Different classes are still different, and you're not taking into account Jug/Mara mobility and mobile damage, as well as heavier armor, and completely different class mechanics.

 

This is really just silly.

 

My Powertech only has a 25% damage reduction on a 2 minute cd for defensive cooldowns. You don't hear me complaining about the Sorc bubble, OR Mara nigh-invincibility.

 

Of course I am brotha! Or else I wouldn't be posting. In FACT jugg/mara mobility actually counts as NEGATIVE points to their dmg, because they are melee characters who get cc'd all the time lol. Heavy armor stops a lil bit of dmg but it's nothing to write home about, when lightning is slowing you to a crawl and stopping you from doing ANY dmg whatsoever. And the biggest thing that I forgot to mention. After twelve seconds my saber ward is gone. So if i get cc'd while in it and I am still out of melee range it's not sticking around after it times out.

 

Your billy bubble on the other hand is sticking around for a good long time so it's fresh and ready to go when i eventually make it to you. That is a MAJOR difference and why the bubb has such an advantage. Surely you can agree with me on that issue?

Edited February 15, 2012 by Dregas

Yeah, because I should totally value and cherish feedback from people that call other people stupid when they don't know the difference between 2 AC, and then talk about "math" and equations and crap.

 

Here is an equation.

 

His statement where he claimed sent/maraduers had jug/sw abilities is = to me saying that sage/sorc have stealth then using that in an argument about game balance.

 

Whatever though. I am sure he is raging so hard atm thatt he is spamming the report button at this moment.

 

I could care less what you or he thinks of me. The last thing I need is some self proclaimed genius who calls other people stupid (when he is the epitome of the word) to be my buddy in a video game forum.

 

You still have not showed where I claimed that a jugg is the same as a maurader.. I have asked you 3 times, yet you keep claiming it.

 

I mentioned ONE jugg ability before I forgot to separate it from the 2 lists I was forming and somehow that means I dont know the difference between the 2? Please look up the definition of a logical fallacy.

All I heard was "wah wah wah" Sorcerers are not imbalanced, I have killed them many times on my powertech. If they feel overpowered to you maybe you should look at your own build and check for a flaw there. They are fine the way they are.

when lightning is slowing you to a crawl and stopping you from doing ANY dmg whatsoever.

 

Oh, you mean the lightning that they have to stand still to channel? I can still crawl faster than someone not moving.

 

I'd rather fight a sorc on my sentinel than a healspec commando/merc.

A) it is very possible that our bubble is up 1 second out of every 17 which means it is up 5% of the time.

 

 

 

It is a scalable 25% damage reduction that you are not even mention (vs force). Meaning the more force users attacking you the more it absorbs. This is not even taken into account the 50% defense...

 

Yours is still better.

 

It is also possible that in a 10 second fight you will have two bubbles available.

 

It is also possible that in that timeframe you will throw another bubble on another player (which is the best instant heal in the game as there are no offensive dispels).

 

Stop making yourself look worse.

 

You are comparing an instant heal that can be casted on other players with a short cooldown and that does NOT enforce a cooldown when it breaks (only when it is casted, which cane be before a fight), with a 3 minute defensive cooldown.

 

A better comparison would be rebuke, but you prob don't even know what that is, which is why when I pop it and destroy people like you, you keep damaging me or put a dot on me to refresh it for 30 seconds, instead of using a CC on me and making me the softest target in the game after it wears off.

 

But whatever. You are a GENIUS and a fantastic mathematician, even though like most higher math you are not based on empiricism whatsoever, but you will find that out later...

Edited February 15, 2012 by biowareftw

All I heard was "wah wah wah" Sorcerers are not imbalanced, I have killed them many times on my powertech. If they feel overpowered to you maybe you should look at your own build and check for a flaw there. They are fine the way they are.

 

There you go guys. Tatami kills them all the time, so obviously nothing is wrong and we all just suck. I really wish i had such leet skillz...

 

Lmao don't post responses like this. C'mon now

Market the good part in red. Fully agree on this. OP Made a very good analysis of the problem. I ahve yet to see a good counter-argument with as much research behind it

 

Lmao your joking right? Come on he flat out bull ***** his so called facts.

Sorc can not do the dmg of other ie any class . All other classes have more dps.

Sorcs get high wz numbers by using a skill I wish they didt have , spam aoe lightening, and chain when its insta.

 

Iv played the spec , iv played all the specs on my sorc , i don't play my sorc much now as its a supper class. Not a dps class.

It is also possible that in a 10 second fight you will have two bubbles available.

ONLY if you were able to cast it 7 or more seconds before the fight..... Which means for more then 7 seconds out of the fight I am doing NO DAMAGE.

 

It is also possible that in that timeframe you will throw another bubble on another player (which is the best instant heal in the game as there are no offensive dispels).

In which I am still not doing any damage, and have to be in a group fight being targeted down.

Stop making yourself look worse.

dont worry I am not

You are comparing an instant heal that can be casted on other players with a short cooldown and that does NOT enforce a cooldown when it breaks, with a 3 minute defensive cooldown.

Yes that scales better then mine..

 

A better comparison would be rebuke, but you prob don't even know what that is, which is why when I pop it and destroy people like you, you keep damaging me or put a dot on me to refresh it for 30 seconds, instead of using a CC on me and making me the softest target in the game after it wears off.

I know what rebuke is, just makes my argument stronger.

 

But whatever. You are a GENIUS and a fantastic mathematician, even though like most higher math you are not based on empiricism whatsoever, but you will find that out later...

 

 

Actually everything I do is based on empirical data, I am a computer scientist, not a mathematician. I have to deal with both theoretical and empirical data. I also never claimed to be a genius.

Edited February 15, 2012 by Lormif

Lmao your joking right? Come on he flat out bull ***** his so called facts.

Sorc can not do the dmg of other ie any class . All other classes have more dps.

Sorcs get high wz numbers by using a skill I wish they didt have , spam aoe lightening, and chain when its insta.

 

Iv played the spec , iv played all the specs on my sorc , i don't play my sorc much now as its a supper class. Not a dps class.

 

The only way a hybrid spec sorc has less single target dps then other specs is if they aren't using their procs...

 

Add to that? Multidotting.

 

Or are you talking about burst...If so add rolling dots to the lower burst on procs and compare it in the timeframe of a normal pvp fight with a class that has higher burst.

 

Add to that passive dmg that those higher burst classes don't have and realistic uptime (melee vs ranged).

 

But yeah sorc/sages are so bad they are the most rerolled spec (just like they were in beta), and more and more reroll them every day. Because they are super challenging and super bad.

 

What a crock.

Yeah, because I should totally value and cherish feedback from people that call other people stupid when they don't know the difference between 2 AC's, and then talk about "math" and equations and crap.

 

Here is an equation.

 

His statement where he claimed sent/maraduers had jug/sw abilities is = to me saying that sage/sorc have stealth then using that in an argument about game balance.

 

Whatever though. I am sure he is raging so hard atm that he is spamming the report button at this moment.

 

I could care less what you or he thinks of me. The last thing I need is some self proclaimed genius who calls other people stupid (when he is the epitome of the word) to be my buddy in a video game forum, and thinks they are somehow good at this game because they are playing the most stupidly OP range class I have ever beta tested or played in an MMO.

 

I would take my WotLK Frost or Arcane mages over a SWTOR Sorc any day of the week.

 

Massive control AND controlled burst on top of high mobility.

 

Hybrid sorc is crap compared to a good frost mage.

 

Part of the reason I rolled sorc was because I wanted to be caster dps. Most of the reason that I no longer play my sorc is because they are mostly a support class, w/ some AoE dps capability.

Edited February 15, 2012 by Varicite

The only way a hybrid spec sorc has less single target dps then other specs is if they aren't using their procs...

 

Add to that? Multidotting.

 

Or are you talking about burst...If so add rolling dots to the lower burst on procs and compare it in the timeframe of a normal pvp fight with a class that has higher burst.

 

Add to that passive dmg that those higher burst classes don't have and realistic uptime (melee vs ranged).

 

But yeah sorc/sages are so bad they are the most rerolled spec (just like they were in beta), and more and more reroll them every day. Because they are super challenging and super bad.

 

What a crock.

 

Even with dots our burst is still crap compared to others, it is only because we can sustain damage that we can get the high overall numbers in WZs, unless you mean that we can do large amounts at one time because we can do it to multiple damage, but I am sure you know that is not what is meant by burst.

ONLY if you were able to cast it 7 or more seconds before the fight..... Which means for more then 7 seconds out of the fight I am doing NO DAMAGE.

 

 

In which I am still not doing any damage, and have to be in a group fight being targeted down.

 

dont worry I am not

 

Yes that scales better then mine..

 

 

I know what rebuke is, just makes my argument stronger.

 

 

 

 

Actually everything I do is based on empirical data, I am a computer scientist, not a mathematician. I have to deal with both theoretical and empirical data. I also never claimed to be a genius.

 

Do you instantly teleport to someone when you die or do you put a bubble on and another is available during an enemy engagement.

 

How are you not doing any dmg by using a instant cast spell...Are you forced to stand in place and do nothing? The 3 minute cooldown is on the global timer as well.

 

I don't even...You know what? You win. 3 min cooldowns that can't be prepped and used back to back or put on other people are better then one that can.

 

Perfect logic. So are you suggesting that marauders/sents be given the shield and you get our 3 min cooldown?

 

DONE. Make a new thread supporting this idea. I will put a /support on it and laugh as all the other sorc/sages call you an idiot lol.

Edited February 15, 2012 by biowareftw

But yeah sorc/sages are so bad they are the most rerolled spec (just like they were in beta), and more and more reroll them every day. Because they are super challenging and super bad.

 

What a crock.

 

I'm also curious where you're getting this data from, or is this just your anecdotal observation?

Do you instantly teleport to someone when you die or do you put a bubble on and another is available during an enemy engagement.

 

How are you not doing any dmg by using a instant cast spell...Are you forced to stand in place and do nothing?

 

I don't even...You know what? You win. 3 min cooldowns that can't be prepped and used back to back or put on other people are better then one that can.

 

Perfect logic.

 

Why do you keep talking about theoretical, since you hate it so much, especially in a thread where the OP is talking about our ability to survive, now you are going to throw a curve and just mention when you die?

 

Do you know of this thing called the global cooldown, or how about having to target then re-acquire your previous target?

 

Dude you are like the most illogical person I have spoken to and that means a lot.

I'm also curious where you're getting this data from, or is this just your anecdotal observation?

 

That is all they have..

 

well in this single situation the sorc dies/runs away

 

So in these situations pretty much everyone kills them

 

soo in this other single situation they do X y and z

I'm also curious where you're getting this data from, or is this just your anecdotal observation?

 

Log on to any mature high pop non pve or rp realm (who have classes that are more balanced due to raiding and buffs/not wanting to share loot on a few AC's). Make a level 10 character and go in a warzone.

 

Use simple arithmetic.

 

I also give classes called how to tell your @#$ from a hole in the ground and why you should never %#$@ into the wind.

Edited February 15, 2012 by biowareftw

when people learn to focus sorc bubble will mean little. % damage reduction reduction is better against skilled opponents, bubble its better against pugs.

Log on to any mature high pop non pve or rp realm (who have classes that are more balanced due to raiding and buffs/not wanting to share loot on a few AC's). Make a level 10 character and go in a warzone.

 

Use simple arithmetic.

 

I also give classes called how to tell your @#$ from a hole in the ground and why you should never %#$@ into the wind.

 

yes simple arithmetic for a game that started out with a LARGE population of sorcs/sages... I have a feeling there is more to it then you are letting on.

Dear Sorcs and Sages,

 

Please play a lvl 50, BM geared heal Ops and marvel at all the broken talents and sub-standard healing/damage compared to your sorc/sage.

 

Then consider that every patch has massive nerfs for agents.

 

I have played both sides of the fence and it is glaringly apparent that Sage/Sorcs are superior in every way by a massive amount. Better healing, better damage, better mobility, better utility, etc etc.

 

But you wouldn't know that, to busy owning in TOR and asking for more agent nerfs...right?

 

Sorc Wars FTW.

Dear Sorcs and Sages,

 

Please play a lvl 50, BM geared heal Ops and marvel at all the broken talents and sub-standard healing/damage compared to your sorc/sage.

 

Then consider that every patch has massive nerfs for agents.

 

I have played both sides of the fence and it is glaringly apparent that Sage/Sorcs are superior in every way by a massive amount. Better healing, better damage, better mobility, better utility, etc etc.

 

But you wouldn't know that, to busy owning in TOR and asking for more agent nerfs...right?

 

Sorc Wars FTW.

 

I have seen every class do well. Might just be you.

Log on to any mature high pop non pve or rp realm (who have classes that are more balanced due to raiding and buffs/not wanting to share loot on a few AC's). Make a level 10 character and go in a warzone.

 

Use simple arithmetic.

 

I also give classes called how to tell your @#$ from a hole in the ground and why you should never %#$@ into the wind.

 

So then yes, it is based completely on anecdotal observation, then.

 

"I saw X Sorcs when I went into these warzones on my server, thus it is like that for all warzones on all servers for everyone."

 

Gotcha.

Edited February 15, 2012 by Varicite

I have seen every class do well. Might just be you.

 

no u.....

I have seen every class do well. Might just be you.

 

Oh you've 'seen' other classes. How about play em?

 

At 50, btw. None this 10-49 crap.

 

Unlike most, I play both classes and have come to the solid conclusion that sorc/sage is easily 2x better at healing than a heal ops. Plus sage/sorcs don't have broken core talents nor do they get nerfed every patch.

 

But you wouldn't know this; to busy insulting me instead.

Edited February 15, 2012 by fixit

Oh you've 'seen' other classes. How about play em?

 

At 50, btw. None this 10-49 crap.

 

Unlike most, I play both classes and have come to the solid conclusion that sorc/sage is easily 2x better at healing than a heal ops. Plus sage/sorcs don't have broken core talents nor do they get nerfed every patch.

 

But you wouldn't know this; to busy insulting me instead.

 

So wait, we have to play all the classes to know when they do well? that is fairly illogical.

Oh you've 'seen' other classes. How about play em?

 

At 50, btw. None this 10-49 crap.

 

Unlike most, I play both classes and have come to the solid conclusion that sorc/sage is easily 2x better at healing than a heal ops. Plus sage/sorcs don't have broken core talents nor do they get nerfed every patch.

 

But you wouldn't know this; to busy insulting me instead.

 

You do realize that this thread is not at all about healing Sorcs, right?

 

I understand that you're still upset about the agent nerfs, but take your issues to a thread about agent nerfs, or sorc healing.

 

This is about 0/23/18 spec'd hybrid Sorcs. Believe me, these guys are not outhealing your heal-spec'd Operative.