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Why are people complaining about bombers?


MrWoolie

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Is it because they or new?

 

The most powerful and easiest ship to fly is still the quarrel/mangler.

 

I have personally flown all the ship types, and on a scale of versatility, potential, and easiness to fly, the dronelayer (the one that is supposedly op) would rank third at best in my opinion.

 

My gunship can:

1.Destroy all mines and drones around a satellite with 1 or 2 shots or ion rail.

2. Disable all the enemy fighters in the area of effect with ion rail.

3. Kill enemy fighters if they are below half health with ion rail even though this is an ion weapon.

4. Equip BLC (Why do they even have the best close range cannon?)

5. Equip distortion field w/ light armor

6. Equip barrel roll (arguably the best engine component, tied with retro thrusters, which offers offensive capabilities since it can give extra lock on and fire time.)

 

While my Flashfire (2nd most useful ship):

1. Has enough fire power to take out a strike on the first joust.

2. Can clean up all defenders around a satellite unless they are a minelayer.

3. Can equip the best close range cannons, shields, engine component, system component, missiles/secondary.

4. Has harmony among all the major and miner components

 

In truth, when I first got my dronelayer, I didn't actually think my drones would take down anyone. Since the default missile drone is only really effective within 5km, I thought people would just boost out, or blow up the drone pre-preemptively. I was wrong.

 

For those saying that drones are OP, please consider that:

The missile drone in fact does not have enough power to kill you at full health by itself before running out of power. The laser does around 200 damage each, and the drone depletes its reserves in a couple of shots with a slow regen. While you can kill the drone without making hardly a dent in your energy pool. (If it does kill you, you have probably made a second go at it into its range or you are previously damaged)

 

The Rail gun drone cannot do a full hull hit due to the CD between shots. With the final tier upgrade, at best it will catch your shields during regen if you have not spec into a quicker shield regen. The part that kills you is the 20% penetration. On average, this will take 4 or 5 shots to take you down at full health by itself. This can be up to 30 seconds unless you are also receiving damage from another source.

 

So what that all the drones are updated with the latest version of iOSWallHack? They can only shoot you through solid objects if you were targeted by them previously, while you are still in range, and it only works for one shot most of the time. (Although I do agree that this is a bit cheap and should be fixed ASAP)

 

Drones have 1 minute cool downs. Once it is gone, the bomber can't put out another one until the CD ends.

 

The part where the drones are OP is when there are more than one bomber putting out multiple drones. Or when you were previously fighting another craft, and it caught you and your shield regen by surprise. Ether way, it is often not just one bomber that can cause your ship to explode more often than you can do theirs.

 

Also, mines die in one laser bolt, the only problem I encountered with them is when a mine layer put them in secluded areas underneath a sat, and force you to trip one of if you shoot the other.

 

The only reason I can think of that give bombers a large or unfair advantage are caused by their bugs. Drones can shoot you through walls if you failed to find cover before being targeted. And mines may still deal damage even after you shot them down.

 

If I have missed anything that could make bombers overpowered. Pleas enlighten me, since I fly a bomber as well, and would love to learn some new tricks.

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Good point, but then again, the bomber is calling reinforcements. If you see them coming, and if your team is competent, you can call your own.

 

However, the only asset bombers have against ion rail gunships is their large shield and hull pool, because Ion rail is capable of taking out all the mines and drones with its AOE damage.

 

The purpose of bombers is to guard a node. They aren't actually good in anything else, although, I did kill a couple of scouts and GS with my heavy laser cannons. They never expect it from a bomber. Bombers' lack of an evasive maneuver forces them to be a brick and soak up the damage to get the team extra time before the node is contested.

 

They really shine when they get a buddy, preferably another bomber or a GS to help them. One is easy to handle, but 2 can really cause some troubles even if you bring 2 players from your team, especially if they are close ranged fighters. This is due to that the minelayer can instantly drop two mines that will finish off most ships caught in the explosive. With 2, that is twice the mines. Other than that, I simply don't find them much of a problem to deal with on my other ships.

 

Take out their drones and mines with 1 shot each. They can't really defend themselves.

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My advice to anyone starting out is to get a minelayer asap. My first dozen games in strike fighters and scouts was an unhappy experience. I used cc, transferred ship req to get a minelayer and they are truly superb at holding satellites. Skimming the surface in random orbits and hiding mines LoS behind fins makes them so hard to dig out. I drop a hyperspace beacon a safe distance away and can hold my own until the opposing team gets p'd off and bring their gunships to the party.

However, minelayers are not as useful in TDM, I switch to my drone carrier with its seeker and missile drones to either protect our gunships or surround an existing hyperspace beacon, so our team has a forward bastion to spawn from.

A bombers main weakness is a highly skilled and upgraded fighter/scout. Something that can take the damage from mines, or boost away. Another issue i've found recently, premades seem to have a suicide member who will fly into my concussion mines, pull the seekers, then suicides against a sat or wall. There should be a kill awarded to the person who caused the most damage in this case (my opinion at least)

A full team of average to pro players in scout/fighters will always beat a less experienced team with GS and bombers, that's what I have deduced.

The pew pew brigade with their scouts and fighters don't understand that it takes a lot of skill to shoot another skilled player down using GS and by taking out the drones/mines, you pull the teeth from the bombers. Every fighter wants to be top of the board, shooting down drones instead makes that less likely. GSF suffers as much as anywhere from lack of team play.

Edited by Kane_Ren
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The OP has it nailed right. Sure, bombers can be hard to dislodge from a node but so can a tank from a node in ground PvP. Not a perfect analogy but the roles are similar.

 

And if you get two bombers together or a bomber and a gunship in a nest, that can be tough too. But other ships working in tandem can too.

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Any others want to opine on the OP's post? I'd like to see you try to refute his points. They're well-taken in my book and experience.

 

I can't speak for others, but my experience is that once bombers take a node, if that side is competent at all and actually defends it instead of leaving the bomber alone, it's very, very hard to take back. Basically you need at least 2:1 odds (a fighter to harass the bomber and a Gunship to pick off the defenses and bomber itself).

 

Even in badly balanced matches one side usually caps and holds a node because it's too hard to take it back from bombers. it just simply takes too long and is too much effort, so no one bothers. It makes Dom very frustrating and boring.

Edited by ptwonline
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Is it because they or new?

 

The most powerful and easiest ship to fly is still the quarrel/mangler.

 

I have personally flown all the ship types, and on a scale of versatility, potential, and easiness to fly, the dronelayer (the one that is supposedly op) would rank third at best in my opinion.

 

My gunship can:

1.Destroy all mines and drones around a satellite with 1 or 2 shots or ion rail.

2. Disable all the enemy fighters in the area of effect with ion rail.

3. Kill enemy fighters if they are below half health with ion rail even though this is an ion weapon.

4. Equip BLC (Why do they even have the best close range cannon?)

5. Equip distortion field w/ light armor

6. Equip barrel roll (arguably the best engine component, tied with retro thrusters, which offers offensive capabilities since it can give extra lock on and fire time.)

 

While my Flashfire (2nd most useful ship):

1. Has enough fire power to take out a strike on the first joust.

2. Can clean up all defenders around a satellite unless they are a minelayer.

3. Can equip the best close range cannons, shields, engine component, system component, missiles/secondary.

4. Has harmony among all the major and miner components

 

In truth, when I first got my dronelayer, I didn't actually think my drones would take down anyone. Since the default missile drone is only really effective within 5km, I thought people would just boost out, or blow up the drone pre-preemptively. I was wrong.

 

For those saying that drones are OP, please consider that:

The missile drone in fact does not have enough power to kill you at full health by itself before running out of power. The laser does around 200 damage each, and the drone depletes its reserves in a couple of shots with a slow regen. While you can kill the drone without making hardly a dent in your energy pool. (If it does kill you, you have probably made a second go at it into its range or you are previously damaged)

 

The Rail gun drone cannot do a full hull hit due to the CD between shots. With the final tier upgrade, at best it will catch your shields during regen if you have not spec into a quicker shield regen. The part that kills you is the 20% penetration. On average, this will take 4 or 5 shots to take you down at full health by itself. This can be up to 30 seconds unless you are also receiving damage from another source.

 

So what that all the drones are updated with the latest version of iOSWallHack? They can only shoot you through solid objects if you were targeted by them previously, while you are still in range, and it only works for one shot most of the time. (Although I do agree that this is a bit cheap and should be fixed ASAP)

 

Drones have 1 minute cool downs. Once it is gone, the bomber can't put out another one until the CD ends.

 

The part where the drones are OP is when there are more than one bomber putting out multiple drones. Or when you were previously fighting another craft, and it caught you and your shield regen by surprise. Ether way, it is often not just one bomber that can cause your ship to explode more often than you can do theirs.

 

Also, mines die in one laser bolt, the only problem I encountered with them is when a mine layer put them in secluded areas underneath a sat, and force you to trip one of if you shoot the other.

 

The only reason I can think of that give bombers a large or unfair advantage are caused by their bugs. Drones can shoot you through walls if you failed to find cover before being targeted. And mines may still deal damage even after you shot them down.

 

If I have missed anything that could make bombers overpowered. Pleas enlighten me, since I fly a bomber as well, and would love to learn some new tricks.

 

I think it all depends on the skill level one has when flying one of those things. You most likely played some dogfighting games before (the better ones almost always have). So have I, and lemme tell ya - I SHRED gunships in my Warcarrier. XD While y'all are busy with the drones and mines? I'm comin' out of goal to blast you in the face!

 

I think what you're hearing in this instance is a lot of first-timers whining about actual skill displayed by other pilots in gunnies and bombers. But the LoS issue with automated turrets DOES need to be addressed, if only because it's not fair.

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I think what you're hearing in this instance is a lot of first-timers whining about actual skill displayed by other pilots in gunnies and bombers. But the LoS issue with automated turrets DOES need to be addressed, if only because it's not fair.

 

Do you agree with the OP that the LOS issue is not great but somewhat limited? You have to be in range, then move out of LOS for the railgn or missile shot to go through solid objects. I've noted the same thing with some extreme range shots on my sniper in PvP. Fire the shot, the enemy goes around the corner and it boomerangs around the corner to hit them. Admittedly, that's an instant shot on my sniper, as opposed to a cast time shot.

 

I do think the drones and mines inside of walls needs to be fixed.

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For those saying that Bomber utilities are too hard to peel, I do not think they are going at it the right way.

 

Their main weakness is that they cannot handle any damage, and can be destroyed without much effort.

The strength is that they have power in numbers. If you kill drone A, drone B or Mine A may damage you.

 

The obvious way to do it, is of course use ion rail or EMP weapons. They are AOE, and can effectively shut down a drone or some mines for the sake of capping a satellite. You can ether chose to purposely put yourself at somewhat of a disadvantage by taking them out one by one, or use a long range weapon or AOE component to set them off all at once.

 

What many people also do not consider is that EMP shuts down system component as well. Essentially, this mean that the minelayer can only drop one more mine. One isn't going to kill you. While the drone layer is basically screwed. (Neither can break missile locks as well). In both cases, your craft is still the superior fighter, and a bomber's only hope now is their teammates, which, you could also bring your own.

 

However, reinforcement isn't OP. Anyone can get them. When a bomber have their precious drones or mines disabled, they are more of a liability than an asset to their team. In which case, you have just turned the tables and gave your team the advantage in taking the node.

 

I think the correct Statement would be: Bombers are more difficult to peel off a node than any other ship types.

 

Which, after all, is what they are designed for.

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This is kind of why I would like to be able to reequip my ships components while between spawns, 'in the cap ship hanger' so to speak.

 

I see the value in EMP weaponry for sure, but when I queue up you never know what you are going to get whether its a TDM or a Dom with bombers or without. I think a large part of the reason why we dont see many players employing the EMP's is that they are a rock to bash a very specific pair of scissors and you never know if those scissors are even going to be a factor.

 

Spawn component change will mean that if you have a situation where a Bomber or two is guarding a sat, or set up a screen for GS's in TDM you can refit and get back in the fight to tip the scales.

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This is kind of why I would like to be able to reequip my ships components while between spawns, 'in the cap ship hanger' so to speak.

 

I see the value in EMP weaponry for sure, but when I queue up you never know what you are going to get whether its a TDM or a Dom with bombers or without. I think a large part of the reason why we don't see many players employing the EMP's is that they are a rock to bash a very specific pair of scissors and you never know if those scissors are even going to be a factor.

 

Spawn component change will mean that if you have a situation where a Bomber or two is guarding a sat, or set up a screen for GS's in TDM you can refit and get back in the fight to tip the scales.

 

I run an Alt with two scouts, one fitted with EMP for clearing drones from nodes, one fitted with Burst lasers for close-in dogfighting. Depending on what I see the other-side deploying determines which of the two craft I run.

 

As for the bomber issue, well yeah they guard nodes incredibly well, thats the whole point of their existence, defend nodes and use drones to support their allies. Take them away from fighter support however, well then its just a duck shoot...

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However, minelayers are not as useful in TDM, I switch to my drone carrier with its seeker and missile drones to either protect our gunships or surround an existing hyperspace beacon, so our team has a forward bastion to spawn from.

 

Be careful with this strategy. It's very easy to get the "You are not contributing" message. Been there, done that, have the t-shirt.

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