers of gear knowing that itíll help them to clear content they couldnít handle before.


Yeah, I wouldnít mind nims having stack and no-stack options. Raids with stacks could become a good training ground since the gap between hms and nims is now bigger than ever. Removing stacks from hms won't solve the problem because in 5.x. the difference was huge as well. They can gate chievos and shinies behind the harder option, or add new ones for completing it.
It would just be the same relative difficulty as stats control doesnít matter since we gear the same and just the relative numbers would go up. Same people would pass and same people would fail so from a dev perspective probable not going to. Still would have to equal the difficulty as it is now. NiM crystals already work and override downscaling aspect if anyone needing a boost. Personally I donít mind if it not scaled as that means I donít have to buy the newest augments. And another key point is I think as you mentioned people want it scaled up so we can eventually over gear it just like 248, new augments, and 258 gear to trivialize the content again. Iím personally fine leaving as is or make it 75 but no new gear tiers to cheap it out. So I donít see the fascination with making it 75 other than wanting to wait for new gear tiers to make it a joke again.

AwesomeTacoCat's Avatar


AwesomeTacoCat
02.21.2020 , 10:17 AM | #93
Quote: Originally Posted by Aulus_Claudius View Post
No-stackers: Want NiM content to be hard again. For them, it's about what they want from the game in an objective sense, detached from the people and community playing it. Arguments are about the idea behind what NiM is supposed to be and how it was when it came out.

Stackers: Want NiM to be played. For them, it's about the community that's developed around NiM and the accessibility for people who want to get into NiM and learn the mechanics without facing overly-daunting DPS and HPS checks. Many in this camp actually enjoy the harder content without stacks, but for them it's more important that they have other people to play with at all and can raid more than just 2-3 evenings per week with their main group.
This is a good summation I suppose. But the ďno stackerĒ group doesnít seem to recognize that cutting off like 70%+ of the 6.0 NiM raiding community from doing NiM content means that many of these people will just stop playing all together. And they can rant on all they want about ďgit gudĒ but a game with no players is probably not for the best.

Can people truly be sufficiently ignorant so as to not see that?

Rion_Starkiller's Avatar


Rion_Starkiller
02.21.2020 , 10:31 AM | #94
Quote: Originally Posted by FerkWork View Post
If they did bump to 75, I hope everyone bought new augments for all their toons as they will be needed. Also, if they did raise to 75 and make it as hard as without stacks, will people still complain or will they accept like they are saying if itís raised to 75? Cause ironically it will be at the very least more expensive to do the legacy raids.
Huh? We have Dxun gear, no?
-Beruhl (ง︡'-'︠)ง

8 pugs and a grophet i do what i want can i borrow a stim?
Quote: Originally Posted by Trolltar View Post
I believe he's quoting a frequent contributor to these forums. His name is Strawman.
Quote: Originally Posted by Lunafox View Post
Thanks Rion Starbrah.

FerkWork's Avatar


FerkWork
02.21.2020 , 10:35 AM | #95
Quote: Originally Posted by Rion_Starkiller View Post
Huh? We have Dxun gear, no?
I assume they would tune NiM to 306 at 75 so we couldnít just over gear it. Also, if we get future gear it would make it a joke again.

Rion_Starkiller's Avatar


Rion_Starkiller
02.21.2020 , 10:41 AM | #96
IDK, I might be out of touch on the expense of augments. I craft my own -- it's a pain, but worth it. Though blue augs are stupid easy to craft.
-Beruhl (ง︡'-'︠)ง

8 pugs and a grophet i do what i want can i borrow a stim?
Quote: Originally Posted by Trolltar View Post
I believe he's quoting a frequent contributor to these forums. His name is Strawman.
Quote: Originally Posted by Lunafox View Post
Thanks Rion Starbrah.

FerkWork's Avatar


FerkWork
02.21.2020 , 11:14 AM | #97
Quote: Originally Posted by Rion_Starkiller View Post
IDK, I might be out of touch on the expense of augments. I craft my own -- it's a pain, but worth it. Though blue augs are stupid easy to craft.
It has zero effect on me either as I have more than enough credits to gear anything and all, itís more of a case I hope people understand what they are wishing for if they want all it be bumped up.

Ollmich's Avatar


Ollmich
02.21.2020 , 11:33 AM | #98
Quote: Originally Posted by FerkWork View Post
It would just be the same relative difficulty as stats control doesnít matter since we gear the same and just the relative numbers would go up. Same people would pass and same people would fail so from a dev perspective probable not going to. Still would have to equal the difficulty as it is now. NiM crystals already work and override downscaling aspect if anyone needing a boost. Personally I donít mind if it not scaled as that means I donít have to buy the newest augments. And another key point is I think as you mentioned people want it scaled up so we can eventually over gear it just like 248, new augments, and 258 gear to trivialize the content again. Iím personally fine leaving as is or make it 75 but no new gear tiers to cheap it out. So I donít see the fascination with making it 75 other than wanting to wait for new gear tiers to make it a joke again.
Thanks for info on crystals.

As for stats, I've been in encounters where tank made a difference when replaced some of their gear with skank pieces. One can hope

And I know it's a tired argument but if you want old raids being for you the same in terms of difficulty despite new gear being introduced, you can choose not to spend a fortune or lots of time getting it, same as you did with 286 augments. You didn't need those to clear Dxun, right? So why bother at all?

My initial point was a bit different though. I haven't said "BWA has to scale content asap ", I've said "BWA could have avoided this whole argument if they scaled content 4 months ago". I'd still prefer endgame content being scaled properly (there're plenty of reasons, convenience being one of them) but it's too late already. Damage is done.

robertthebard's Avatar


robertthebard
02.21.2020 , 02:02 PM | #99
Quote: Originally Posted by Ollmich View Post
Thanks for info on crystals.

As for stats, I've been in encounters where tank made a difference when replaced some of their gear with skank pieces. One can hope

And I know it's a tired argument but if you want old raids being for you the same in terms of difficulty despite new gear being introduced, you can choose not to spend a fortune or lots of time getting it, same as you did with current gold augments. You didn't need those to clear Dxun, right? So why bother at all?

My initial point was a bit different though. I haven't said "BWA has to scale content asap ", I've said "BWA could have avoided this whole argument if they scaled content 4 months ago". I'd still prefer endgame content being scaled properly (there're plenty of reasons, convenience being one of them) but it's too late already. Damage is done.
Just a guess, but maybe they figured the hardcore raiders would follow the carrot, instead of camping content that's 20 levels beneath them? It's possible that they didn't cap all the raids because they wanted raids for people to practice on in level ranges. Oricon was endgame, once upon a time, but no longer. Running it 20 levels above what it was designed for, of course it's going to be easy, and bolster doesn't do enough to prevent overpowering the content, neither does level syncing, for that matter. That's what's so boggling for me, this "but these raids all need to be hard", or "these raids all need to be capped" arguments sort of fall flat, because they don't.

Wanting hard is great, truly. So are the new raids, that are designed with current character power in mind, too easy too, or is it a case of "but someone might pull a mount that they didn't "earn""? There's some reason the hardcore raiders are sticking to years past relevant content, I wonder what that is? Because if BW and the little council they had on the PTS were basing "it's way too easy" on irrelevant content, there's an even bigger issue here than some stacks being added or removed. I say this because I would hope that true progression raiders find 5+ year old, 20 levels below the cap raids too easy. That's the whole point to progression raiding...
Quote: Originally Posted by Transcendent View Post
Also, just a small point. Why should anyone who plays this game exclusively for any particular type of content, have to run a different type of content just to earn gear? What is that attitude all about?

ottffsse's Avatar


ottffsse
02.21.2020 , 02:33 PM | #100
timed runs should be restricted to running the ops without stacks of veteran's edge.

I guess they need to enable an "option" to allow vet edge stacks in those ops...but if you do that option to do a timed run will be disabled and no chievo.

I am only talking here about timed run achievements, not individual boss kill or anything else achievements- because teams have to practice the content and disable stacks for the timed run attempt when they think they are ready.
ref http://www.swtor.com/r/gFbhFZ Melisen / Sage Zrella / Sorc