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Unbelievable. Even Worse Than The Prequels!!!!

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > General Discussion > Off-Topic
Unbelievable. Even Worse Than The Prequels!!!!

JediMasterAlex's Avatar


JediMasterAlex
04.26.2014 , 05:53 AM | #21
Quote: Originally Posted by OddballEasyEight View Post
Well there are several rasons:
1: there are no movies currently planned set in that era.
2: there IS, however, an active game taking place in said era
3: that game (SW:TOR) is designed, run and owned by EA which has the current rights to all star wars games for the next 10 years.

That would increase the chances of it being considered canon.
Besides, they are actually sorting the EU stuff into canon and non-canon right now and I don't see any practical reason for throwing out any of the Old Republic era stuff as non-canon (unless it directly influences the next movies).
Again, I do hope that you're right, and I agree with you that it seems likely. But in theory, it could easily go either way. Until they pronounce upon it, we still don't know.

DarthCasus's Avatar


DarthCasus
04.26.2014 , 06:22 AM | #22
Am I the only person that loved the prequels? They got me into Star Wars in the first place :\ But on topic, I figured that even when the new movies were ushered in, fans would just go about their business and stick to what they preferred.

I mean the post RotJ was decent but I never could take it seriously compared to the more established story and lore in the movies. I went in to the comics/books and video games knowing that the stories can easily be cast aside and redone, so the fact that people are still surprised and or pissed is odd. I'm not really bothered by it.

Now, if they go out of their way to mess with the Old Republic Era..
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PLynkes's Avatar


PLynkes
04.26.2014 , 06:43 AM | #23
For me Star Wars is three films I watched as a little kid in the 70s and 80s. All the rest of it could vanish tomorrow and I would hardly notice. In fact I would celebrate, at least regarding those turds George Lucas released around the turn of the millenium.

I like SWTOR, but it's just a computer game. A piece of ephemeral fun, not a thing of substance. Pain, anger and betrayal? Over whether the backstories of some video games and the money-grubbing spin-off industry of fan fiction and crappy toys that has accumulated around some old movies are canon or not?

LOL, what a stupid thing to get worked up about.

yunharla's Avatar


yunharla
04.26.2014 , 06:53 AM | #24
Lots of plagiarism coming down the road.

Reno_Tarshil's Avatar


Reno_Tarshil
04.26.2014 , 06:58 AM | #25
Actually Revan is canon because he was going to appear in an episode of the Clone Wars which is considered movie canon.
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Darth-Obvious's Avatar


Darth-Obvious
04.26.2014 , 06:58 AM | #26
It's insane to ever think they were going to keep the EU in tact with the upcoming movies.

Did people not learn their lesson last time around with the prequels? For instance remind me, before the prequels came out it was established that Bobba Fett was a clone of another bounty hunter who's DNA was used to create a clone army right? I mean Fett didn't have a completely different backstory prior to the prequels did he?

Anyways, the biggest (and most important) reason they are doing this is because you/they can not expect the average person (movie goer, etc) to have kept up with 30+ years of additional stories. There's also no way you could explain the things that would need to be explained without the movie(s) becoming insanely exposition heavy. The movies aren't being made for the hardcore SW fans, they're being made to appeal to the largest possible audience.

How do you go about explaining stuff like...

- Han & Leia got married, and had 3 kids.
- Luke got married and had a son.
- Han & Leia's youngest died in a war.
- Han & Leia's oldest son went darkside and killed Luke's wife
- Chewie is dead

...without it seeming completely insane, confusing, or stupid? Note in those events described above their are 5 characters created for the EU that the average person has no clue about, and of those 5 half of them are dead.

And don't say "well stuff like Chewie dying is stupid and they shouldn't adhere to that part of the EU." because once you say that the same logic can then be applied to the entirety of the EU, ie that it's all stupid, not needed, etc.

Chances are that they won't have a had a ton of stuff happen between 6 and 7 just to make it that much easier on themselves and people who have only ever seen just the movies. Like I imagine that between 6 and 7 there will have been as many conflicts/wars as their are in the books. I'd say that it's more likely that they'll state that the galaxy slowly became more peaceful after the Battle of Endor just so that they don't need to explain 30 years of conflicts like EU portrays.

GrimAce's Avatar


GrimAce
04.26.2014 , 07:08 AM | #27
Did anyone honestly expect the EU to remain canon with Episode VII already being confirmed as being set right in the middle of an existing arc? 30 ears after Endor is, IIRC right in the middle of the Yuuzhan Vong war. It's been clear for a while that they were going to discard EU canon and rebuild it with a clearer, more cohesive vision. Anyone who thought otherwise was honestly either deluding themselves or just plain not paying enough attention.

And you know what? I'm happy about this. REALLY happy. I've been a Star Wars fan since I was seven. I've admined a Star Wars roleplaying board for 6 years, and been a member and contributor since its inception 9 years ago. I've read so many Wookieepedia articles, so many EU sources that it's not funny, and I'm not even a fraction of the way through all the material that's been published over the years. And I've come to really hate just how bad the EU is in some areas.

As much as we harp on about how great the EU is, the truth of the matter is it is not cohesive - it's a jumble of stories mashed together in an attempt to create a semblance of a larger universe. Major retcons run rampant through the EU, and material has been decanonized or had certain facts edited countless times by Leland Chee in a noble but vain attempt to create a single cohesive universe and timeline. And most of the material is just plain bad. I'm sorry, but it's true. You may like aspects of it, and hate others, but to anyone familiar with the EU it is indisputably clear that authors were pretty much given free reign to write whatever they wanted once they were contracted, with little to no input, guidance or factchecking from George Lucas, LFL or anyone else for that matter - hence the need for Leland Chee to make retroactive changes to the continuity - or retcons.

The Legends series will live on, and rebranding it also hints that these titles will be republished as well, which is actually really exciting for me, as it means I'll be able to pick up some of the much older series again. This is giving the franchise a much needed opportunity for some spring cleaning - and may I just say, it's about bloody time too.
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wilsonstone's Avatar


wilsonstone
04.26.2014 , 08:04 AM | #28
Quote: Originally Posted by Korithras View Post
No words can describe the amount of pain, betrayal and anger I feel right now towards Lucasfilm for this.

http://www.technobuffalo.com/2014/04...-is-non-canon/
Wow...and I thought Star Trek fans were obsessed.
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DawnAskham's Avatar


DawnAskham
04.26.2014 , 08:15 AM | #29
Quote: Originally Posted by PLynkes View Post
For me Star Wars is three films I watched as a little kid in the 70s and 80s. All the rest of it could vanish tomorrow and I would hardly notice. In fact I would celebrate, at least regarding those turds George Lucas released around the turn of the millenium.

I like SWTOR, but it's just a computer game. A piece of ephemeral fun, not a thing of substance. Pain, anger and betrayal? Over whether the backstories of some video games and the money-grubbing spin-off industry of fan fiction and crappy toys that has accumulated around some old movies are canon or not?

LOL, what a stupid thing to get worked up about.
QFT

To me, the only thing that matters with regard to Star Wars material is 'Is it interesting and entertaining'. If it is, I'll spend some of my money and enjoy it for what it is. If it isn't, I'll just ignore it.

I really don't give a crap whether some story set in the SW universe is included in some giant Galactic Lore Nerd Bible or not. It just doesn't matter.

And honestly, I think giving the writers of the new movies the freedom to explore and develop SW stories without being tied to old stories written by second rate pulp fiction writers is the best approach, and one that provides the best chance for the new movies to succeed on their own.

RandomXChance's Avatar


RandomXChance
04.26.2014 , 10:01 AM | #30
Quote: Originally Posted by GrimAce View Post
Did anyone honestly expect the EU to remain canon with Episode VII already being confirmed as being set right in the middle of an existing arc? 30 ears after Endor is, IIRC right in the middle of the Yuuzhan Vong war. It's been clear for a while that they were going to discard EU canon and rebuild it with a clearer, more cohesive vision. Anyone who thought otherwise was honestly either deluding themselves or just plain not paying enough attention.

And you know what? I'm happy about this. REALLY happy. I've been a Star Wars fan since I was seven. I've admined a Star Wars roleplaying board for 6 years, and been a member and contributor since its inception 9 years ago. I've read so many Wookieepedia articles, so many EU sources that it's not funny, and I'm not even a fraction of the way through all the material that's been published over the years. And I've come to really hate just how bad the EU is in some areas.


As much as we harp on about how great the EU is, the truth of the matter is it is not cohesive - it's a jumble of stories mashed together in an attempt to create a semblance of a larger universe. Major retcons run rampant through the EU, and material has been decanonized or had certain facts edited countless times by Leland Chee in a noble but vain attempt to create a single cohesive universe and timeline. And most of the material is just plain bad. I'm sorry, but it's true. You may like aspects of it, and hate others, but to anyone familiar with the EU it is indisputably clear that authors were pretty much given free reign to write whatever they wanted once they were contracted, with little to no input, guidance or factchecking from George Lucas, LFL or anyone else for that matter - hence the need for Leland Chee to make retroactive changes to the continuity - or retcons.

The Legends series will live on, and rebranding it also hints that these titles will be republished as well, which is actually really exciting for me, as it means I'll be able to pick up some of the much older series again. This is giving the franchise a much needed opportunity for some spring cleaning - and may I just say, it's about bloody time too.
Out of the four or five threads going on the subject, this is the most clear and comprehensive post I have seen.

People have talked for years about the three levels of canon. (It can get more complicated, but keep it simplified)
Top Level full canon: ONLY works made directly by Lucas
Standard EU canon: The good stuff of the third parties that was well done and fit
Non-Canon: a lot of garbage